6 ms·

If they have nothing to hide they have nothing to fear. I would take the hypothetical fear and pushback by these "types" as a strong positive signal that this

If they have nothing to hide they have nothing to fear. I would take the hypothetical fear and pushback by these "types" as a strong positive signal that this is an effort that is vitally worth doing for society.

dogman144 3y ago
They have to fear swatting. If you’ve got the time and knowledge of where the individual likely lives, a hunting app for instance will show who owns each land plot in clear-text lol.
- wavefunction 3y ago
  Ok but I have to fear that, what's the purpose for different privileges? My info is publicly available.
  - dogman144 3y ago
    If you’ve got the time and effort, it doesn’t have to be. These “extreme privacy” measures are available to the laymen with some time/effort/money, or definitely for someone with a tech job. One of the main steps is buying or renting under a LLC. Anyone can do that with planning.
- 1024core 3y ago
  You want to find out where someone lives? Head over to zabasearch.com and search away!
egberts1 3y ago
Quoting Joseph Goebbels? Bruce Schneier said: "Too many wrongly characterize the debate as 'security versus privacy.' The real choice is liberty versus control." https://www.schneier.com/essays/archives/2006/05/the_eternal_value_of.html https://www.schneier.com/essays/archives/2006/05/the_eternal...
- wavefunction 3y ago
  Liberty is freedom with responsibilty, not free from responsibility. There's definitely a middle ground between "You can only license one house from Great Society, comrade" and letting America become a rent-extraction exercise rather than real value creation. Forgive me for looking dimly on the situation.
GoldenMonkey 3y ago
Is nothing in our life private now? What about the need for privacy. Random ppl shouldn't know your financial holdings. We have a real lack of privacy now and easy access to the public records.
- dwater 3y ago
  There is public benefit to knowing the beneficial owner of real estate. It is the physical assets of a community and the community benefits from knowing who ultimately owns those assets.
  - lazide 3y ago
    Ultimately, this appears to be yet another step in the direction of deep control of society over wealth and the people who have it. Which, if you ever want to have anything of your own or be better than median in some way should concern you greatly. Some people will not rest until you’re poorer and more miserable than them, no matter what. Even if it means hurting themselves (and everyone else) to do it. Crabs in a bucket mentality is deeply destructive and dangerous.
    - kiba 3y ago
      Land is a scarce and valuable commodity that should be divided amongst the community to maximize its benefit for everyone, typically through taxation. If you want the most valuable land, you should be operating enterprises that provide values high enough to pay for the land.
      - lazide 3y ago
        Ah, manipulative arguments here we come! If property taxes don't vary based on who owns them, but rather by some standardized valuation, then why does it matter if it is owned by an LLC, a Corp, or some individual? The tax is the same and needs to be paid regardless. The land will need to be used effectively, or it's a cost on a balance sheet somewhere coming out of someone's pocket. The 'utility based value' is always the same then, correct? And the incentive to use it effectively is the same too, correct? The 'value' of these kinds of rule changes is because, eventually, the tax WILL be different based on who owns it. 'Good people' (based on the current political winds) of course being given good rates, and 'Bad people' getting punitive rates or having it outright seized.
nostromo 3y ago
> If they have nothing to hide they have nothing to fear. Ok then. Share with us your email and social media passwords -- and give us access to your Google Photos while you're at it. Otherwise -- what are you hiding?
- wavefunction 3y ago
  You're comparing a democratic government's lawful actions to your silly demands on the internet?
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
davrosthedalek 3y ago
The expression "If they have nothing to hide they have nothing to fear" is one of the most scary sentences. I am sure the Dutch didn't think recording the religion/race was a problem. Until it was. Took some work to limit the damage [1] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1943_bombing_of_the_Amsterdam_civil_registry_office https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1943_bombing_of_the_Amsterdam_...
- wavefunction 3y ago
  Perhaps it was both tongue-in-cheek and not. But if they're not doing anything "wrong" then what is there to fear? Nothing. What will really happen is that we find out that there are millions of LLCs owned by a few corporate investment offices that are driving up the price of housing for my fellow citizens, actual human beings who I value far more than any legal fictions.
  - davrosthedalek 3y ago
    What have the Jews in the Netherlands done wrong? Anyway, just to paint maybe some more realistic threat models: Swatting. People suing rich people to get "go-away" money. Targeted robberies or abductions. Privacy is a right, also for rich people. For any information that is private, I can find a good reason for it to not be private.
  - Eisenstein 3y ago
    Do you really think that society is so just that only those people who do wrong need fear things?
  - MarcoZavala 3y ago
    [dead]
deleted 3y ago
[deleted]

dogman144 3y ago

They have to fear swatting. If you’ve got the time and knowledge of where the individual likely lives, a hunting app for instance will show who owns each land plot in clear-text lol.

wavefunction 3y ago
Ok but I have to fear that, what's the purpose for different privileges? My info is publicly available.
- dogman144 3y ago
  If you’ve got the time and effort, it doesn’t have to be. These “extreme privacy” measures are available to the laymen with some time/effort/money, or definitely for someone with a tech job. One of the main steps is buying or renting under a LLC. Anyone can do that with planning.
1024core 3y ago
You want to find out where someone lives? Head over to zabasearch.com and search away!

egberts1 3y ago

Quoting Joseph Goebbels? Bruce Schneier said: "Too many wrongly characterize the debate as 'security versus privacy.' The real choice is liberty versus control." https://www.schneier.com/essays/archives/2006/05/the_eternal_value_of.html https://www.schneier.com/essays/archives/2006/05/the_eternal...

wavefunction 3y ago
Liberty is freedom with responsibilty, not free from responsibility. There's definitely a middle ground between "You can only license one house from Great Society, comrade" and letting America become a rent-extraction exercise rather than real value creation. Forgive me for looking dimly on the situation.

GoldenMonkey 3y ago

Is nothing in our life private now? What about the need for privacy. Random ppl shouldn't know your financial holdings. We have a real lack of privacy now and easy access to the public records.

dwater 3y ago
There is public benefit to knowing the beneficial owner of real estate. It is the physical assets of a community and the community benefits from knowing who ultimately owns those assets.
- lazide 3y ago
  Ultimately, this appears to be yet another step in the direction of deep control of society over wealth and the people who have it. Which, if you ever want to have anything of your own or be better than median in some way should concern you greatly. Some people will not rest until you’re poorer and more miserable than them, no matter what. Even if it means hurting themselves (and everyone else) to do it. Crabs in a bucket mentality is deeply destructive and dangerous.
  - kiba 3y ago
    Land is a scarce and valuable commodity that should be divided amongst the community to maximize its benefit for everyone, typically through taxation. If you want the most valuable land, you should be operating enterprises that provide values high enough to pay for the land.
    - lazide 3y ago
      Ah, manipulative arguments here we come! If property taxes don't vary based on who owns them, but rather by some standardized valuation, then why does it matter if it is owned by an LLC, a Corp, or some individual? The tax is the same and needs to be paid regardless. The land will need to be used effectively, or it's a cost on a balance sheet somewhere coming out of someone's pocket. The 'utility based value' is always the same then, correct? And the incentive to use it effectively is the same too, correct? The 'value' of these kinds of rule changes is because, eventually, the tax WILL be different based on who owns it. 'Good people' (based on the current political winds) of course being given good rates, and 'Bad people' getting punitive rates or having it outright seized.

nostromo 3y ago

> If they have nothing to hide they have nothing to fear. Ok then. Share with us your email and social media passwords -- and give us access to your Google Photos while you're at it. Otherwise -- what are you hiding?

wavefunction 3y ago
You're comparing a democratic government's lawful actions to your silly demands on the internet?
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]

davrosthedalek 3y ago

The expression "If they have nothing to hide they have nothing to fear" is one of the most scary sentences. I am sure the Dutch didn't think recording the religion/race was a problem. Until it was. Took some work to limit the damage [1] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1943_bombing_of_the_Amsterdam_civil_registry_office https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1943_bombing_of_the_Amsterdam_...

wavefunction 3y ago
Perhaps it was both tongue-in-cheek and not. But if they're not doing anything "wrong" then what is there to fear? Nothing. What will really happen is that we find out that there are millions of LLCs owned by a few corporate investment offices that are driving up the price of housing for my fellow citizens, actual human beings who I value far more than any legal fictions.
- davrosthedalek 3y ago
  What have the Jews in the Netherlands done wrong? Anyway, just to paint maybe some more realistic threat models: Swatting. People suing rich people to get "go-away" money. Targeted robberies or abductions. Privacy is a right, also for rich people. For any information that is private, I can find a good reason for it to not be private.
- Eisenstein 3y ago
  Do you really think that society is so just that only those people who do wrong need fear things?
- MarcoZavala 3y ago
  [dead]

deleted 3y ago

[deleted]