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Wait is Snowden still considered a loser here? I can't keep track of the narrative. We have an agency beholden to no-one with the power to blackmail any journa

Wait is Snowden still considered a loser here? I can't keep track of the narrative. We have an agency beholden to no-one with the power to blackmail any journalist, lawyer, politician, associate, etc. We have an agency that seems to take pride in "hacking" the constitution. We've been shown glimpses and glimmers of clever mechanisms to run-around the US Constitution. Go ahead and use a VPN and lock down your stupid android OS. You fail to grasp the breadth and depth of sources for harvesting "public" intel. If you want to be a founder and have no moral code there's ample opportunity here. IoT and connectivity make it cheaper than ever to generate intel on people. Fingerprint people's voices in public, travel patterns, associations, bluetooth/wifi device ids, home wifi attributes, etc. Who's the customer? Big Brother.. Spy on your fellow Americans to help combat Terrorism. Tin foil hat on: It might be too late for any of this to be meaningfully reformed. The people-in-charge already have enough blackmail on politicians they can drown out dissent. If there is any reform, the info gained from illegitimate sources is already stored as weights into a neural model for future use. Creating the neural model would be "constitutional" because the models aren't "searched" lol Our national security apparatus is running on self-signed certs. Hope nothing goes wrong with that!

2OEH8eoCRo0 3y ago
> beholden to no-one They're beholden to congress. No US entity is beholden to no-one
- iinnPP 3y ago
  The NSA is beholden to Congress until the NSA sends a few messages to fix it.
  - pydry 3y ago
    The NSA is beholden to the people whom it is almost certainly collecting kompromat on.
    - ben_w 3y ago
      Would it be too cynical if I suggested that many of our laws (worldwide, I'm not in or of the USA) exist in order to be sure компромат can be found on almost everyone?
- zmgsabst 3y ago
  The CIA hacked Congressional oversight of their illegal activity with no consequence. I’m comfortable saying that US intel agencies are rouge and beholden to no one and no laws.
- LeanderK 3y ago
  but is the oversight effective? Formal supervision alone is irrelevant.
- dylan604 3y ago
  I could see where you could get that notion from reading an org chart. However, Clapper lied to Congress, was accused of perjury, and allowed to resign. He now walks around as a free man with 0 consequences making whatever salary he's given from his consulting career. Congress is a feckless body of government when it comes to checks and balances.
  - 2OEH8eoCRo0 3y ago
    He wasn't charged because they didn't charge him. They're free to make that call. Was there any reason given? Maybe he cleared it up in closed door meetings?
    - raincom 3y ago
      [flagged]
      - ben_w 3y ago
        It can be a form of corruption. Trouble with closed doors is that in principle he might have actually told all the same people about the secret thing before swearing under oath that he didn't do the thing, and genuinely have believed there reason he gave later (IIRC that as the session was public, the question couldn't reasonably have been about the secret thing). But we'll never know, unless someone else does a Snowden.
    - dylan604 3y ago
      What we learned from this is that you can get away with anything if you say "I made a mistake". Really, and which mistake are you owning up to with that comment? The part where you lied, or the part where you did the thing that you covered up with the lie? Feckless. I have no other word for Congress. Well, that's a lie, but not like anything is going to come of it!
      - lesuorac 3y ago
        You seem to be conflating a bunch of individual actors here. Congress didn't testify to Congress, Clapper did. Clapper did so in both public and private settings. Clapper didn't tell the truth in a public setting because it was classified. Clapper (privately & immediately) informed Congress of the need for a private meeting to correct things he said in the public setting. This would be akin to your husband asking you were the cookies are and since you noticed your son around the corner saying you don't know. Then when you son leaves you tell him they're in the top of the cabinet. Nobody is going to actually be mad except your son (that's you in this example!).
- 0xParlay 3y ago
  And when the intel director lies to congress about spying on American citizens, then what? Self signed certificate my friend.. I guess it would be nice if congress held the executive in check.. but maybe they can't bc of sinister reasons >:D Wasn't there a report recently of the FBI illegally searching US Senators?? Something really wacky is going on.
- mrangle 3y ago
  That's false. If an entity is above the law then it is above Congress. This exists. If an entity can forever dismiss Congressional inquiry through unlimited open-ended legalistic escapes that are virtually always applicable, then it is de facto above Congress. This also exists, and is different than the first example.
- coldtea 3y ago
  [flagged]
jimmychoozyx 3y ago
[flagged]

2OEH8eoCRo0 3y ago

> beholden to no-one They're beholden to congress. No US entity is beholden to no-one

iinnPP 3y ago
The NSA is beholden to Congress until the NSA sends a few messages to fix it.
- pydry 3y ago
  The NSA is beholden to the people whom it is almost certainly collecting kompromat on.
  - ben_w 3y ago
    Would it be too cynical if I suggested that many of our laws (worldwide, I'm not in or of the USA) exist in order to be sure компромат can be found on almost everyone?
zmgsabst 3y ago
The CIA hacked Congressional oversight of their illegal activity with no consequence. I’m comfortable saying that US intel agencies are rouge and beholden to no one and no laws.
LeanderK 3y ago
but is the oversight effective? Formal supervision alone is irrelevant.
dylan604 3y ago
I could see where you could get that notion from reading an org chart. However, Clapper lied to Congress, was accused of perjury, and allowed to resign. He now walks around as a free man with 0 consequences making whatever salary he's given from his consulting career. Congress is a feckless body of government when it comes to checks and balances.
- 2OEH8eoCRo0 3y ago
  He wasn't charged because they didn't charge him. They're free to make that call. Was there any reason given? Maybe he cleared it up in closed door meetings?
  - raincom 3y ago
    [flagged]
    - ben_w 3y ago
      It can be a form of corruption. Trouble with closed doors is that in principle he might have actually told all the same people about the secret thing before swearing under oath that he didn't do the thing, and genuinely have believed there reason he gave later (IIRC that as the session was public, the question couldn't reasonably have been about the secret thing). But we'll never know, unless someone else does a Snowden.
  - dylan604 3y ago
    What we learned from this is that you can get away with anything if you say "I made a mistake". Really, and which mistake are you owning up to with that comment? The part where you lied, or the part where you did the thing that you covered up with the lie? Feckless. I have no other word for Congress. Well, that's a lie, but not like anything is going to come of it!
    - lesuorac 3y ago
      You seem to be conflating a bunch of individual actors here. Congress didn't testify to Congress, Clapper did. Clapper did so in both public and private settings. Clapper didn't tell the truth in a public setting because it was classified. Clapper (privately & immediately) informed Congress of the need for a private meeting to correct things he said in the public setting. This would be akin to your husband asking you were the cookies are and since you noticed your son around the corner saying you don't know. Then when you son leaves you tell him they're in the top of the cabinet. Nobody is going to actually be mad except your son (that's you in this example!).
0xParlay 3y ago
And when the intel director lies to congress about spying on American citizens, then what? Self signed certificate my friend.. I guess it would be nice if congress held the executive in check.. but maybe they can't bc of sinister reasons >:D Wasn't there a report recently of the FBI illegally searching US Senators?? Something really wacky is going on.
mrangle 3y ago
That's false. If an entity is above the law then it is above Congress. This exists. If an entity can forever dismiss Congressional inquiry through unlimited open-ended legalistic escapes that are virtually always applicable, then it is de facto above Congress. This also exists, and is different than the first example.
coldtea 3y ago
[flagged]

jimmychoozyx 3y ago

[flagged]