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The vast vast majority of apps doesn't But I agree, as expected, this will go to round two. Probably not even a new DMA just a court case about malicious comp

The vast vast majority of apps doesn't But I agree, as expected, this will go to round two. Probably not even a new DMA just a court case about malicious compliance. The DMA was written expecting apples reaction Still that they will reduce the commission fee is quite important on its own. If this reduces the flood of free ad financed apps and moves the market to a more sustainable model I'm all for it (although I realise this stance is probably controversial)

akie 3y ago
> this will go to a round two And there is only one possible outcome: Apple will bend to the EU's will, because in the end the European market is too profitable to ignore.
- arlcode 3y ago
  One interesting switch up could be the EU elections this year. Right, Far-right and EU-sceptic parties are predicted to become much stronger. So their stance might change on some topics
  - blibble 3y ago
    I wouldn't expect so The european far right are hardly fans of large American tech companies now, if they were domestic, that would be entirely different
  - tivert 3y ago
    > Right, Far-right and EU-sceptic parties are predicted to become much stronger. Do they have a much more favorable attitude towards American tech giants than whoever is in power now?
    - akie 3y ago
      If anything they’re in Putin’s pocket, not in Big Tech’s pocket.
      - tivert 3y ago
        And if that's the case, I'd expect them to be more hostile to American tech companies than European social democrats, because those companies are instruments of American power.
  - Wytwwww 3y ago
    The parliament is hardly relevant though, it's pretty much a joke. The non directly elected commission and council control EU's policy.
    - arlcode 3y ago
      Not true at all. No law like the DMA passes without the approval of parliament and the council of member states. In fact, all the details are hashed out between these two bodies with little to no say from the commission. BTW: The way the commission is selected is one step removed from the voters but this principle is not too uncommon in European parliamentary democracies. For example the German or Austrian Chancellors or the prime ministers of Italy ,Spain, Sweden, Denmark, Poland are elected in a similar fashion.
  - TheLoafOfBread 3y ago
    > Right, Far-right and EU-sceptic parties are predicted to become much stronger. Those parties are running predominantly on nationalism and populism. If anything they will be happy to screw US tech companies even more.
- overstay8930 3y ago
  You know these rules were drafted in cooperation with the EU right? Vestager was at Apple's HQ 2 weeks ago, and the EU spends millions to keep a regulator presence in Silicon Valley. The commission knows they really don't have much to stand on, if they go any farther they know other EU countries are going to step in again (these rules are not very popular anymore after GDPR and now that the EU is falling even farther behind the USA economically). The EU commission is a lot less powerful than a lot of terminally online Americans like to believe. EU courts constantly rule against them for overstepping their bounds and they have been caught submitting fake evidence before (see: Qualcomm case)
  - madeofpalk 3y ago
    Apple didn't make this up 2 weeks ago.
- bastardoperator 3y ago
  They will, the question that really matters is will developers. Is the case for DIY that compelling amongst European companies? I think it will cost companies more to rebuild their own walled garden then what it's worth. I suspect we're not going to see much change, and that most will stick with what they have. There doesn't seem to be any financial incentive to leave at this point.
Kon-Peki 3y ago
> just a court case about malicious compliance This I don't understand. What exactly would the court case be about? "You're following the law but we didn't mean it like that?" If you want them to do things differently, don't you need to either 1. prove that they aren't following the DMA, or 2. change the DMA? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malicious_compliance https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malicious_compliance
- arlcode 3y ago
  The rules (payment per install) differ for apps installed from the app store to those not installed from there. That gives preference to apples own app (the app store) which they can only do because they are still Gatekeeping.
  - Kon-Peki 3y ago
    So you're arguing that they aren't following the DMA? That's not malicious compliance, that's non-compliance.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
  - mh8h 3y ago
    No they don't: > Core Technology Fee — iOS apps distributed from the App Store and/or an alternative app marketplace will pay €0.50 for each first annual install per year over a 1 million threshold.
    - kristofferR 3y ago
      The new business terms including the Core Technology Fee are only required for developers who will want to be able to upload their apps to alternative app stores like f-droid: https://developer.apple.com/support/dma-and-apps-in-the-eu/#distribution-eu https://developer.apple.com/support/dma-and-apps-in-the-eu/#... Pretty clear malicious compliance. "Oh, you want to be able to distribute your popular free apps on other app stores? You gotta start paying us massively then."

akie 3y ago

> this will go to a round two And there is only one possible outcome: Apple will bend to the EU's will, because in the end the European market is too profitable to ignore.

arlcode 3y ago
One interesting switch up could be the EU elections this year. Right, Far-right and EU-sceptic parties are predicted to become much stronger. So their stance might change on some topics
- blibble 3y ago
  I wouldn't expect so The european far right are hardly fans of large American tech companies now, if they were domestic, that would be entirely different
- tivert 3y ago
  > Right, Far-right and EU-sceptic parties are predicted to become much stronger. Do they have a much more favorable attitude towards American tech giants than whoever is in power now?
  - akie 3y ago
    If anything they’re in Putin’s pocket, not in Big Tech’s pocket.
    - tivert 3y ago
      And if that's the case, I'd expect them to be more hostile to American tech companies than European social democrats, because those companies are instruments of American power.
- Wytwwww 3y ago
  The parliament is hardly relevant though, it's pretty much a joke. The non directly elected commission and council control EU's policy.
  - arlcode 3y ago
    Not true at all. No law like the DMA passes without the approval of parliament and the council of member states. In fact, all the details are hashed out between these two bodies with little to no say from the commission. BTW: The way the commission is selected is one step removed from the voters but this principle is not too uncommon in European parliamentary democracies. For example the German or Austrian Chancellors or the prime ministers of Italy ,Spain, Sweden, Denmark, Poland are elected in a similar fashion.
- TheLoafOfBread 3y ago
  > Right, Far-right and EU-sceptic parties are predicted to become much stronger. Those parties are running predominantly on nationalism and populism. If anything they will be happy to screw US tech companies even more.
overstay8930 3y ago
You know these rules were drafted in cooperation with the EU right? Vestager was at Apple's HQ 2 weeks ago, and the EU spends millions to keep a regulator presence in Silicon Valley. The commission knows they really don't have much to stand on, if they go any farther they know other EU countries are going to step in again (these rules are not very popular anymore after GDPR and now that the EU is falling even farther behind the USA economically). The EU commission is a lot less powerful than a lot of terminally online Americans like to believe. EU courts constantly rule against them for overstepping their bounds and they have been caught submitting fake evidence before (see: Qualcomm case)
- madeofpalk 3y ago
  Apple didn't make this up 2 weeks ago.
bastardoperator 3y ago
They will, the question that really matters is will developers. Is the case for DIY that compelling amongst European companies? I think it will cost companies more to rebuild their own walled garden then what it's worth. I suspect we're not going to see much change, and that most will stick with what they have. There doesn't seem to be any financial incentive to leave at this point.

Kon-Peki 3y ago

> just a court case about malicious compliance This I don't understand. What exactly would the court case be about? "You're following the law but we didn't mean it like that?" If you want them to do things differently, don't you need to either 1. prove that they aren't following the DMA, or 2. change the DMA? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malicious_compliance https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malicious_compliance

arlcode 3y ago
The rules (payment per install) differ for apps installed from the app store to those not installed from there. That gives preference to apples own app (the app store) which they can only do because they are still Gatekeeping.
- Kon-Peki 3y ago
  So you're arguing that they aren't following the DMA? That's not malicious compliance, that's non-compliance.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- mh8h 3y ago
  No they don't: > Core Technology Fee — iOS apps distributed from the App Store and/or an alternative app marketplace will pay €0.50 for each first annual install per year over a 1 million threshold.
  - kristofferR 3y ago
    The new business terms including the Core Technology Fee are only required for developers who will want to be able to upload their apps to alternative app stores like f-droid: https://developer.apple.com/support/dma-and-apps-in-the-eu/#distribution-eu https://developer.apple.com/support/dma-and-apps-in-the-eu/#... Pretty clear malicious compliance. "Oh, you want to be able to distribute your popular free apps on other app stores? You gotta start paying us massively then."