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It's pretty interesting to contrast OP's experience with this recent /r/bestof that describes in detail why things might be the way you're describing: https://

It's pretty interesting to contrast OP's experience with this recent /r/bestof that describes in detail why things might be the way you're describing: https://www.reddit.com/r/bestof/comments/rkru22/uloosesignificance166_explains_how_he_stopped_a/?ref=share&ref_source=link https://www.reddit.com/r/bestof/comments/rkru22/uloosesignif...

ascar 5y ago
Direct link https://old.reddit.com/r/antiwork/comments/rkk9qg/im_a_new_supervisor_and_my_direct_reports_are/hpacf5h/ https://old.reddit.com/r/antiwork/comments/rkk9qg/im_a_new_s... for everyone else having a hard time figuring out how to find the actual comment. Really worth a read and absolutely puts OPs story into perspective.
- treis 5y ago
  Yeah that story is total bullshit. It's someone's fantasy. The equivalent of me telling the story of my epic comeback in the Superbowl.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  - iKnowKungFoo 5y ago
    I can buy the part about putting up fences between business people at the tech team. Been there, done that, modernized project management. But the "thank you"s, bonuses and all that? Complete fantasy. :)
    - isbvhodnvemrwvn 5y ago
      I 100% guarantee it's someone who has recently read "The Phoenix Project" and made it up based on that.
      - sanguy 5y ago
        He even referenced the Phoenix Project ;)
        _tom_ 5y ago
        Now you understand modern book marketing. :-)
        kortex 5y ago
        Wait...are you suggesting that whole comment is actually just an ad?
        _tom_ 5y ago
        While I have no evidence in this particular case, if I wanted to promote a book, I could imagine making up a related, positive story, which just happens to mention the book positively, and posting it on a popular social media site (I put the book in my cart). Then one could follow up with a softball opposing story on another site to get some controversy and thus visibility. Probably someone will cross link for you (I thought about doing that when I saw the headline). If not, a sock puppet can point out the link, and the book, again. TBH these two stories have the exaggerated perfection that characterizes fake stories. And the fact that they arrived so close together makes me very suspicious.
        bobobob420 5y ago
        I mean I read it and thought about looking up the book and getting it
        soonnow 5y ago
        I did like the book, back when I was completely new to DevOps. It's also a fictional story in the same vein as the one on reddit basically same template, but more mystic. Explaining DevOps through a story. Now I'd suggest to just read the state of Devops reports by Google, they are excellent.
    - t-writescode 5y ago
      Why? Maybe it’s that you’ve never worked for a boss that fought that hard for your free time? Great bosses like this exist
      - isbvhodnvemrwvn 5y ago
        The manager maybe, but you don't change the culture of the company like that. A low level manager has very little influence on that, they'd be replaced the moment other VPs started complaining.
        topkai22 5y ago
        Depends on the on the exact political arrangements. I’ve seen a “low” level manager get the ear of a senior leader and get protection/empowerment that ended them to do something on par with this. It sounds like the author got the appropriate buy in, and I suspect that not all ad hoc work got prioritized in a FILO manner.
      - Swenrekcah 5y ago
        It sounded implausible to me. Admittedly I don’t work for a large corporation but this sounded like a socially challenged persons dream of how they’d convince large groups of opposing people to their side. Hostile interactions with shelter from an all powerful HR and the vague threat of a lawsuit.
        t-writescode 5y ago
        I've explicitly asked for strong barriers from external leads and developers from my manager before and gotten them. My current boss aggressively puts barriers in place to keep us from being bothered or distracted.
    - pm24601 5y ago
      Why? I do this stuff all the time as a manager. It really goes exactly that way. Notice that the reddit commenter started with getting buy-in from the higher-up in their org. He didn't unilaterally start changing process. This is honestly basic management technique. It is called the "Auntie/Uncle" problem.
      - pitched 5y ago
        I’m having a bit of trouble what “Auntie/Uncle problem” is in reference to. My Google search are just a bit too generic to narrow in. Any chance you know of an article on the subject I can read through?
      - jsdalton 5y ago
        You might consider providing a link, since Google returns absolutely nothing about management relating to “Auntie / Uncle” as a search term.
  - jlawer 5y ago
    I could see it happening where I work (Large Multinational in the Energy Industry). HR are removed enough that they would back this up, yet have the authority. Teams often report by function, therefore there isn't a local manager worried about the missed deadline. Combined with the companies image as attempting to be a leader in social responsibility (at least as much as an Oil and Gas company can). I can see it happen however I don't think I could see it in any of the smaller companies I have worked for as the results of missing deadline were frequently too significant. That being said my current employer is exactly like the one mentioned by OP here. You basically need to build credibility internally to deliver.
  - forgingahead 5y ago
    Reddit is 90% LARPing when it comes to situations like this - it's obvious once you see it, and once you see it you can't unsee it ever again. It's like getting vaccinated against a sickness.
  - phnofive 5y ago
    It's pretty hard to imagine HR intervening in business operations to protect a single department's work-life balance - couldn't really track it from there.
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
- DyslexicAtheist 5y ago
  odd that most in this thread think this story is fiction, some even suggest it might be a marketing ploy to peddle a book. Is really the whole world like this or is there a difference depending on jurisdiction (e.g. comments reflect values of US?). While I can't prove a negative, this story is highly plausible in Europe where legal/HR will be on your ass and even fire the CEO if it turns out they had knowledge. In 2020 I was in a similar situation with an IoT "startup" (70 people) in Austria where some of the original founding team worked their employees in a brutal manner (made fun of the engineering providers that invented the product in a "low-cost" neighboring country, and being total f-heads all around). My superior even made fun of one intern for "stuttering" in front of the whole team, scolding him for "sloppy thinking" and being "too slow in his head" (fact was he wasn't used to speaking English, was a bit insecure because he was still very young). People regularly cried. That was just the internal stuff. In my first weekend in this firm I was given new tasks on Friday 16:00 to finish until Monday 08:00 (tasks so complex that it would normally take a whole week to finish and required multiple rounds of input). I had no free weekend in my first month and 12/hrs per day was the norm. In my first client meeting 2 days into the job I learned that my company lost all their data 3 months before ... genuinely curious I started probing the client to get a better picture of how we were perceived. The client talked himself into such a rage that he ended up screaming at me (and a day later apologizing for doing so). 2 weeks after I joined, I wrote a long letter to HR with a list of all the communication that happened, e.g. who said what to me when, and even smtp headers of communication received in an appendix. After the CEO asked me to lie on a revenue forecast that served as input to the business plan (and where I was told "to make up numbers" !!) I looped in the Holding company into my ongoing conversation with HR (the holding was where my employer got all their funding and who would be the audience for that pitch in the presentation/Excel I was asked to make). It was the first time that I ended up (literally) screaming with my own superior in a meeting for abusing his own team, and spelling out immediately why his behavior was abuse. 2/3 of my team left that very month since they were fed up and I like to think it was me that spelled out for everyone what they already knew but hadn't ever thought to verbalize themselves. I also handed in my resignation a week afterwards since it looked like some people would be able to get away with it. The Holding Company brought in an external consulting / auditing team and fired the CEO and 2 others. Alas ... not for mistreating or overworking employees but for lying on the business plan. This October (2 quarters later) the same company filed for bankruptcy. I don't know if I would be able to bring down an equally rotten place in a different jurisdiction. YMMV sadly and I am sure many people try in other places but all they ever achieve is that those responsible get a "stern warning". But I totally believe the linked article to be plausible EDIT: rediability
meigwilym 5y ago
I immediately thought of this as well. Great minds etc.
cwkoss 5y ago
Wow, thats a truly excellent comment. Everyone who manages people should read that IMO.
- michaelcampbell 5y ago
  If only it had any basis in reality.

ascar 5y ago

Direct link https://old.reddit.com/r/antiwork/comments/rkk9qg/im_a_new_supervisor_and_my_direct_reports_are/hpacf5h/ https://old.reddit.com/r/antiwork/comments/rkk9qg/im_a_new_s... for everyone else having a hard time figuring out how to find the actual comment. Really worth a read and absolutely puts OPs story into perspective.

treis 5y ago
Yeah that story is total bullshit. It's someone's fantasy. The equivalent of me telling the story of my epic comeback in the Superbowl.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- iKnowKungFoo 5y ago
  I can buy the part about putting up fences between business people at the tech team. Been there, done that, modernized project management. But the "thank you"s, bonuses and all that? Complete fantasy. :)
  - isbvhodnvemrwvn 5y ago
    I 100% guarantee it's someone who has recently read "The Phoenix Project" and made it up based on that.
    - sanguy 5y ago
      He even referenced the Phoenix Project ;)
      - _tom_ 5y ago
        Now you understand modern book marketing. :-)
        kortex 5y ago
        Wait...are you suggesting that whole comment is actually just an ad?
        _tom_ 5y ago
        While I have no evidence in this particular case, if I wanted to promote a book, I could imagine making up a related, positive story, which just happens to mention the book positively, and posting it on a popular social media site (I put the book in my cart). Then one could follow up with a softball opposing story on another site to get some controversy and thus visibility. Probably someone will cross link for you (I thought about doing that when I saw the headline). If not, a sock puppet can point out the link, and the book, again. TBH these two stories have the exaggerated perfection that characterizes fake stories. And the fact that they arrived so close together makes me very suspicious.
        bobobob420 5y ago
        I mean I read it and thought about looking up the book and getting it
        soonnow 5y ago
        I did like the book, back when I was completely new to DevOps. It's also a fictional story in the same vein as the one on reddit basically same template, but more mystic. Explaining DevOps through a story. Now I'd suggest to just read the state of Devops reports by Google, they are excellent.
  - t-writescode 5y ago
    Why? Maybe it’s that you’ve never worked for a boss that fought that hard for your free time? Great bosses like this exist
    - isbvhodnvemrwvn 5y ago
      The manager maybe, but you don't change the culture of the company like that. A low level manager has very little influence on that, they'd be replaced the moment other VPs started complaining.
      - topkai22 5y ago
        Depends on the on the exact political arrangements. I’ve seen a “low” level manager get the ear of a senior leader and get protection/empowerment that ended them to do something on par with this. It sounds like the author got the appropriate buy in, and I suspect that not all ad hoc work got prioritized in a FILO manner.
    - Swenrekcah 5y ago
      It sounded implausible to me. Admittedly I don’t work for a large corporation but this sounded like a socially challenged persons dream of how they’d convince large groups of opposing people to their side. Hostile interactions with shelter from an all powerful HR and the vague threat of a lawsuit.
      - t-writescode 5y ago
        I've explicitly asked for strong barriers from external leads and developers from my manager before and gotten them. My current boss aggressively puts barriers in place to keep us from being bothered or distracted.
  - pm24601 5y ago
    Why? I do this stuff all the time as a manager. It really goes exactly that way. Notice that the reddit commenter started with getting buy-in from the higher-up in their org. He didn't unilaterally start changing process. This is honestly basic management technique. It is called the "Auntie/Uncle" problem.
    - pitched 5y ago
      I’m having a bit of trouble what “Auntie/Uncle problem” is in reference to. My Google search are just a bit too generic to narrow in. Any chance you know of an article on the subject I can read through?
    - jsdalton 5y ago
      You might consider providing a link, since Google returns absolutely nothing about management relating to “Auntie / Uncle” as a search term.
- jlawer 5y ago
  I could see it happening where I work (Large Multinational in the Energy Industry). HR are removed enough that they would back this up, yet have the authority. Teams often report by function, therefore there isn't a local manager worried about the missed deadline. Combined with the companies image as attempting to be a leader in social responsibility (at least as much as an Oil and Gas company can). I can see it happen however I don't think I could see it in any of the smaller companies I have worked for as the results of missing deadline were frequently too significant. That being said my current employer is exactly like the one mentioned by OP here. You basically need to build credibility internally to deliver.
- forgingahead 5y ago
  Reddit is 90% LARPing when it comes to situations like this - it's obvious once you see it, and once you see it you can't unsee it ever again. It's like getting vaccinated against a sickness.
- phnofive 5y ago
  It's pretty hard to imagine HR intervening in business operations to protect a single department's work-life balance - couldn't really track it from there.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
DyslexicAtheist 5y ago
odd that most in this thread think this story is fiction, some even suggest it might be a marketing ploy to peddle a book. Is really the whole world like this or is there a difference depending on jurisdiction (e.g. comments reflect values of US?). While I can't prove a negative, this story is highly plausible in Europe where legal/HR will be on your ass and even fire the CEO if it turns out they had knowledge. In 2020 I was in a similar situation with an IoT "startup" (70 people) in Austria where some of the original founding team worked their employees in a brutal manner (made fun of the engineering providers that invented the product in a "low-cost" neighboring country, and being total f-heads all around). My superior even made fun of one intern for "stuttering" in front of the whole team, scolding him for "sloppy thinking" and being "too slow in his head" (fact was he wasn't used to speaking English, was a bit insecure because he was still very young). People regularly cried. That was just the internal stuff. In my first weekend in this firm I was given new tasks on Friday 16:00 to finish until Monday 08:00 (tasks so complex that it would normally take a whole week to finish and required multiple rounds of input). I had no free weekend in my first month and 12/hrs per day was the norm. In my first client meeting 2 days into the job I learned that my company lost all their data 3 months before ... genuinely curious I started probing the client to get a better picture of how we were perceived. The client talked himself into such a rage that he ended up screaming at me (and a day later apologizing for doing so). 2 weeks after I joined, I wrote a long letter to HR with a list of all the communication that happened, e.g. who said what to me when, and even smtp headers of communication received in an appendix. After the CEO asked me to lie on a revenue forecast that served as input to the business plan (and where I was told "to make up numbers" !!) I looped in the Holding company into my ongoing conversation with HR (the holding was where my employer got all their funding and who would be the audience for that pitch in the presentation/Excel I was asked to make). It was the first time that I ended up (literally) screaming with my own superior in a meeting for abusing his own team, and spelling out immediately why his behavior was abuse. 2/3 of my team left that very month since they were fed up and I like to think it was me that spelled out for everyone what they already knew but hadn't ever thought to verbalize themselves. I also handed in my resignation a week afterwards since it looked like some people would be able to get away with it. The Holding Company brought in an external consulting / auditing team and fired the CEO and 2 others. Alas ... not for mistreating or overworking employees but for lying on the business plan. This October (2 quarters later) the same company filed for bankruptcy. I don't know if I would be able to bring down an equally rotten place in a different jurisdiction. YMMV sadly and I am sure many people try in other places but all they ever achieve is that those responsible get a "stern warning". But I totally believe the linked article to be plausible EDIT: rediability

meigwilym 5y ago

I immediately thought of this as well. Great minds etc.

cwkoss 5y ago

Wow, thats a truly excellent comment. Everyone who manages people should read that IMO.

michaelcampbell 5y ago
If only it had any basis in reality.