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> Arnsten recounted walking in the woods in Vermont, when suddenly along the path, a bear appeared in front of her. Luckily, the bear was facing the other way.

> Arnsten recounted walking in the woods in Vermont, when suddenly along the path, a bear appeared in front of her. Luckily, the bear was facing the other way. Rather than consciously reasoning that most mammals lack a ventral stream, and therefore would not be able to recognize a still object, she froze. In this moment of fear, her reflex of freezing was engaged. When the bear turned around, it did not notice her because of her lack of movement, and ended up wandering off. Such a great example of how the fear reflex is functional from a survival perspective. We often talk about how we can combat our fears (e.g. public speaking, dancing, etc) and this serves as a good reminder how this primitive response serves a purpose.

guerrilla 2y ago
> Such a great example of how the fear reflex is functional from a survival perspective. All of our emotions (when we're healthy) are tools. They're all programmable to some extent as well. If somethings not actually dangerous, repeated exposure to it will desensitize you to it, for example.
- bowsamic 2y ago
  > repeated exposure to it will desensitize you to it Not necessarily, as someone who has a difficult anxiety that I have to deal with very often, being exposed to the situation doesn't make me any less fearful of it.
  - digging 2y ago
    I think it's similar to one thing I learned about dog training. If your dog starts freaking out and barking uncontrollably at another dog, because they're afraid, once you get them away there's a sense of relief. "Oh good, I got away. Whatever I did that time definitely worked." It takes an active approach to pierce through anxiety and fear. Repeatedly becoming terrified of something will more likely just make us feel bad, and helpless. Actively perceiving something frightening as tolerable is the kind of exposure that helps.
  - guerrilla 2y ago
    It will if you do it right. I had panic disorder. You probably need to gradually increase the stimulus and set your goals lower. If you're panicking in the situation then you've started at too intense of a level and need to work up to that over time. Don't give up. You can do it. Another key thing a lot of people don't know is that you need good sleep in between stimulus exposures. Also, you probably need a shitload more exposure than you think. Persistence is what will save you.
    - bowsamic 2y ago
      Nope, definitely won't work in my situation (since my fear is actually completely reasonable and well founded)
      - guerrilla 2y ago
        Then why would you try to get rid of it. Fear is a tool that protects us from dangerous situations. If something is actually dangerous, then it would be rational to be afraid of it. It doesn't make any sense whatsoever to desensitize yourself to cobras unless you're literally a herpetologist or snake handler, for example.
        bowsamic 2y ago
        Because even though it’s justified it’s still extremely inconvenient on a day to day level. Basically yes it is like I’m a cobra handler who is scared of cobras
        guerrilla 2y ago
        Snake handlers shouldn't be afraid of cobras though. It's still a risk of course but it's not dangerous in the sense that it's dangerous for a normal person because of their education and experience. They've done the exposure therapy. If your situation isn't actively harming you and is only a risk, then exposure therapy will work.
        2y ago
- coffeebeqn 2y ago
  Even what are healthy emotions is an interesting question. I’m 99% sure my anxiety is work / chronic stress driven largely. It might not be a rational emotion when I’m in my ACd office with snacks and every physical need satisfied.
nradov 2y ago
Arnsten misinterpreted that incident and drew the wrong evolutionary lesson. Black bears (the species in Vermont) aren't particularly aggressive versus other large animals such as humans, and will usually wander off even if they do notice you. The usual advice is not to freeze but to make noise and slowly back away. https://www.dnr.state.mn.us/livingwith_wildlife/bears/encounters.html https://www.dnr.state.mn.us/livingwith_wildlife/bears/encoun... I'm disappointed that an error like that made it through the fact checking process. It makes me doubt the rest of the article.

guerrilla 2y ago

> Such a great example of how the fear reflex is functional from a survival perspective. All of our emotions (when we're healthy) are tools. They're all programmable to some extent as well. If somethings not actually dangerous, repeated exposure to it will desensitize you to it, for example.

bowsamic 2y ago
> repeated exposure to it will desensitize you to it Not necessarily, as someone who has a difficult anxiety that I have to deal with very often, being exposed to the situation doesn't make me any less fearful of it.
- digging 2y ago
  I think it's similar to one thing I learned about dog training. If your dog starts freaking out and barking uncontrollably at another dog, because they're afraid, once you get them away there's a sense of relief. "Oh good, I got away. Whatever I did that time definitely worked." It takes an active approach to pierce through anxiety and fear. Repeatedly becoming terrified of something will more likely just make us feel bad, and helpless. Actively perceiving something frightening as tolerable is the kind of exposure that helps.
- guerrilla 2y ago
  It will if you do it right. I had panic disorder. You probably need to gradually increase the stimulus and set your goals lower. If you're panicking in the situation then you've started at too intense of a level and need to work up to that over time. Don't give up. You can do it. Another key thing a lot of people don't know is that you need good sleep in between stimulus exposures. Also, you probably need a shitload more exposure than you think. Persistence is what will save you.
  - bowsamic 2y ago
    Nope, definitely won't work in my situation (since my fear is actually completely reasonable and well founded)
    - guerrilla 2y ago
      Then why would you try to get rid of it. Fear is a tool that protects us from dangerous situations. If something is actually dangerous, then it would be rational to be afraid of it. It doesn't make any sense whatsoever to desensitize yourself to cobras unless you're literally a herpetologist or snake handler, for example.
      - bowsamic 2y ago
        Because even though it’s justified it’s still extremely inconvenient on a day to day level. Basically yes it is like I’m a cobra handler who is scared of cobras
        guerrilla 2y ago
        Snake handlers shouldn't be afraid of cobras though. It's still a risk of course but it's not dangerous in the sense that it's dangerous for a normal person because of their education and experience. They've done the exposure therapy. If your situation isn't actively harming you and is only a risk, then exposure therapy will work.
        2y ago
coffeebeqn 2y ago
Even what are healthy emotions is an interesting question. I’m 99% sure my anxiety is work / chronic stress driven largely. It might not be a rational emotion when I’m in my ACd office with snacks and every physical need satisfied.

nradov 2y ago

Arnsten misinterpreted that incident and drew the wrong evolutionary lesson. Black bears (the species in Vermont) aren't particularly aggressive versus other large animals such as humans, and will usually wander off even if they do notice you. The usual advice is not to freeze but to make noise and slowly back away. https://www.dnr.state.mn.us/livingwith_wildlife/bears/encounters.html https://www.dnr.state.mn.us/livingwith_wildlife/bears/encoun... I'm disappointed that an error like that made it through the fact checking process. It makes me doubt the rest of the article.