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There's a VW factory making gas vehicles pretty close to Berlin. I sorta understand where they're coming from (Tesla emits ~33 million tons of CO2 equivalent pe

There's a VW factory making gas vehicles pretty close to Berlin. I sorta understand where they're coming from (Tesla emits ~33 million tons of CO2 equivalent per year, and is significantly less efficient than bikes, public transport, or even some motorized vehicles), but this adventurism is at best having little impact, and they didn't really choose their target well.

panick21_ 3y ago
The Berlin eco-leftist all beliefe in nonsense conspiricy nonsense and are very anti-US.
- nemo44x 3y ago
  There's a lot of leftist disruption going on out there but it seems like the politicians only complain of a nonexistent "far right" bogeymen. Seems like endless destruction and defacement of private and public property and rioting, infrastructure sabotage, and disruption to free travel. And all of it justified through a delusional idea of justice or something.
  - ben_w 3y ago
    > complain of a nonexistent "far right" bogeymen And there I was thinking they were complaining about things like this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2023_Potsdam_far-right_meeting https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2023_Potsdam_far-right_meeting Or this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Halemba#Investigation_and_arrest https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Halemba#Investigation_a...
    - nemo44x 3y ago
      That's just speech. There were no actions. Getting together to talk about political action if they were to get democratically elected is a lot different than blowing things up, interfering with travel, and destroying actual property, etc.
      - ben_w 3y ago
        Do you sincerely not understand that planning to break the law is itself illegal? That is literally where we get the meaning of the word "conspire" — to make secret plans jointly to commit an unlawful or harmful act, from latin "to breathe along with". Likewise, second link was about someone getting arrested. And now I'm remembering Sideshow Bob: "Imprisoned for a crime I didn't even commit. Attempted murder. Now honestly, what is that? Do they give a Nobel prize for attempted chemistry, do they?" — that's what you sound like.
        nemo44x 3y ago
        Which laws were broke? A political group had a conversation regarding policy and most attendees agreed it wouldn’t be possible with acquiring more democratically elected power. And even then it may not be viable. There’s nothing wrong with that. The other link is a guy doing Nazi things which is fine in most places although Germany has state controlled speech so it was problematic. But it’s just speech.
        ben_w 3y ago
        Investigations are ongoing, one of the formal accusations is "high treason". You shouldn't expect them to be hasty with this, look how long the investigations of Trump are taking. https://www.berliner-zeitung.de/news/rechtes-treffen-in-potsdam-verfassungsschutz-ueberprueft-landhaus-adlon-li.2182543 https://www.berliner-zeitung.de/news/rechtes-treffen-in-pots... > But it’s just speech. The reason I value freedom of speech, the reason it's even important to protect it, is that there's no "just" about it. All we are as a milieu, personally and globally, is from communication, from sharing ideas rather than reinventing things from scratch ourselves. Martin Luther and Martin Luther King changed the world for the better with "'just' speech" — but it was also "'just' speech" that convinced people to give actual literal Hitler and Pol Pot any power, or even the means to spread their merely human voices more widely and control an entire nation. There's no "just" when it comes to speech. It's what sets us apart from most other animals. It's our superpower… well, that and being able to throw things both hard and accurately. Our two main superpowers…
  - panick21_ 3y ago
    I have to disagree. The waste majority of attacks on people are done by the far right. Its not even close. Property might be closer, but far right still likely ahead. So yes, by any rational metric 'far right' are the actual bogeymen.
enslavedrobot 3y ago
The first Google search hit indicates Tesla emits ~200kMT of CO2 worldwide. Where do you get 150x that number from?
- iamawacko 3y ago
  That's probably just scope 1 emissions, full lifecycle brings it to the number I gave. The specific source was: https://www.theverge.com/2023/4/26/23697746/tesla-climate-pollution-carbon-footprint-supply-chain-report https://www.theverge.com/2023/4/26/23697746/tesla-climate-po...

panick21_ 3y ago

The Berlin eco-leftist all beliefe in nonsense conspiricy nonsense and are very anti-US.

nemo44x 3y ago
There's a lot of leftist disruption going on out there but it seems like the politicians only complain of a nonexistent "far right" bogeymen. Seems like endless destruction and defacement of private and public property and rioting, infrastructure sabotage, and disruption to free travel. And all of it justified through a delusional idea of justice or something.
- ben_w 3y ago
  > complain of a nonexistent "far right" bogeymen And there I was thinking they were complaining about things like this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2023_Potsdam_far-right_meeting https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2023_Potsdam_far-right_meeting Or this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Halemba#Investigation_and_arrest https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Halemba#Investigation_a...
  - nemo44x 3y ago
    That's just speech. There were no actions. Getting together to talk about political action if they were to get democratically elected is a lot different than blowing things up, interfering with travel, and destroying actual property, etc.
    - ben_w 3y ago
      Do you sincerely not understand that planning to break the law is itself illegal? That is literally where we get the meaning of the word "conspire" — to make secret plans jointly to commit an unlawful or harmful act, from latin "to breathe along with". Likewise, second link was about someone getting arrested. And now I'm remembering Sideshow Bob: "Imprisoned for a crime I didn't even commit. Attempted murder. Now honestly, what is that? Do they give a Nobel prize for attempted chemistry, do they?" — that's what you sound like.
      - nemo44x 3y ago
        Which laws were broke? A political group had a conversation regarding policy and most attendees agreed it wouldn’t be possible with acquiring more democratically elected power. And even then it may not be viable. There’s nothing wrong with that. The other link is a guy doing Nazi things which is fine in most places although Germany has state controlled speech so it was problematic. But it’s just speech.
        ben_w 3y ago
        Investigations are ongoing, one of the formal accusations is "high treason". You shouldn't expect them to be hasty with this, look how long the investigations of Trump are taking. https://www.berliner-zeitung.de/news/rechtes-treffen-in-potsdam-verfassungsschutz-ueberprueft-landhaus-adlon-li.2182543 https://www.berliner-zeitung.de/news/rechtes-treffen-in-pots... > But it’s just speech. The reason I value freedom of speech, the reason it's even important to protect it, is that there's no "just" about it. All we are as a milieu, personally and globally, is from communication, from sharing ideas rather than reinventing things from scratch ourselves. Martin Luther and Martin Luther King changed the world for the better with "'just' speech" — but it was also "'just' speech" that convinced people to give actual literal Hitler and Pol Pot any power, or even the means to spread their merely human voices more widely and control an entire nation. There's no "just" when it comes to speech. It's what sets us apart from most other animals. It's our superpower… well, that and being able to throw things both hard and accurately. Our two main superpowers…
- panick21_ 3y ago
  I have to disagree. The waste majority of attacks on people are done by the far right. Its not even close. Property might be closer, but far right still likely ahead. So yes, by any rational metric 'far right' are the actual bogeymen.

enslavedrobot 3y ago

The first Google search hit indicates Tesla emits ~200kMT of CO2 worldwide. Where do you get 150x that number from?

iamawacko 3y ago
That's probably just scope 1 emissions, full lifecycle brings it to the number I gave. The specific source was: https://www.theverge.com/2023/4/26/23697746/tesla-climate-pollution-carbon-footprint-supply-chain-report https://www.theverge.com/2023/4/26/23697746/tesla-climate-po...