6 ms·

Rich people love to distinguish between old and new rich. Am I supposed to somehow be impressed by this? Old rich just use their money for pleasure and status l

Rich people love to distinguish between old and new rich. Am I supposed to somehow be impressed by this? Old rich just use their money for pleasure and status like new rich do, they just have different more obtuse ways to do it.

spaceman_2020 4y ago
I think the implication is that “old money” has aristocratic roots and thus, “noble blood”. Just plain old chauvinism and bigotry, but now applied to billionaires too.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
TotoHorner 4y ago
They’re incredibly smug about it too, as if getting born with a silver spoon in your mouth is somehow far more commendable?
- ergocoder 4y ago
  Old rich also likely earned their wealth in a lot more unethical way.
  - spaceman_2020 4y ago
    A lot of the old rich are just old aristocrats. Most made their fortunes through war, conquest, or plain old exploitation of their subjects. Far nastier stuff than some nerd striking it rich by making a fun app.
    - markdown 4y ago
      > ... plain old exploitation > ... some nerd striking it rich by making a fun app I suppose you could call Amazon a fun app.
  - rayiner 4y ago
    Quite the opposite. A Carnegie whose money comes from developing the American steel industry, or a Hershey whose money comes from chocolate, or the heirs of countless founders of companies that make real stuff, seems much more ethical than people today who make their money from one of the various heads of the advertising or finance hydras.
    - TotoHorner 4y ago
      Are you joking? You should google the Pittsburgh steel strikes and Henry Frick. You think someone who has to shoot their workers is more ethical? It’s genuinely hilarious to see how poor HN’s grasp of history is.
      - xyzzyz 4y ago
        > You should google the Pittsburgh steel strikes and Henry Frick. You mean the guy who survived an assassination attempt by labor activists, who were running a totally illegal blockade of his business? And it’s not even like the laws have changed about it since then, their blockade strike would be totally illegal today as well.
        TotoHorner 4y ago
        > And it’s not even like the laws have changed about it since then Let me know if it's still legal to have your workers work with highly dangerous machinery for 12 hours a day, 7 days a week (for wages that would be comparable to federal minimum wage today ~ although it's hard to find a good inflation calculator that tracks back to the 1880s). I'm sure that's totally comparable to the plight that Google/FB/Amzn employees have to put up with. Obviously I admire what he did with the Gospel of Wealth & his philanthropy, but that doesn't excuse his horrible treatment of workers. Honestly, it's just so astonishing that you can even argue in support of Henry Frick. You should read up about the Johnstown FLood and the failure of the South Fork Dam. I feel like the HN crowd just skims the wikipedia bio and uses that to craft a hilariously terrible argument.
        4y ago
vineyardmike 4y ago
I think there are implications or reasons i see this… (this is not an endorsement) 1. “New rich” is flashy and gaudy and that’s not perceived as a positive. Flaunting wealth is seen as trying to show off for the admiration/approval/jealousy of the less rich. Being old rich is to be above it, and so comfortable with money you don’t need to show it off. 2. “Old Rich” is a separate world, it’s like royalty, no amount of success today makes you old rich yesterday. Since having the right connections is an important factor in success, it’s another way to close doors for everyone but your kids. 3. I think there’s a certain “aesthetic” that old-money is associated with (enjoyed by the not rich). A quasi-royal preppy guilded sort of image, and people seem to like that.
- FpUser 4y ago
  >"I think there’s a certain “aesthetic” that old-money is associated with (enjoyed by the not rich). A quasi-royal preppy guilded sort of image, and people seem to like that." Thanks. I needed something to induce vomit.
- LightG 4y ago
  New rich can sometimes be a middle finger to the old rich. I'm thinking of some Hiphop stars. Over the top behaviour, perhaps, but I'll always respect that more than the old rich dripping in the unearned benefits of their generational wealth, connections and status worship. But I'm not bitter.
- Mordisquitos 4y ago
  While I believe that I mostly understand the distinction between Old Rich and New Rich (myself being neither of them), I wonder where individuals such as Warren Buffett fall in the social distinction. While it's obvious that in practice he's "new rich" in terms of family timeline, he is famously quite the opposite of the showy New Rich stereotypes. Furthermore, I'm sure there are countless more like him (though not quite so rich) that are virtually unknown precisely because they are so restrained and discreet about their wealth. I guess what I'm getting at is that I'm curious as to how the Old Rich feel towards these non-New-Rich-but-newly-rich types. Are they still considered part of the New Rich riff-raff even if they do happen to be more sensible with their money? Or are they seen as honorary Old Rich out of respect? Or something else? Hopefully some Old Rich HN commenter (we know you're there!) can give me some insight.
hahaxdxd123 4y ago
Middle class people putting old money on a pedestal and denigrating new money is so laughable to me. The folks that do nothing but own land and raise your rent every year are oh so classy, and the folks that actually work invent things that improve your life like idk wifi are oh so gauche.
- sbm_au 4y ago
  Ironically, WiFi was actually developed by an Australian public research institute. The patent earned over 400 million which went to the government.
- otikik 4y ago
  > Middle class people putting old money on a pedestal and denigrating new money is so laughable to me. Both are equally laughable. We shouldn’t put others in pedestals because of their wealth, full stop.
- pnut 4y ago
  I think it's more to do with what you imagine life could be, if money were no object. Middle class people have correctly concluded that hustling is not a virtue, and that hustling more is a fool's errand. I personally don't aspire to work any harder than I already do, and given the choice, would strongly prefer to inherit my fortune over "earning" it.
- B1FF_PSUVM 4y ago
  > do nothing but own land Sheesh, those guys got skinned and mounted as trophies over a century ago. Look up Pareto foxes and lions.
ulfw 4y ago
New rich = often earned their money (legitimately or not) Old rich = done nothing but inherit. Getting born is their only achievement.
qwertox 4y ago
I once read somewhere that the issue is that to the old rich money isn't a topic. It's something that exists and has existed for a long time, that gets used when needed, but doesn't get talked about. New rich on the other hand feel the need to display the fact that "they've made it", talking about money is important to them. So there's a certain incompatibility between old and new rich, where old rich feel bothered by the talk about money.
- cosmodisk 4y ago
  I think in general money isn't a topic amongst the rich. Yes, there are exceptions, but in general it's a very boring thing to talk about once you reach a certain level.
  - andsoitis 4y ago
    Showing off is another way of talking. The need to show off is to compensate for something.
A4ET8a8uTh0 4y ago
I personally think of it as a pure human need to somehow feel superior to their peers. Sure, they have the same amount of money, but are how did they get them and can we make their status lower ( and at the same time ours higher ) by pointing to that. The in-group/out-group dynamic is at play for everyone including apparently people, who have a lot of money. If I was a more charitable person, I would say that is a good thing. It means they are still connected to the human race. Note. By rich here I am talking upwards of 100MM although it would appear B would soon be replacing M as the place to be money-wise in terms of wealth recognition.
andsoitis 4y ago
Being able to steer wealth over multiple generations vs squandering it is seen as positive and not an obviously easy thing to do. When you’re newly rich, this ability is yet unproven…

spaceman_2020 4y ago

I think the implication is that “old money” has aristocratic roots and thus, “noble blood”. Just plain old chauvinism and bigotry, but now applied to billionaires too.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

TotoHorner 4y ago

They’re incredibly smug about it too, as if getting born with a silver spoon in your mouth is somehow far more commendable?

ergocoder 4y ago
Old rich also likely earned their wealth in a lot more unethical way.
- spaceman_2020 4y ago
  A lot of the old rich are just old aristocrats. Most made their fortunes through war, conquest, or plain old exploitation of their subjects. Far nastier stuff than some nerd striking it rich by making a fun app.
  - markdown 4y ago
    > ... plain old exploitation > ... some nerd striking it rich by making a fun app I suppose you could call Amazon a fun app.
- rayiner 4y ago
  Quite the opposite. A Carnegie whose money comes from developing the American steel industry, or a Hershey whose money comes from chocolate, or the heirs of countless founders of companies that make real stuff, seems much more ethical than people today who make their money from one of the various heads of the advertising or finance hydras.
  - TotoHorner 4y ago
    Are you joking? You should google the Pittsburgh steel strikes and Henry Frick. You think someone who has to shoot their workers is more ethical? It’s genuinely hilarious to see how poor HN’s grasp of history is.
    - xyzzyz 4y ago
      > You should google the Pittsburgh steel strikes and Henry Frick. You mean the guy who survived an assassination attempt by labor activists, who were running a totally illegal blockade of his business? And it’s not even like the laws have changed about it since then, their blockade strike would be totally illegal today as well.
      - TotoHorner 4y ago
        > And it’s not even like the laws have changed about it since then Let me know if it's still legal to have your workers work with highly dangerous machinery for 12 hours a day, 7 days a week (for wages that would be comparable to federal minimum wage today ~ although it's hard to find a good inflation calculator that tracks back to the 1880s). I'm sure that's totally comparable to the plight that Google/FB/Amzn employees have to put up with. Obviously I admire what he did with the Gospel of Wealth & his philanthropy, but that doesn't excuse his horrible treatment of workers. Honestly, it's just so astonishing that you can even argue in support of Henry Frick. You should read up about the Johnstown FLood and the failure of the South Fork Dam. I feel like the HN crowd just skims the wikipedia bio and uses that to craft a hilariously terrible argument.
        4y ago

vineyardmike 4y ago

I think there are implications or reasons i see this… (this is not an endorsement) 1. “New rich” is flashy and gaudy and that’s not perceived as a positive. Flaunting wealth is seen as trying to show off for the admiration/approval/jealousy of the less rich. Being old rich is to be above it, and so comfortable with money you don’t need to show it off. 2. “Old Rich” is a separate world, it’s like royalty, no amount of success today makes you old rich yesterday. Since having the right connections is an important factor in success, it’s another way to close doors for everyone but your kids. 3. I think there’s a certain “aesthetic” that old-money is associated with (enjoyed by the not rich). A quasi-royal preppy guilded sort of image, and people seem to like that.

FpUser 4y ago
>"I think there’s a certain “aesthetic” that old-money is associated with (enjoyed by the not rich). A quasi-royal preppy guilded sort of image, and people seem to like that." Thanks. I needed something to induce vomit.
LightG 4y ago
New rich can sometimes be a middle finger to the old rich. I'm thinking of some Hiphop stars. Over the top behaviour, perhaps, but I'll always respect that more than the old rich dripping in the unearned benefits of their generational wealth, connections and status worship. But I'm not bitter.
Mordisquitos 4y ago
While I believe that I mostly understand the distinction between Old Rich and New Rich (myself being neither of them), I wonder where individuals such as Warren Buffett fall in the social distinction. While it's obvious that in practice he's "new rich" in terms of family timeline, he is famously quite the opposite of the showy New Rich stereotypes. Furthermore, I'm sure there are countless more like him (though not quite so rich) that are virtually unknown precisely because they are so restrained and discreet about their wealth. I guess what I'm getting at is that I'm curious as to how the Old Rich feel towards these non-New-Rich-but-newly-rich types. Are they still considered part of the New Rich riff-raff even if they do happen to be more sensible with their money? Or are they seen as honorary Old Rich out of respect? Or something else? Hopefully some Old Rich HN commenter (we know you're there!) can give me some insight.

hahaxdxd123 4y ago

Middle class people putting old money on a pedestal and denigrating new money is so laughable to me. The folks that do nothing but own land and raise your rent every year are oh so classy, and the folks that actually work invent things that improve your life like idk wifi are oh so gauche.

sbm_au 4y ago
Ironically, WiFi was actually developed by an Australian public research institute. The patent earned over 400 million which went to the government.
otikik 4y ago
> Middle class people putting old money on a pedestal and denigrating new money is so laughable to me. Both are equally laughable. We shouldn’t put others in pedestals because of their wealth, full stop.
pnut 4y ago
I think it's more to do with what you imagine life could be, if money were no object. Middle class people have correctly concluded that hustling is not a virtue, and that hustling more is a fool's errand. I personally don't aspire to work any harder than I already do, and given the choice, would strongly prefer to inherit my fortune over "earning" it.
B1FF_PSUVM 4y ago
> do nothing but own land Sheesh, those guys got skinned and mounted as trophies over a century ago. Look up Pareto foxes and lions.

ulfw 4y ago

New rich = often earned their money (legitimately or not) Old rich = done nothing but inherit. Getting born is their only achievement.

qwertox 4y ago

I once read somewhere that the issue is that to the old rich money isn't a topic. It's something that exists and has existed for a long time, that gets used when needed, but doesn't get talked about. New rich on the other hand feel the need to display the fact that "they've made it", talking about money is important to them. So there's a certain incompatibility between old and new rich, where old rich feel bothered by the talk about money.

cosmodisk 4y ago
I think in general money isn't a topic amongst the rich. Yes, there are exceptions, but in general it's a very boring thing to talk about once you reach a certain level.
- andsoitis 4y ago
  Showing off is another way of talking. The need to show off is to compensate for something.

A4ET8a8uTh0 4y ago

I personally think of it as a pure human need to somehow feel superior to their peers. Sure, they have the same amount of money, but are how did they get them and can we make their status lower ( and at the same time ours higher ) by pointing to that. The in-group/out-group dynamic is at play for everyone including apparently people, who have a lot of money. If I was a more charitable person, I would say that is a good thing. It means they are still connected to the human race. Note. By rich here I am talking upwards of 100MM although it would appear B would soon be replacing M as the place to be money-wise in terms of wealth recognition.

andsoitis 4y ago

Being able to steer wealth over multiple generations vs squandering it is seen as positive and not an obviously easy thing to do. When you’re newly rich, this ability is yet unproven…