5 ms·

It's a clever concept, but I'm leery of having someone send a letter on my behalf to someone. You all haven't trademarked the idea, have you? I think I'll jus

It's a clever concept, but I'm leery of having someone send a letter on my behalf to someone. You all haven't trademarked the idea, have you? I think I'll just write a few of these up myself and send them out.

jagged-chisel 2y ago
> I'm leery of having someone send a letter on my behalf to someone. Agreed. I don’t know what other junk mail will be included, nor how my recipient’s data will be used.
- dheera 2y ago
  Yep. I definitely don't really like friends handing my residential address to third parties to mail me stuff without my consent. They can mail me stuff directly if they want though.
  - ada1981 2y ago
    Like sending you gifts via Amazon? Or exposing your address when then send any mail at all? Your address is public record this seems like not something you need to concerned about.
    - ryandrake 2y ago
      I honestly feel a little creeped out when someone gives out my address to Amazon without my consent, even if it is to send me a gift. Even though Amazon already has my address, this feels different somehow and crosses a small boundary.
      - dumbfounder 2y ago
        I don’t feel creeped out at all. Please send gifts. But if you think someone might feel weird, the name you use doesn’t need to be real. I send my stepmom things addressed as Nana. You can also use random dumb names like Birthday Boy Dave or Donkey Face Smith.
      - DonHopkins 2y ago
        Unsolicited gifts from a big mega-corps like Amazon are creepy, while unsolicited gifts from small businesses like Bad Dragon are cool.
        dheera 2y ago
        I feel the reverse, actually. Small businesses probably store personal info in a random Excel file on someone's USB drive and are much more likely to have a data leak that actual bad guys can get a hold of. Amazon is a big mega-corp but their database security is decent and random employees can't just access it for no reason, and doing so would likely leave a trail.
    - leetcrew 2y ago
      sure, name and address aren't worth much alone. but they get more valuable if you can associate other bits of information with them. surprising insights can be gained by joining a bunch of seemingly innocuous facts about a person. usually this just means they see more relevant ads, but occasionally it leads to being targeted for scams and other nasty things. the tinfoil hat probably isn't warranted in this case, but as a general principle, I try to let my friends make their own decisions around privacy.
    - dheera 2y ago
      > Your address is public record No they are not. I don't know why you and people keep telling me this. You can try to look up my address and if you're doing it on the internet with some stupid private, non-governmental institutions and data brokers that collected data without my consent, you're likely to only find a bunch of addresses associated with my name that are NOT actually where I live.
- CamelCaseName 2y ago
  or... maybe this is just a fun side project they whipped up as a joke? Some side project for a resume? Just look at OP's comment history, one example: > I absolutely love making chrome extensions - my very first one was creating an extension for tinder.com that would swipe left on anyone with the first name Chad All they require here is your name and email, and the recipient's name and address. Both are (probably) public somewhere and in combination are almost certainly still worthless (or certainly worth less than the postage they're giving to you for free)
  - collingreen 2y ago
    Why not just make a pdf or a copy paste version? I get suspicious when extra work is done to make worse ux; my assumption is that it rarely happens without a hidden incentive.
    - kijin 2y ago
      I think part of the package is the official-looking envelope from the LLP, transparent window and all. It won't have the same effect if you just download a PDF, print it out, and mail it in a generic envelope with a handwritten address on it.
      - collingreen 2y ago
        Fair enough, although I'd love to see that as an upsell instead.
        krisoft 2y ago
        I'm not sure if they changed it after your comment, but right now there is clearly two options. One where you can get a google doc and just use theirs as a template, and one where they send it for you.
        adnanaga 2y ago
        Yes! We added it in later so people could make their own!
FloorEgg 2y ago
Trademarked the idea? I don't think that word means what you think it means... I'm not OP, and I'm no lawyer, but I'm sure you're free to try this concept for yourself. Three ways to protect IP Trademark is for logos and names Parents are for methods and inventions Copyright is for works of art and writing They might be able to trademark the phrase "continue and persist", but it's not likely. If they had they would have put a little TM or (r) next to it. It's not sufficiently original to qualify for copyright protection. And it's so far from being patentable I hope I don't have to explain why.
- jagged-chisel 2y ago
  In the US: - a trademark may be claimed with TM even if not registered. A trademark registered with, and accepted by, USPTO should use circle R. - these folks hold the copyright on their specific letter. Avoid infringement (and potential negative legal ramifications) by not reproducing their letter. This is not limited to photocopying a physical paper. Retyping verbatim will infringe. - the concept itself cannot be protected with existing (US) intellectual property law.
  - cyanmagenta 2y ago
    To complete the legal analysis a bit more rigorously, mostly because I’m drunk and bored on Thanksgiving: - The service name “continue and persist” is probably trademarkable by them if they wanted (assuming it’s not already in use). And as you point out, formal registration wouldn’t be necessary, although it does come with various benefits. Doing so could block someone from creating a similar service with the same or confusingly similar name. - For copyright, reproduction doesn’t have to be verbatim to infringe. The standard is typically substantial similarity. So you couldn’t just change a few words here or there in the letter. - Publicly disclosed concepts can be protected under US law, but you have to go through patent law. Haven’t done a prior art search, but seems unlikely that there’s much patentable here. There is also the section 101 (abstract idea) issue, but that is hard to evaluate without looking at the exact patent claims at issue.
- thayne 2y ago
  > And it's so far from being patentable I hope I don't have to explain why. I would say the same thing about a lot of things the USPTO has handed out patents for. At this point, it wouldn't surprise me if someone could obtain a patent for this, if the patent application was written the right way. Whether such a patent would hold up in court is an entirely different question.
thayne 2y ago
Also, I don't actually have a physical mailing addresses for people I would like to send something like this to, like maintainers for my favorite open source projects.
- oneeyedpigeon 2y ago
  True, this service doesn't solve every one of humanity's problems. But even if you just get inspired to do something similar by email, or however else you can contact a maintainer, then it's had some success for you.
- zvr 2y ago
  Express your support for Free Software maintainers and contributors by participating in the "I Love Free Software" Day: https://fsfe.org/activities/ilovefs/index.en.html https://fsfe.org/activities/ilovefs/index.en.html
akoboldfrying 2y ago
Good idea. Elsewhere in the comments, user kynetic mentioned that their terms include: > We may share Your information with Our business partners to offer You certain products, services or promotions. Which somewhat takes the shine off this in my opinion. (That, and also: How hard is it to post a letter yourself?)

jagged-chisel 2y ago

> I'm leery of having someone send a letter on my behalf to someone. Agreed. I don’t know what other junk mail will be included, nor how my recipient’s data will be used.

dheera 2y ago
Yep. I definitely don't really like friends handing my residential address to third parties to mail me stuff without my consent. They can mail me stuff directly if they want though.
- ada1981 2y ago
  Like sending you gifts via Amazon? Or exposing your address when then send any mail at all? Your address is public record this seems like not something you need to concerned about.
  - ryandrake 2y ago
    I honestly feel a little creeped out when someone gives out my address to Amazon without my consent, even if it is to send me a gift. Even though Amazon already has my address, this feels different somehow and crosses a small boundary.
    - dumbfounder 2y ago
      I don’t feel creeped out at all. Please send gifts. But if you think someone might feel weird, the name you use doesn’t need to be real. I send my stepmom things addressed as Nana. You can also use random dumb names like Birthday Boy Dave or Donkey Face Smith.
    - DonHopkins 2y ago
      Unsolicited gifts from a big mega-corps like Amazon are creepy, while unsolicited gifts from small businesses like Bad Dragon are cool.
      - dheera 2y ago
        I feel the reverse, actually. Small businesses probably store personal info in a random Excel file on someone's USB drive and are much more likely to have a data leak that actual bad guys can get a hold of. Amazon is a big mega-corp but their database security is decent and random employees can't just access it for no reason, and doing so would likely leave a trail.
  - leetcrew 2y ago
    sure, name and address aren't worth much alone. but they get more valuable if you can associate other bits of information with them. surprising insights can be gained by joining a bunch of seemingly innocuous facts about a person. usually this just means they see more relevant ads, but occasionally it leads to being targeted for scams and other nasty things. the tinfoil hat probably isn't warranted in this case, but as a general principle, I try to let my friends make their own decisions around privacy.
  - dheera 2y ago
    > Your address is public record No they are not. I don't know why you and people keep telling me this. You can try to look up my address and if you're doing it on the internet with some stupid private, non-governmental institutions and data brokers that collected data without my consent, you're likely to only find a bunch of addresses associated with my name that are NOT actually where I live.
CamelCaseName 2y ago
or... maybe this is just a fun side project they whipped up as a joke? Some side project for a resume? Just look at OP's comment history, one example: > I absolutely love making chrome extensions - my very first one was creating an extension for tinder.com that would swipe left on anyone with the first name Chad All they require here is your name and email, and the recipient's name and address. Both are (probably) public somewhere and in combination are almost certainly still worthless (or certainly worth less than the postage they're giving to you for free)
- collingreen 2y ago
  Why not just make a pdf or a copy paste version? I get suspicious when extra work is done to make worse ux; my assumption is that it rarely happens without a hidden incentive.
  - kijin 2y ago
    I think part of the package is the official-looking envelope from the LLP, transparent window and all. It won't have the same effect if you just download a PDF, print it out, and mail it in a generic envelope with a handwritten address on it.
    - collingreen 2y ago
      Fair enough, although I'd love to see that as an upsell instead.
      - krisoft 2y ago
        I'm not sure if they changed it after your comment, but right now there is clearly two options. One where you can get a google doc and just use theirs as a template, and one where they send it for you.
        adnanaga 2y ago
        Yes! We added it in later so people could make their own!

FloorEgg 2y ago

Trademarked the idea? I don't think that word means what you think it means... I'm not OP, and I'm no lawyer, but I'm sure you're free to try this concept for yourself. Three ways to protect IP Trademark is for logos and names Parents are for methods and inventions Copyright is for works of art and writing They might be able to trademark the phrase "continue and persist", but it's not likely. If they had they would have put a little TM or (r) next to it. It's not sufficiently original to qualify for copyright protection. And it's so far from being patentable I hope I don't have to explain why.

jagged-chisel 2y ago
In the US: - a trademark may be claimed with TM even if not registered. A trademark registered with, and accepted by, USPTO should use circle R. - these folks hold the copyright on their specific letter. Avoid infringement (and potential negative legal ramifications) by not reproducing their letter. This is not limited to photocopying a physical paper. Retyping verbatim will infringe. - the concept itself cannot be protected with existing (US) intellectual property law.
- cyanmagenta 2y ago
  To complete the legal analysis a bit more rigorously, mostly because I’m drunk and bored on Thanksgiving: - The service name “continue and persist” is probably trademarkable by them if they wanted (assuming it’s not already in use). And as you point out, formal registration wouldn’t be necessary, although it does come with various benefits. Doing so could block someone from creating a similar service with the same or confusingly similar name. - For copyright, reproduction doesn’t have to be verbatim to infringe. The standard is typically substantial similarity. So you couldn’t just change a few words here or there in the letter. - Publicly disclosed concepts can be protected under US law, but you have to go through patent law. Haven’t done a prior art search, but seems unlikely that there’s much patentable here. There is also the section 101 (abstract idea) issue, but that is hard to evaluate without looking at the exact patent claims at issue.
thayne 2y ago
> And it's so far from being patentable I hope I don't have to explain why. I would say the same thing about a lot of things the USPTO has handed out patents for. At this point, it wouldn't surprise me if someone could obtain a patent for this, if the patent application was written the right way. Whether such a patent would hold up in court is an entirely different question.

thayne 2y ago

Also, I don't actually have a physical mailing addresses for people I would like to send something like this to, like maintainers for my favorite open source projects.

oneeyedpigeon 2y ago
True, this service doesn't solve every one of humanity's problems. But even if you just get inspired to do something similar by email, or however else you can contact a maintainer, then it's had some success for you.
zvr 2y ago
Express your support for Free Software maintainers and contributors by participating in the "I Love Free Software" Day: https://fsfe.org/activities/ilovefs/index.en.html https://fsfe.org/activities/ilovefs/index.en.html

akoboldfrying 2y ago

Good idea. Elsewhere in the comments, user kynetic mentioned that their terms include: > We may share Your information with Our business partners to offer You certain products, services or promotions. Which somewhat takes the shine off this in my opinion. (That, and also: How hard is it to post a letter yourself?)