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There were the violations by Samsung of the Apple patent: EP 2,058,868 - method of scrolling / browsing gallery; EP 2098948 - recording a "flag" in connection

There were the violations by Samsung of the Apple patent: EP 2,058,868 - method of scrolling / browsing gallery; EP 2098948 - recording a "flag" in connection with multiple screen taps, of which Samsung would use the system by using Android 2.3 or later version; EP 1,964,022 - method of "unlocking" of a portable device through the touch screen an "unlock image" in a way to drag. Patenting phone unlock and how to browse through pictures is a douche move.

wgx 15y ago
>Patenting phone unlock and how to browse through pictures is a douche move. But they did invent the "Swipe to Unlock" interaction did they not? Previous to that it was always a clunky button combination (Menu + * on the old Nokia handsets) and this is an elegant alternative. Why can't other manufacturers come up with a new, novel unlock method like Apple did?
- kayoone 15y ago
  Yeah Apple invented it, i give them that. But do they need to patent it and sue manufactures of other smartphones that use the same technique ? Sadly, Apple became the new MS years ago..
  - wgx 15y ago
    Downvoted! Harsh. I know I'm swimming against the tide here, and actually I think there are huge problems with the patent system globally. BUT - I find it a little strange that company A invents something, protects it, then company B does the exact same thing - knowing there's a patent.. should we be surprised that Apple are using that which the law allows them?
    - zmmmmm 15y ago
      > should we be surprised that Apple are using that which the law allows them Yes. Your argument seems to be that we should expect companies to behave exactly as badly as the law can possibly let them do so and that they should receive no reproach for doing that. If you use this argument then you are implying that the law should enforce good behavior in every single thing every company does, since there is no other force to make them do good things (remember, you just argued that nobody should complain about what Apple does because it is legal). Clearly the above is ridiculous and the whole premise of "free" societies is that people and companies are granted wide freedom to do things and the law only regulates the most severe of these and that people will motivate good behavior by each other and companies by shaming them and judging them and refusing to deal with them when they behave poorly. So yes - when Apple behaves badly they need to feel judgement from the community and this is how it happens. The company does something bad (suing over a frivolous feature to block an entire competitor's product), and we express surprise and shock that it did such a bad thing.
  - hessenwolf 15y ago
    'Invented'. For fuck sake, how else were you going to do it on a touch screen phone?
    - thebooktocome 15y ago
      Hindsight bias.
      - deleted 15y ago
        [deleted]
      - hnhg 15y ago
        The point is that it's not worth a patent.
      - hessenwolf 15y ago
        Maybe there is different version of the galaxy with a slider that more closely resembles the Apple version? For mine, I just have to rub my thumb along anywhere on the screen to open it, and I can choose a special pattern if I want (I really don't trust that one to work). How else would you open a screen without buttons? By tapping on it in a pattern? Or by rubbing it in a pattern? Tap-rub-tap just to avoid a patent?
    - 0x44 15y ago
      With the proliferation of buttons on most android phones I've seen, they could have easily added a hardware unlock button.
      - hessenwolf 15y ago
        Expensive. Touchscreen phones have few parts, less assembly, less testing... even if the hardware costs more, the design and labour surely costs less?
- jsvaughan 15y ago
  the "interaction" is a virtual representation of a sliding lock. apple did not invent the sliding lock.
martingordon 15y ago
The post says that Samsung was found guilty of violating 2,058,868, not the other two, and that 1,964,022 was rules to be null and void and Apple can no longer make claims in the Netherlands based on that patent.
metachris 15y ago
That's pretty incorrect. The judge did find that Samsung only violated EP 2,058,868 - method of scrolling / browsing gallery, but not the other two. In fact EP 1,964,022 was declared null and void, meaning "Apple can no longer make claims in the Netherlands based on this patent".
sjs 15y ago
Yeah, it is a dick move. At the same time if it moves the whole industry forward then it's good for us as well. Mixed feelings. Do you remember how we unlocked phones before the iPhone? On Nokia phones it was Menu, * which was great but my mom never remembered to use it and was always pocket-calling me. I promise you that problem has not occurred since she got an iPhone. The first time I saw slide to unlock I was amazed, yes over such a small thing. And it's a great example of why I like Apple's products. They take the time to find good solutions to common, everyday problems. Now everyone uses slide to unlock. I like competition as much as the next guy but it's hard to see how most of Apple's competition is not riding on their coattails with Android. We all know what Android was going to be prior to the iPhone's release, a BlackBerry wannabe. Microsoft is notably not just copying Apple. HP/Palm also. Mostly just the Android OEMs who seem to wish Android were iOS.
- icebraining 15y ago
  Nokia did have slide to unlock way before the iPhone: http://netdna.webdesignerdepot.com/uploads/cellphone_design/dkmb86g_438fwgxrnfn_b.jpg http://netdna.webdesignerdepot.com/uploads/cellphone_design/... This is a clear case of adding "...on a computer" like that was some great revolutionary advance. It isn't. It's the obvious translation of an existing concept.
  - tjogin 15y ago
    Good design seems obvious in hindsight, but there is no denying that Apple are often the first to either do something, or the first to make something work. And then everyone copies that thing. Doesn't mean I like software patents, just saying.
  - sjs 15y ago
    Many great ideas are obvious in hindsight. If it was so obvious why had nobody done it? Would you say, "Oh Amazon? Whatever they're not doing anything new. They're just selling shit except their store is on the web. Big deal, that's not innovative just because they're doing it on a computer." My mom owned a Nokia slider back in the late 1900s, but the model preceding that one. If Nokia had kept making top-end phones like those were in their day I would probably still be buying Nokias. I swore by them. You could drop them, throw them, soak them, anything. Dry it out, take it apart, and it was fine. About 7-10 years ago, with a lot of their models, the worst case scenario was you bought a new case. And the UI was actually quite good, definitely superior to other phones of the time (that I tried anyway). I had a Nokia phone from the late 1900s until 2008. The last Nokia product I bought is the n810 and it was not very good. I loved the idea but the execution was poor (and I got the 3rd version). I rarely used it and then never used it once I got an iPhone. The iPhone 3GS was a better browser than the Internet Tablet, better GPS (it's using other location data but I don't care, it's still better), and happened to also be my mp3 player and phone. It's sad to see Nokia today, I really hope they can turn around but I have less hope for Nokia than I do for webOS :(

wgx 15y ago

>Patenting phone unlock and how to browse through pictures is a douche move. But they did invent the "Swipe to Unlock" interaction did they not? Previous to that it was always a clunky button combination (Menu + * on the old Nokia handsets) and this is an elegant alternative. Why can't other manufacturers come up with a new, novel unlock method like Apple did?

kayoone 15y ago
Yeah Apple invented it, i give them that. But do they need to patent it and sue manufactures of other smartphones that use the same technique ? Sadly, Apple became the new MS years ago..
- wgx 15y ago
  Downvoted! Harsh. I know I'm swimming against the tide here, and actually I think there are huge problems with the patent system globally. BUT - I find it a little strange that company A invents something, protects it, then company B does the exact same thing - knowing there's a patent.. should we be surprised that Apple are using that which the law allows them?
  - zmmmmm 15y ago
    > should we be surprised that Apple are using that which the law allows them Yes. Your argument seems to be that we should expect companies to behave exactly as badly as the law can possibly let them do so and that they should receive no reproach for doing that. If you use this argument then you are implying that the law should enforce good behavior in every single thing every company does, since there is no other force to make them do good things (remember, you just argued that nobody should complain about what Apple does because it is legal). Clearly the above is ridiculous and the whole premise of "free" societies is that people and companies are granted wide freedom to do things and the law only regulates the most severe of these and that people will motivate good behavior by each other and companies by shaming them and judging them and refusing to deal with them when they behave poorly. So yes - when Apple behaves badly they need to feel judgement from the community and this is how it happens. The company does something bad (suing over a frivolous feature to block an entire competitor's product), and we express surprise and shock that it did such a bad thing.
- hessenwolf 15y ago
  'Invented'. For fuck sake, how else were you going to do it on a touch screen phone?
  - thebooktocome 15y ago
    Hindsight bias.
    - deleted 15y ago
      [deleted]
    - hnhg 15y ago
      The point is that it's not worth a patent.
    - hessenwolf 15y ago
      Maybe there is different version of the galaxy with a slider that more closely resembles the Apple version? For mine, I just have to rub my thumb along anywhere on the screen to open it, and I can choose a special pattern if I want (I really don't trust that one to work). How else would you open a screen without buttons? By tapping on it in a pattern? Or by rubbing it in a pattern? Tap-rub-tap just to avoid a patent?
  - 0x44 15y ago
    With the proliferation of buttons on most android phones I've seen, they could have easily added a hardware unlock button.
    - hessenwolf 15y ago
      Expensive. Touchscreen phones have few parts, less assembly, less testing... even if the hardware costs more, the design and labour surely costs less?
jsvaughan 15y ago
the "interaction" is a virtual representation of a sliding lock. apple did not invent the sliding lock.

martingordon 15y ago

The post says that Samsung was found guilty of violating 2,058,868, not the other two, and that 1,964,022 was rules to be null and void and Apple can no longer make claims in the Netherlands based on that patent.

metachris 15y ago

That's pretty incorrect. The judge did find that Samsung only violated EP 2,058,868 - method of scrolling / browsing gallery, but not the other two. In fact EP 1,964,022 was declared null and void, meaning "Apple can no longer make claims in the Netherlands based on this patent".

sjs 15y ago

Yeah, it is a dick move. At the same time if it moves the whole industry forward then it's good for us as well. Mixed feelings. Do you remember how we unlocked phones before the iPhone? On Nokia phones it was Menu, * which was great but my mom never remembered to use it and was always pocket-calling me. I promise you that problem has not occurred since she got an iPhone. The first time I saw slide to unlock I was amazed, yes over such a small thing. And it's a great example of why I like Apple's products. They take the time to find good solutions to common, everyday problems. Now everyone uses slide to unlock. I like competition as much as the next guy but it's hard to see how most of Apple's competition is not riding on their coattails with Android. We all know what Android was going to be prior to the iPhone's release, a BlackBerry wannabe. Microsoft is notably not just copying Apple. HP/Palm also. Mostly just the Android OEMs who seem to wish Android were iOS.

icebraining 15y ago
Nokia did have slide to unlock way before the iPhone: http://netdna.webdesignerdepot.com/uploads/cellphone_design/dkmb86g_438fwgxrnfn_b.jpg http://netdna.webdesignerdepot.com/uploads/cellphone_design/... This is a clear case of adding "...on a computer" like that was some great revolutionary advance. It isn't. It's the obvious translation of an existing concept.
- tjogin 15y ago
  Good design seems obvious in hindsight, but there is no denying that Apple are often the first to either do something, or the first to make something work. And then everyone copies that thing. Doesn't mean I like software patents, just saying.
- sjs 15y ago
  Many great ideas are obvious in hindsight. If it was so obvious why had nobody done it? Would you say, "Oh Amazon? Whatever they're not doing anything new. They're just selling shit except their store is on the web. Big deal, that's not innovative just because they're doing it on a computer." My mom owned a Nokia slider back in the late 1900s, but the model preceding that one. If Nokia had kept making top-end phones like those were in their day I would probably still be buying Nokias. I swore by them. You could drop them, throw them, soak them, anything. Dry it out, take it apart, and it was fine. About 7-10 years ago, with a lot of their models, the worst case scenario was you bought a new case. And the UI was actually quite good, definitely superior to other phones of the time (that I tried anyway). I had a Nokia phone from the late 1900s until 2008. The last Nokia product I bought is the n810 and it was not very good. I loved the idea but the execution was poor (and I got the 3rd version). I rarely used it and then never used it once I got an iPhone. The iPhone 3GS was a better browser than the Internet Tablet, better GPS (it's using other location data but I don't care, it's still better), and happened to also be my mp3 player and phone. It's sad to see Nokia today, I really hope they can turn around but I have less hope for Nokia than I do for webOS :(