5 ms·

FWIW, I'm pretty sure going to an air show/air race is a fairly risky decision in the grand scale of things.

prof_hobart 15y ago
I wouldn't think so. How many people have ever died at airshows compared to how many go to them? It may look dangerous, but (except for very rare exceptions) it's just a fun day out.
- cookiecaper 15y ago
  There's a comment further down this thread that shows four air show related fatalities in the past month. I would think that going somewhere where you know you will be in close proximity to aircraft performing advanced stunts is one of the riskier places most people decide to go, even if the actual fatality rate is pretty low.
  - dlss 15y ago
    So quite safe relative to the risk of driving to the airshow?
  - prof_hobart 15y ago
    The other ones were deaths of participants rather than spectators though. If there's very rarely any fatalities, or even injuries, amongst the millions of people who go to airshows every year (the attendance at EAA AirVenture Oshkosh is around 800,000 every year for example, and Paris Airshow is around 350,000 people, plus the hundreds if not thousands of airshows like this one in Reno), how is it particularly risky?
- ktsmith 15y ago
  We can look at the Reno air races as an example. It's been going on for 49 years and prior to today there were 19 deaths, none involving spectators. I've been going to the races for a lot of years though we decided not to this year, the course isn't that close to the spectators and much of it happens over open desert.
  - kennystone 15y ago
    Yes and we can also use common sense to know an 80 year old dude flying a highly modified racing plane right above spectators is spectacularly stupid.
    - 0x12 15y ago
      That may be true by itself but there are some eyewitness reports that actually conclude that the pilot acted in ways that greatly reduced the number of casualties. Don't be too quick to judge, it could have simply been a mechanical failure. At speeds and altitudes like that it does not take much.
    - webXL 15y ago
      That was my first thought. I believe he was only 74 though. Probably approaching the realm of spectacularly stupid. They said his medical records were all checked out, but I bet there's a higher level of scrutiny for older pilots going forward.
      - ktsmith 15y ago
        Here's some information about the medical class he passed in March of this year: http://flightphysical.com/part67/Class2/67subc.htm http://flightphysical.com/part67/Class2/67subc.htm
    - ktsmith 15y ago
      You could also look at his FAA records and see that his being 74 likely had nothing to do with it: http://www.av8rdan.com/2011/09/before-assuming-age-was-the-cause-of.html http://www.av8rdan.com/2011/09/before-assuming-age-was-the-c... edit: The course doesn't fly right over spectators, the plane went off course, possibly as part of what is suspected to be mechanical failure.
- chaz 15y ago
  Airshows can be deadly to pilots, but up until this tragedy, safe for spectators: "John Cudahy, the president of the International Council of Air Shows, said Friday that no spectators have died at any air show in the country since 1952." http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-air-show-safety-20110917,0,6103017.story http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-air-sho...
  - aw3c2 15y ago
    There are airshows in other countries. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ramstein_airshow_disaster http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ramstein_airshow_disaster (might even count as US ground as it was a US military base).
    - tlrobinson 15y ago
      Also Sknyliv: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sknyliv_airshow_disaster http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sknyliv_airshow_disaster
  - dhughes 15y ago
    1952? No way, I remember one where a jet hit the runway and a fireball engulfed the crowd that occurred probably in the late 1980s. I think after that crash aircraft were banned from flying towards or over spectators the planes had to fly parallel or away from the crowd.
  - Fluxx 15y ago
    The last 2 years I went to Osh Kosh (2006 and 2008) there were two fatalities - one when a visiting pilot crashed on his way in (a lot of people fly in and camp at the air show) and another when two reno air race plans doing a race demo collided on the way in for landing. The sad part about the later crash is that it was a father and son who collided and the son was the one who died.
  - foxit 15y ago
    The president of the International Council of Air Shows made a PR-effective statement. However, looking into the history of airshows makes them look rather dangerous. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_airshow_accidents http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_airshow_accidents)

I wouldn't think so. How many people have ever died at airshows compared to how many go to them? It may look dangerous, but (except for very rare exceptions) it's just a fun day out.

cookiecaper 15y ago
There's a comment further down this thread that shows four air show related fatalities in the past month. I would think that going somewhere where you know you will be in close proximity to aircraft performing advanced stunts is one of the riskier places most people decide to go, even if the actual fatality rate is pretty low.
- dlss 15y ago
  So quite safe relative to the risk of driving to the airshow?
- prof_hobart 15y ago
  The other ones were deaths of participants rather than spectators though. If there's very rarely any fatalities, or even injuries, amongst the millions of people who go to airshows every year (the attendance at EAA AirVenture Oshkosh is around 800,000 every year for example, and Paris Airshow is around 350,000 people, plus the hundreds if not thousands of airshows like this one in Reno), how is it particularly risky?
ktsmith 15y ago
We can look at the Reno air races as an example. It's been going on for 49 years and prior to today there were 19 deaths, none involving spectators. I've been going to the races for a lot of years though we decided not to this year, the course isn't that close to the spectators and much of it happens over open desert.
- kennystone 15y ago
  Yes and we can also use common sense to know an 80 year old dude flying a highly modified racing plane right above spectators is spectacularly stupid.
  - 0x12 15y ago
    That may be true by itself but there are some eyewitness reports that actually conclude that the pilot acted in ways that greatly reduced the number of casualties. Don't be too quick to judge, it could have simply been a mechanical failure. At speeds and altitudes like that it does not take much.
  - webXL 15y ago
    That was my first thought. I believe he was only 74 though. Probably approaching the realm of spectacularly stupid. They said his medical records were all checked out, but I bet there's a higher level of scrutiny for older pilots going forward.
    - ktsmith 15y ago
      Here's some information about the medical class he passed in March of this year: http://flightphysical.com/part67/Class2/67subc.htm http://flightphysical.com/part67/Class2/67subc.htm
  - ktsmith 15y ago
    You could also look at his FAA records and see that his being 74 likely had nothing to do with it: http://www.av8rdan.com/2011/09/before-assuming-age-was-the-cause-of.html http://www.av8rdan.com/2011/09/before-assuming-age-was-the-c... edit: The course doesn't fly right over spectators, the plane went off course, possibly as part of what is suspected to be mechanical failure.
chaz 15y ago
Airshows can be deadly to pilots, but up until this tragedy, safe for spectators: "John Cudahy, the president of the International Council of Air Shows, said Friday that no spectators have died at any air show in the country since 1952." http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-air-show-safety-20110917,0,6103017.story http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-air-sho...
- aw3c2 15y ago
  There are airshows in other countries. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ramstein_airshow_disaster http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ramstein_airshow_disaster (might even count as US ground as it was a US military base).
  - tlrobinson 15y ago
    Also Sknyliv: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sknyliv_airshow_disaster http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sknyliv_airshow_disaster
- dhughes 15y ago
  1952? No way, I remember one where a jet hit the runway and a fireball engulfed the crowd that occurred probably in the late 1980s. I think after that crash aircraft were banned from flying towards or over spectators the planes had to fly parallel or away from the crowd.
- Fluxx 15y ago
  The last 2 years I went to Osh Kosh (2006 and 2008) there were two fatalities - one when a visiting pilot crashed on his way in (a lot of people fly in and camp at the air show) and another when two reno air race plans doing a race demo collided on the way in for landing. The sad part about the later crash is that it was a father and son who collided and the son was the one who died.
- foxit 15y ago
  The president of the International Council of Air Shows made a PR-effective statement. However, looking into the history of airshows makes them look rather dangerous. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_airshow_accidents http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_airshow_accidents)