20 ms·

Yes, because we all know that when we run these systems outselves, they never go down.

by ttyS0 15y ago

e1ven 15y ago
I've done this quite a bit myself, and I know it can certainly go down. But at least then I can do something about it.. As it is, it feels like my requests are going into a blackhole. This is very important to us, but to Google, we're just another tiny startup.
chaosmachine 15y ago
When Google breaks, you're basically stuck waiting for them. If your own system breaks, at least you can attempt to fix it.
- jrockway 15y ago
  When your hosting company goes down, you're basically stuck waiting for them. The only way to ensure that you never have downtime is to not use the Internet, and keep all your servers connected to a nuclear reactor, all inside a mountain. That covers power and not being flooded or hit by a tornado, anyway. Even then you'd better be careful not to trip over any of the power cables or type "rm -rf /" as root.
  - e1ven 15y ago
    For mission critical things, you want to reduce the points of failure, and ensure that when things DO go wrong, you have a reasonable escalation path. It's now been over 8 hours since it went down, and no fix from Google yet. 4+ days on the missing file. If I was running in house, I could have entirely restored the mail server from tape by now. I could have swapped over to a hot-spare in a few minutes. I could have failed over to our backup internet service. I have a lot of options. With Google, my option is to wait.. And hope my business doesn't lose too much money while Google gets around to fixing it.
    - jgarmon 15y ago
      Okay e1ven, call this number 1.800.571.4984. Ask for Ryan. Or, if your prefer, email ryan@backupify.com or tweet @ryanatbackupify. He's our inside sales guy. Backupify can't get your lost file back, but if it happens again, we can make sure its restored in minutes, not days (or never). 30-day trial of our premium product, for you or anybody else who reads this post. http://www.backupify.com/business/500 http://www.backupify.com/business/500
      - jrockway 15y ago
        People tend not to like accounts that only post to advertise one company.
        jgarmon 15y ago
        Fair point. Sorry if I overstepped.
    - beambot 15y ago
      As another example of handling cloud services going offline, consider this case by SmugMug: http://don.blogs.smugmug.com/2007/01/30/amazon-s3-outages-slowdowns-and-problems/ http://don.blogs.smugmug.com/2007/01/30/amazon-s3-outages-sl... """So what are we doing differently? Simple. Amazon serves as “cold storage” where everyone’s valuable photos go to live in safety. Our own storage clusters are now “hot storage” for photos that need to be served up fast and furious to the millions of unique visitors we get every day. That’s a bit of an oversimplification of our architecture, as you can imagine, but it’s mostly accurate.""" You can always maintain a hot-backup, fail-over of your site on your own servers -- perhaps with reduced functionality until the scalable cloud services come back online. For a mission-critical site, this would seem to be a reasonable tradeoff.
      - jlangenauer 15y ago
        Are you, by chance, a Python programmer?
- zalew 15y ago
  in other words: if google goes down, you can do other work meanwhile or go to lunch, if your system goes down, you have to spend your time/money to fix it.
  - ry0ohki 15y ago
    If Google got things fixed over a lunch I would entirely agree with you. The problem is they take days to get started, don't give you much feedback about what the problem is, and I've never actually had a bug ticket fixed. So, yes you can keep on doing work, but you also will keep on not getting emails/business.

Yes, because we all know that when we run these systems outselves, they never go down.

by ttyS0 15y ago

Yes, because we all know that when we run these systems outselves, they never go down.

e1ven 15y ago

I've done this quite a bit myself, and I know it can certainly go down. But at least then I can do something about it.. As it is, it feels like my requests are going into a blackhole. This is very important to us, but to Google, we're just another tiny startup.

chaosmachine 15y ago

When Google breaks, you're basically stuck waiting for them. If your own system breaks, at least you can attempt to fix it.

jrockway 15y ago
When your hosting company goes down, you're basically stuck waiting for them. The only way to ensure that you never have downtime is to not use the Internet, and keep all your servers connected to a nuclear reactor, all inside a mountain. That covers power and not being flooded or hit by a tornado, anyway. Even then you'd better be careful not to trip over any of the power cables or type "rm -rf /" as root.
- e1ven 15y ago
  For mission critical things, you want to reduce the points of failure, and ensure that when things DO go wrong, you have a reasonable escalation path. It's now been over 8 hours since it went down, and no fix from Google yet. 4+ days on the missing file. If I was running in house, I could have entirely restored the mail server from tape by now. I could have swapped over to a hot-spare in a few minutes. I could have failed over to our backup internet service. I have a lot of options. With Google, my option is to wait.. And hope my business doesn't lose too much money while Google gets around to fixing it.
  - jgarmon 15y ago
    Okay e1ven, call this number 1.800.571.4984. Ask for Ryan. Or, if your prefer, email ryan@backupify.com or tweet @ryanatbackupify. He's our inside sales guy. Backupify can't get your lost file back, but if it happens again, we can make sure its restored in minutes, not days (or never). 30-day trial of our premium product, for you or anybody else who reads this post. http://www.backupify.com/business/500 http://www.backupify.com/business/500
    - jrockway 15y ago
      People tend not to like accounts that only post to advertise one company.
      - jgarmon 15y ago
        Fair point. Sorry if I overstepped.
  - beambot 15y ago
    As another example of handling cloud services going offline, consider this case by SmugMug: http://don.blogs.smugmug.com/2007/01/30/amazon-s3-outages-slowdowns-and-problems/ http://don.blogs.smugmug.com/2007/01/30/amazon-s3-outages-sl... """So what are we doing differently? Simple. Amazon serves as “cold storage” where everyone’s valuable photos go to live in safety. Our own storage clusters are now “hot storage” for photos that need to be served up fast and furious to the millions of unique visitors we get every day. That’s a bit of an oversimplification of our architecture, as you can imagine, but it’s mostly accurate.""" You can always maintain a hot-backup, fail-over of your site on your own servers -- perhaps with reduced functionality until the scalable cloud services come back online. For a mission-critical site, this would seem to be a reasonable tradeoff.
    - jlangenauer 15y ago
      Are you, by chance, a Python programmer?
zalew 15y ago
in other words: if google goes down, you can do other work meanwhile or go to lunch, if your system goes down, you have to spend your time/money to fix it.
- ry0ohki 15y ago
  If Google got things fixed over a lunch I would entirely agree with you. The problem is they take days to get started, don't give you much feedback about what the problem is, and I've never actually had a bug ticket fixed. So, yes you can keep on doing work, but you also will keep on not getting emails/business.