7 ms·

If you haven’t heard of the Kia boys over here in the states, it’s definitely something. This vid is…a bit controversial but the Kia boys are definitely a thing

If you haven’t heard of the Kia boys over here in the states, it’s definitely something. This vid is…a bit controversial but the Kia boys are definitely a thing in Milwaukee: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fbTrLyqL_nw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fbTrLyqL_nw

neurobama 3y ago
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- naikrovek 3y ago
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  - Auracle 3y ago
    https://abc7chicago.com/amp/cristian-uvidia-west-garfield-park-chicago-crash-kim-foxx/13181868/ https://abc7chicago.com/amp/cristian-uvidia-west-garfield-pa...
  - neurobama 3y ago
    [flagged]
    - naikrovek 3y ago
      [flagged]
      - neurobama 3y ago
        >Why? Do we treat minorities poorly? No, they come here from all over the world to find happiness and prosperity.
        chwa982 3y ago
        [flagged]
        ForHackernews 3y ago
        [flagged]
        dang 3y ago
        You may or may not have intentionally started a flamewar in this thread, but you've certainly broken the site guidelines by perpetuating it badly. Please stop and please don't. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html Edit: when a new account shows up with a dossier of links under one arm and a briefcase of arguments under the other, on a classic flamewar topic, that's not a good-faith use of the site. Pre-existing agendas are not what HN is for. They're repetitive, tedious, and usually inflammatory—certainly that's the case in this thread. This destroys the curious conversation that the site is supposed to be for, so please stop doing this.
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
- Glawen 3y ago
  > It's taboo to address this because of the color of their skin. Indeed, I wish one day we backtrack on this stupidity. Name and shame regardless of colour and stop this imposed self censorship.
- Arainach 3y ago
  >If these were white kids we'd publicly shame them, crack down on the worst offenders, and figure out a program to help the rest back on track. They're black so we don't, and this is somehow less racist. I do not understand it. Would we? This is merely grand theft auto, not rape or murder, so why would we treat them worse than Brock Turner or Kyle Rittenhouse? If they were white, why not give them a book deal?
  - deleted 3y ago
    [deleted]
  - defen 3y ago
    Kyle Rittenhouse didn't commit any crimes. Brock Turner received public vitriol commensurate with his crimes; I think a better comparison would be with the hockey player who pushed an empty wheelchair down some stairs. It's indefensible but at the end of the day not the kind of thing that warrants an Internet Week of Hate. Certainly less bad than hundreds of acts of grand theft auto.
    - Broken_Hippo 3y ago
      It's indefensible but at the end of the day not the kind of thing that warrants an Internet Week of Hate. I'm sorry, but what? Brock Turner was convicted of sexual assault. He served 3 months, and likely gave someone else a lifetime of hurt because he couldn't control his sexual urges to the point he was willing to have sex with an unconscious person. He served 3 months. after being rich enough to post bail and hire decent lawyers. But somehow, he doesn't deserve hate and this is less bad than grand theft auto?
      - neurobama 3y ago
        >He served 3 months. after being rich enough to post bail and hire decent lawyers. This became national news and the judge involved was recalled: https://harvardlawreview.org/print/vol-132/california-judge-recalled-for-sentence-in-sexual-assault-case/ https://harvardlawreview.org/print/vol-132/california-judge-... We'll all know Brock Turner's name and his crime for the rest of our lives. I believe this is an exception that proves the rule.
- throwawayadvsec 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - neurobama 3y ago
    [flagged]
    - throwawayadvsec 3y ago
      Mentioning a 1958 article to justify your racism really doesn't help. "Abetting the concealment campaign is the feeling shared by many whites that it is unfair, inflammatory and even un-American to talk about Negro crime." This is the first sentence of the article, dude, seriously. It's really sad to see more and more far right racists on HN, this place used to be filled with smart people.
      - neurobama 3y ago
        "Negro" was the word in common use by people of all races at the time. Wikipedia: >Negro was accepted as normal, both as exonym and endonym, until the late 1960s, after the later Civil Rights Movement. One example is Martin Luther King Jr. self-identification as Negro in his famous "I Have a Dream" speech of 1963. Do you have any comment on the content of the article?
  - alvah 3y ago
    you're not helping, both by casually calling people Nazis, thus cheapening the slur, and by pretending race isn't a factor.
- mjevans 3y ago
  You are wrong to focus on the color of someone's skin. Classism is the issue. Opportunity is the issue. Greed of the wealthy reaping rents in a quest to squeeze out every last bit of blood money possible is the issue. Even the choice to forego a proper security system for the cars is an example of greed, of cutting every corner possible and still charging a premium. Who pays? On both ends of this equation it is the poor.
  - neurobama 3y ago
    It's not strictly speaking the color of anyone's skin, but the taboos around discussing criminals of a certain shade that bugs me. >Classism is the issue. Crime does correlate somewhat with income, but racial differences in rates of violent crime are poorly explained by income level. Page 93, Table 6: https://www.newyorkfed.org/medialibrary/media/research/epr/99v05n3/9909levi.pdf https://www.newyorkfed.org/medialibrary/media/research/epr/9... And here, see "Analysis of the Combined Data" and the conclusion section: https://randomcriticalanalysis.com/2015/11/16/racial-differences-in-homicide-rates-are-poorly-explained-by-economics/ https://randomcriticalanalysis.com/2015/11/16/racial-differe... The author claims a large amount of the difference is explained by family structure. I'm inclined to agree, and I wish our leaders touched on this more often. You can't welfare or police your way out of a failed subculture where kids aren't raised to respect life and property, or themselves for that matter.
    - simoom22 3y ago
      Um, have you been to America before, or read any of it's history? Of course we don't openly discuss the racialized class of cheap reserve peon labor that is maintained for everyone else's benefit, that would be super uncomfortable.
    - ethanbond 3y ago
      It’s worth pointing out that insofar as the failed subculture is failed, its failure was deliberate. Same thing happened with Native Americans. The playbooks for destroying cultures are centuries old and they’re intended to reap exactly the sort of dysfunction you still see generations down the road. Doesn’t mean we shouldn’t be addressing the issue head on and talking about it openly, but it’s definitely more complex than the genetic argument that tends to emerge.
- pjc50 3y ago
  > If these were white kids we'd publicly shame them, crack down on the worst offenders, and figure out a program to help the rest back on track. The problem is that black kids get publicly shamed and cracked down on when they haven't done anything, making that ineffective, and nobody bothers with the third part of actual programs to help them.
  - neurobama 3y ago
    [flagged]
  - throwiepshkins 3y ago
    [flagged]
- mplewis 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - neurobama 3y ago
    [flagged]
- kotaKat 3y ago
  The easier solution would be for TikTok et al to have proper moderation controls and have nipped this in the bud when the first video dropped, but ByteDance just wants to instill chaos in the American public so they don't care one iota.
  - gordian-mind 3y ago
    It's hilariously misguided to blame TikTok for this, you realize that don't you?
    - ethanbond 3y ago
      It’s hilariously misguided to look for singular causes and singular fixes for any issue that persists beyond the first few attempts to solve it. They’re almost always overdetermined and multicausal, and yes, media (not TikTok alone) does play some role in the system.
      - throwiepshkins 3y ago
        [flagged]
      - gordian-mind 3y ago
        > It’s hilariously misguided to look for singular causes and singular fixes for any issue that persists beyond the first few attempts to solve it. Sorry but that's wrong. If you try to fix an issue by doing useless things, such as attacking TikTok, and then conclude that the problem is not solved because it is "overdetermined and multicausal", you just confused yourself into impotence.
        ethanbond 3y ago
        You should of course start with your highest-conviction fixes and I don’t think TikTok lands there. But no, most persistent behaviors, not even problems specifically, are multicausal and overdetermined. Behaviors that are not this way are fragile and rarely persist long enough to even be labeled as “a behavior”.
- concordDance 3y ago
  This is a rather heat generating post (as opposed to light). I think the things that cause this are: * References to some supposed collective discourse ("so many refuse to discuss this."). * Statements about what "we" do (who is "we"? Americans? Anglos? English speakers? The world?). * Heavily political topic central to the USA Culture War. * Use of (USA) identity group divisions ("white", "black"). I think this is a really unproductive line of discourse and a particularly bad way of approaching that line, focusing on consensus building and a call to action (in this case, a change of discourse). I think this post is unsuitable for hackernews.
  - neurobama 3y ago
    [flagged]
    - concordDance 3y ago
      And do you think your post has lead to productive discourse or just culture war thread number 63548?
      - neurobama 3y ago
        I think a lot of people who didn't know the contours of this auto theft crime wave, or perhaps even know such a crime wave was happening, now have a better understanding of what's happening and why.
  - junofan 3y ago
    It’s the comment section on an American car blog article posted to an American news site owned by an American startup accelerator. What do you expect?
  - chasil 3y ago
    For myself, I choose not to address the question. I stand to gain nothing from it, so it seems pointless to pursue it. However, what do you think is a productive line of discourse on this problem, that makes light and not heat? It seems a quandry to me.
- sumedh 3y ago
  > If these were white kids we'd publicly shame them Not sure why you want make this a black and white issue. So instead of stealing cars do you want them to destroy the economy and get bailouts or steal college seats from deserving candidates by just buying college admissions, you want them to do "respectable" crimes?
wolverine876 3y ago
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- 7speter 3y ago
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- finikytou 3y ago
  please do not assume what a black person would think. also, there isn't a "black" person. I know its hard for many "nice liberals" but black people are diverse and do not share a monoculture or single thoughts. stop generalizing over race or even skin color. that is way more racist than op comment.

neurobama 3y ago

[flagged]

naikrovek 3y ago
[flagged]
- Auracle 3y ago
  https://abc7chicago.com/amp/cristian-uvidia-west-garfield-park-chicago-crash-kim-foxx/13181868/ https://abc7chicago.com/amp/cristian-uvidia-west-garfield-pa...
- neurobama 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - naikrovek 3y ago
    [flagged]
    - neurobama 3y ago
      >Why? Do we treat minorities poorly? No, they come here from all over the world to find happiness and prosperity.
      - chwa982 3y ago
        [flagged]
        ForHackernews 3y ago
        [flagged]
      - dang 3y ago
        You may or may not have intentionally started a flamewar in this thread, but you've certainly broken the site guidelines by perpetuating it badly. Please stop and please don't. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html Edit: when a new account shows up with a dossier of links under one arm and a briefcase of arguments under the other, on a classic flamewar topic, that's not a good-faith use of the site. Pre-existing agendas are not what HN is for. They're repetitive, tedious, and usually inflammatory—certainly that's the case in this thread. This destroys the curious conversation that the site is supposed to be for, so please stop doing this.
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
Glawen 3y ago
> It's taboo to address this because of the color of their skin. Indeed, I wish one day we backtrack on this stupidity. Name and shame regardless of colour and stop this imposed self censorship.
Arainach 3y ago
>If these were white kids we'd publicly shame them, crack down on the worst offenders, and figure out a program to help the rest back on track. They're black so we don't, and this is somehow less racist. I do not understand it. Would we? This is merely grand theft auto, not rape or murder, so why would we treat them worse than Brock Turner or Kyle Rittenhouse? If they were white, why not give them a book deal?
- deleted 3y ago
  [deleted]
- defen 3y ago
  Kyle Rittenhouse didn't commit any crimes. Brock Turner received public vitriol commensurate with his crimes; I think a better comparison would be with the hockey player who pushed an empty wheelchair down some stairs. It's indefensible but at the end of the day not the kind of thing that warrants an Internet Week of Hate. Certainly less bad than hundreds of acts of grand theft auto.
  - Broken_Hippo 3y ago
    It's indefensible but at the end of the day not the kind of thing that warrants an Internet Week of Hate. I'm sorry, but what? Brock Turner was convicted of sexual assault. He served 3 months, and likely gave someone else a lifetime of hurt because he couldn't control his sexual urges to the point he was willing to have sex with an unconscious person. He served 3 months. after being rich enough to post bail and hire decent lawyers. But somehow, he doesn't deserve hate and this is less bad than grand theft auto?
    - neurobama 3y ago
      >He served 3 months. after being rich enough to post bail and hire decent lawyers. This became national news and the judge involved was recalled: https://harvardlawreview.org/print/vol-132/california-judge-recalled-for-sentence-in-sexual-assault-case/ https://harvardlawreview.org/print/vol-132/california-judge-... We'll all know Brock Turner's name and his crime for the rest of our lives. I believe this is an exception that proves the rule.
throwawayadvsec 3y ago
[flagged]
- neurobama 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - throwawayadvsec 3y ago
    Mentioning a 1958 article to justify your racism really doesn't help. "Abetting the concealment campaign is the feeling shared by many whites that it is unfair, inflammatory and even un-American to talk about Negro crime." This is the first sentence of the article, dude, seriously. It's really sad to see more and more far right racists on HN, this place used to be filled with smart people.
    - neurobama 3y ago
      "Negro" was the word in common use by people of all races at the time. Wikipedia: >Negro was accepted as normal, both as exonym and endonym, until the late 1960s, after the later Civil Rights Movement. One example is Martin Luther King Jr. self-identification as Negro in his famous "I Have a Dream" speech of 1963. Do you have any comment on the content of the article?
- alvah 3y ago
  you're not helping, both by casually calling people Nazis, thus cheapening the slur, and by pretending race isn't a factor.
mjevans 3y ago
You are wrong to focus on the color of someone's skin. Classism is the issue. Opportunity is the issue. Greed of the wealthy reaping rents in a quest to squeeze out every last bit of blood money possible is the issue. Even the choice to forego a proper security system for the cars is an example of greed, of cutting every corner possible and still charging a premium. Who pays? On both ends of this equation it is the poor.
- neurobama 3y ago
  It's not strictly speaking the color of anyone's skin, but the taboos around discussing criminals of a certain shade that bugs me. >Classism is the issue. Crime does correlate somewhat with income, but racial differences in rates of violent crime are poorly explained by income level. Page 93, Table 6: https://www.newyorkfed.org/medialibrary/media/research/epr/99v05n3/9909levi.pdf https://www.newyorkfed.org/medialibrary/media/research/epr/9... And here, see "Analysis of the Combined Data" and the conclusion section: https://randomcriticalanalysis.com/2015/11/16/racial-differences-in-homicide-rates-are-poorly-explained-by-economics/ https://randomcriticalanalysis.com/2015/11/16/racial-differe... The author claims a large amount of the difference is explained by family structure. I'm inclined to agree, and I wish our leaders touched on this more often. You can't welfare or police your way out of a failed subculture where kids aren't raised to respect life and property, or themselves for that matter.
  - simoom22 3y ago
    Um, have you been to America before, or read any of it's history? Of course we don't openly discuss the racialized class of cheap reserve peon labor that is maintained for everyone else's benefit, that would be super uncomfortable.
  - ethanbond 3y ago
    It’s worth pointing out that insofar as the failed subculture is failed, its failure was deliberate. Same thing happened with Native Americans. The playbooks for destroying cultures are centuries old and they’re intended to reap exactly the sort of dysfunction you still see generations down the road. Doesn’t mean we shouldn’t be addressing the issue head on and talking about it openly, but it’s definitely more complex than the genetic argument that tends to emerge.
pjc50 3y ago
> If these were white kids we'd publicly shame them, crack down on the worst offenders, and figure out a program to help the rest back on track. The problem is that black kids get publicly shamed and cracked down on when they haven't done anything, making that ineffective, and nobody bothers with the third part of actual programs to help them.
- neurobama 3y ago
  [flagged]
- throwiepshkins 3y ago
  [flagged]
mplewis 3y ago
[flagged]
- neurobama 3y ago
  [flagged]
kotaKat 3y ago
The easier solution would be for TikTok et al to have proper moderation controls and have nipped this in the bud when the first video dropped, but ByteDance just wants to instill chaos in the American public so they don't care one iota.
- gordian-mind 3y ago
  It's hilariously misguided to blame TikTok for this, you realize that don't you?
  - ethanbond 3y ago
    It’s hilariously misguided to look for singular causes and singular fixes for any issue that persists beyond the first few attempts to solve it. They’re almost always overdetermined and multicausal, and yes, media (not TikTok alone) does play some role in the system.
    - throwiepshkins 3y ago
      [flagged]
    - gordian-mind 3y ago
      > It’s hilariously misguided to look for singular causes and singular fixes for any issue that persists beyond the first few attempts to solve it. Sorry but that's wrong. If you try to fix an issue by doing useless things, such as attacking TikTok, and then conclude that the problem is not solved because it is "overdetermined and multicausal", you just confused yourself into impotence.
      - ethanbond 3y ago
        You should of course start with your highest-conviction fixes and I don’t think TikTok lands there. But no, most persistent behaviors, not even problems specifically, are multicausal and overdetermined. Behaviors that are not this way are fragile and rarely persist long enough to even be labeled as “a behavior”.
concordDance 3y ago
This is a rather heat generating post (as opposed to light). I think the things that cause this are: * References to some supposed collective discourse ("so many refuse to discuss this."). * Statements about what "we" do (who is "we"? Americans? Anglos? English speakers? The world?). * Heavily political topic central to the USA Culture War. * Use of (USA) identity group divisions ("white", "black"). I think this is a really unproductive line of discourse and a particularly bad way of approaching that line, focusing on consensus building and a call to action (in this case, a change of discourse). I think this post is unsuitable for hackernews.
- neurobama 3y ago
  [flagged]
  - concordDance 3y ago
    And do you think your post has lead to productive discourse or just culture war thread number 63548?
    - neurobama 3y ago
      I think a lot of people who didn't know the contours of this auto theft crime wave, or perhaps even know such a crime wave was happening, now have a better understanding of what's happening and why.
- junofan 3y ago
  It’s the comment section on an American car blog article posted to an American news site owned by an American startup accelerator. What do you expect?
- chasil 3y ago
  For myself, I choose not to address the question. I stand to gain nothing from it, so it seems pointless to pursue it. However, what do you think is a productive line of discourse on this problem, that makes light and not heat? It seems a quandry to me.
sumedh 3y ago
> If these were white kids we'd publicly shame them Not sure why you want make this a black and white issue. So instead of stealing cars do you want them to destroy the economy and get bailouts or steal college seats from deserving candidates by just buying college admissions, you want them to do "respectable" crimes?

wolverine876 3y ago

[flagged]

7speter 3y ago
[flagged]
finikytou 3y ago
please do not assume what a black person would think. also, there isn't a "black" person. I know its hard for many "nice liberals" but black people are diverse and do not share a monoculture or single thoughts. stop generalizing over race or even skin color. that is way more racist than op comment.