5 ms·

On Longevity

44 points by kevin_hu 4y ago

seydor 4y ago
This doesn't really need to be debated. It's weird that there are no large-scale anti-aging projects going on in the world. The US has e.g. the BRAIN initiative, and EU runs the HBP (both with little revolutionary output) , but a large scale Longevity initiative has not been created.
biguanide 4y ago
Perhaps the most promising anti-aging drug is metformin. Type 2 diabetics on metformin live 15% longer than non-diabetics. This is remarkable, considering how big a health disadvantage diabetes itself is. Metformin seems to mimic fasting somehow, by interfering with mitochondrial function. For more information, I refer you to David Sinclair's numerous discussions on this topic. He takes 1 gram of metformin per day, with his evening meal. This is not medical advice.
- gorkempacaci 4y ago
  Recently I’d seen this on Metformin: https://www.science.org/content/article/rare-genital-defects-seen-sons-men-taking-major-diabetes-drug https://www.science.org/content/article/rare-genital-defects...
- SemanticStrengh 4y ago
  It's not.. I could have shown you the most potent geroprotectors but tragically the website is down... https://geroprotectors.org/ https://geroprotectors.org/ You should look into SkQ1 + NAC instead.
- hirundo 4y ago
  > by interfering with mitochondrial function Which mitigates the damage caused by the toxic components in his evening meal. If the meal is unalterable that's a good move. But most people can do a lot more good by removing the ingredients from the meal that stress the mitochondria, particularly the excess carbohydrates and polyunsaturated fats. That same deadly duo is also responsible for atherosclerosis.
  - robbedpeter 4y ago
    Your assertion depends on his evening meal being deleterious. https://naturallystrong.me/david-sinclair/ https://naturallystrong.me/david-sinclair/ He's got an excellent diet. He's also got very solid reasoning behind metformin supplementation, having done years of research and investigation. He's a smart and respectable guy, operating in good faith with his research, so if you find yourself disagreeing with him over something trivial, it's unlikely you're right and he's wrong. Implying that metformin is useful only to mitigate hypothetical harms from nutrition (a trivial dispute) is probably wrong. Across various interviews, he's recommended metformin for exactly the mitochondrial effects you're talking about. He doesn't supplement on workout days to prevent disruption of the healing and recovery. Metformin isn't something that anyone should start taking blindly or blithely, as it can amplify damage from other circumstances, but it's got a clear place in Sinclair's regimen for very good reasons. Metformin's longevity effects work on a lot of species. It's got solid science recommending it for life extension, like the other things Sinclair uses, but unless you're a doctor, or work with one to create a comprehensive life extension, health, nutrition, and fitness plan, metformin probably isn't a great idea. Sinclair is doing something similar to juggling chainsaws - it's really cool that he can do that, but it's dangerous for amateurs. Too many unknowable factors can blow up in your face. Then again, maybe it'll be part of a standard regimen in the next decade, and the immortals are living among us.
pedalpete 4y ago
This basic thesis about curing aging rather than disease is the core of Dr David Sinclair's book Lifespan. Though we aren't currently working on aging specifically at https://SoundMind.co https://SoundMind.co, we are focused on improving sleep with one of the long-term benefits being longevity and improved longer quality of life. We are already seeing the benefits of extending life via exercise and proper diet. Sleep is the next mountain to climb. You can't give people long life if you can't get them sleeping better, and our sleep naturally degrades as we age.
- Terry_Roll 4y ago
  So you will be interested in this study. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2654999/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2654999/ Tryptophan -> serotonin -> melatonin -> Mesenchymal Stem cells https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6329089/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6329089/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24650016/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24650016/ The next problem you will probably be looking at is how to use vit K1 to keep calcium out of tissues/organs/glands like the pineal gland and cysteine & manganese to make the most damaging ROS in the body less damaging. (I'm not qualified in anything!)
  - pedalpete 4y ago
    Though circadian rhythms are important and is somewhat impacted in the aging population, it doesn't tell the complete story. This is the research around the first stimulation we are implementing https://academic.oup.com/sleep/article/43/1/zsz197/5613713 https://academic.oup.com/sleep/article/43/1/zsz197/5613713
- d0mine 4y ago
  There is a criticism of Sinclair's theories in particular on Resveratrol by Stanfield: https://youtu.be/vGmmBJq0NNo https://youtu.be/vGmmBJq0NNo https://youtu.be/rpB5hvE96iY https://youtu.be/rpB5hvE96iY
  - pedalpete 4y ago
RichardHeart 4y ago
Whenever the pro death guys show up, and they always do: Summary of pro death arguments: Fairness Only rich people will get it. (No tech has ever done this.) Better to give money to the poor than science. (family, city, state, nation, has proven local investment beats foreign.) Bad for society Dead people make more room for new, other people. (consider going first.) Run out of resources (live people discover/extract/renew better than dead or nonexistent) Overpopulation (colonize the seas, solar system, or have a war.) Stop having kids Worse wars (nukes are more dangerous than having your first 220 year old person in 2136) Dictators never die (they die all the time and rarely of age) Old people are expensive (50% of your lifetime medical cost occur in your final year. Delay is profitable.) Old people suck. (death is an inferior cure to robustness.) Bad for individual You'll get bored. (your memory isn't that good, or your boredom isn't age related) You'll have to watch your loved ones die. (so you prefer they watch you?) You'll live forever in a terrible state. (longevity requires robustness.) Against gods will (not if he disallows suicide, then it is required.) People will force you to live forever (they aren't able to do this now, why would they begin to be?) Do you think less people make progress faster? What's your target level of depriving life of existence? How do you plan to keep mankind robust from extinction events on a single planet? You might just need more people. What do you think our technology would look like if we had 10x less people for the last 100 years? More people make more progress faster. Aren’t you glad your parents didn't decide the world would be prettier or work better without you in it? If great minds like Einstein, Bell, Tesla, Da Vinci etc., were still alive and productive today, the world would be a better place. You're literally asking for others to die out of your fear. The burden should be higher. Have courage. If living longer comes with too many disadvantages, we'll know 100 years from now and decide then. Man up, save your family, save yourself. P.S. Curing aging isn't immortality. You die at 600 on average by accident, and if the parade of imaginary horrible things comes true, even earlier. P.P.S. I personally raised $27M for longevity research (SENS.org).
- woojoo666 4y ago
  One argument I saw in a show I recently watched (Ranling of Kings) is that mortality forces us to rely on others to continue our legacy, so we are forced into caring about our community and the people around us. So immortality would lead people to become more closed off. Longetivity is different from immortality of course, but it's still applicable to an extent. Though perhaps it should be up to us to find value in the community, instead of having it forced on us via mortality
nayuki 4y ago
Kurzgesagt: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GoJsr4IwCm4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GoJsr4IwCm4 CGP Grey: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C25qzDhGLx8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C25qzDhGLx8 , https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cZYNADOHhVY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cZYNADOHhVY

44 points by kevin_hu 4y ago

This doesn't really need to be debated. It's weird that there are no large-scale anti-aging projects going on in the world. The US has e.g. the BRAIN initiative, and EU runs the HBP (both with little revolutionary output) , but a large scale Longevity initiative has not been created.

biguanide 4y ago

Perhaps the most promising anti-aging drug is metformin. Type 2 diabetics on metformin live 15% longer than non-diabetics. This is remarkable, considering how big a health disadvantage diabetes itself is. Metformin seems to mimic fasting somehow, by interfering with mitochondrial function. For more information, I refer you to David Sinclair's numerous discussions on this topic. He takes 1 gram of metformin per day, with his evening meal. This is not medical advice.

gorkempacaci 4y ago
Recently I’d seen this on Metformin: https://www.science.org/content/article/rare-genital-defects-seen-sons-men-taking-major-diabetes-drug https://www.science.org/content/article/rare-genital-defects...
SemanticStrengh 4y ago
It's not.. I could have shown you the most potent geroprotectors but tragically the website is down... https://geroprotectors.org/ https://geroprotectors.org/ You should look into SkQ1 + NAC instead.
hirundo 4y ago
> by interfering with mitochondrial function Which mitigates the damage caused by the toxic components in his evening meal. If the meal is unalterable that's a good move. But most people can do a lot more good by removing the ingredients from the meal that stress the mitochondria, particularly the excess carbohydrates and polyunsaturated fats. That same deadly duo is also responsible for atherosclerosis.
- robbedpeter 4y ago
  Your assertion depends on his evening meal being deleterious. https://naturallystrong.me/david-sinclair/ https://naturallystrong.me/david-sinclair/ He's got an excellent diet. He's also got very solid reasoning behind metformin supplementation, having done years of research and investigation. He's a smart and respectable guy, operating in good faith with his research, so if you find yourself disagreeing with him over something trivial, it's unlikely you're right and he's wrong. Implying that metformin is useful only to mitigate hypothetical harms from nutrition (a trivial dispute) is probably wrong. Across various interviews, he's recommended metformin for exactly the mitochondrial effects you're talking about. He doesn't supplement on workout days to prevent disruption of the healing and recovery. Metformin isn't something that anyone should start taking blindly or blithely, as it can amplify damage from other circumstances, but it's got a clear place in Sinclair's regimen for very good reasons. Metformin's longevity effects work on a lot of species. It's got solid science recommending it for life extension, like the other things Sinclair uses, but unless you're a doctor, or work with one to create a comprehensive life extension, health, nutrition, and fitness plan, metformin probably isn't a great idea. Sinclair is doing something similar to juggling chainsaws - it's really cool that he can do that, but it's dangerous for amateurs. Too many unknowable factors can blow up in your face. Then again, maybe it'll be part of a standard regimen in the next decade, and the immortals are living among us.

pedalpete 4y ago

This basic thesis about curing aging rather than disease is the core of Dr David Sinclair's book Lifespan. Though we aren't currently working on aging specifically at https://SoundMind.co https://SoundMind.co, we are focused on improving sleep with one of the long-term benefits being longevity and improved longer quality of life. We are already seeing the benefits of extending life via exercise and proper diet. Sleep is the next mountain to climb. You can't give people long life if you can't get them sleeping better, and our sleep naturally degrades as we age.

Terry_Roll 4y ago
So you will be interested in this study. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2654999/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2654999/ Tryptophan -> serotonin -> melatonin -> Mesenchymal Stem cells https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6329089/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6329089/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24650016/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24650016/ The next problem you will probably be looking at is how to use vit K1 to keep calcium out of tissues/organs/glands like the pineal gland and cysteine & manganese to make the most damaging ROS in the body less damaging. (I'm not qualified in anything!)
- pedalpete 4y ago
  Though circadian rhythms are important and is somewhat impacted in the aging population, it doesn't tell the complete story. This is the research around the first stimulation we are implementing https://academic.oup.com/sleep/article/43/1/zsz197/5613713 https://academic.oup.com/sleep/article/43/1/zsz197/5613713
d0mine 4y ago
There is a criticism of Sinclair's theories in particular on Resveratrol by Stanfield: https://youtu.be/vGmmBJq0NNo https://youtu.be/vGmmBJq0NNo https://youtu.be/rpB5hvE96iY https://youtu.be/rpB5hvE96iY
- pedalpete 4y ago

RichardHeart 4y ago

Whenever the pro death guys show up, and they always do: Summary of pro death arguments: Fairness Only rich people will get it. (No tech has ever done this.) Better to give money to the poor than science. (family, city, state, nation, has proven local investment beats foreign.) Bad for society Dead people make more room for new, other people. (consider going first.) Run out of resources (live people discover/extract/renew better than dead or nonexistent) Overpopulation (colonize the seas, solar system, or have a war.) Stop having kids Worse wars (nukes are more dangerous than having your first 220 year old person in 2136) Dictators never die (they die all the time and rarely of age) Old people are expensive (50% of your lifetime medical cost occur in your final year. Delay is profitable.) Old people suck. (death is an inferior cure to robustness.) Bad for individual You'll get bored. (your memory isn't that good, or your boredom isn't age related) You'll have to watch your loved ones die. (so you prefer they watch you?) You'll live forever in a terrible state. (longevity requires robustness.) Against gods will (not if he disallows suicide, then it is required.) People will force you to live forever (they aren't able to do this now, why would they begin to be?) Do you think less people make progress faster? What's your target level of depriving life of existence? How do you plan to keep mankind robust from extinction events on a single planet? You might just need more people. What do you think our technology would look like if we had 10x less people for the last 100 years? More people make more progress faster. Aren’t you glad your parents didn't decide the world would be prettier or work better without you in it? If great minds like Einstein, Bell, Tesla, Da Vinci etc., were still alive and productive today, the world would be a better place. You're literally asking for others to die out of your fear. The burden should be higher. Have courage. If living longer comes with too many disadvantages, we'll know 100 years from now and decide then. Man up, save your family, save yourself. P.S. Curing aging isn't immortality. You die at 600 on average by accident, and if the parade of imaginary horrible things comes true, even earlier. P.P.S. I personally raised $27M for longevity research (SENS.org).

woojoo666 4y ago
One argument I saw in a show I recently watched (Ranling of Kings) is that mortality forces us to rely on others to continue our legacy, so we are forced into caring about our community and the people around us. So immortality would lead people to become more closed off. Longetivity is different from immortality of course, but it's still applicable to an extent. Though perhaps it should be up to us to find value in the community, instead of having it forced on us via mortality

nayuki 4y ago

Kurzgesagt: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GoJsr4IwCm4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GoJsr4IwCm4 CGP Grey: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C25qzDhGLx8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C25qzDhGLx8 , https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cZYNADOHhVY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cZYNADOHhVY