6 ms·

This is stupid. If the elephant is going to be shot by a warden anyway, WHY NOT let some rich american shoot it? Why does it matter WHO shoots the elephant? It

by orbenn 15y ago

This is stupid. If the elephant is going to be shot by a warden anyway, WHY NOT let some rich american shoot it? Why does it matter WHO shoots the elephant? It doesn't! If you want to argue about whether the elephant SHOULD have been killed, that's fine. There is plenty to debate there. But who does the shooting is of no importance. That said he's right that as a CEO you represent your company--especially when you're handing out swag. Probably not a smart PR move.

protomyth 15y ago
It has precious little to do with the legality or morality of the action. Circumstances don't really matter here. What "matters" is that you have a picture and video clip that can fuel a he said / she said segment on all the 24 hour news channels and various organizations now have something they can spin for their own purposes. CEOs should know better.
- peterwwillis 15y ago
  And they do. Any publicity is good publicity.
  - protomyth 15y ago
    "Any publicity is good publicity" - tell that to Enron and Lindsay Lohan.
    - peterwwillis 15y ago
      What in the world does Enron have to do with a publicity stunt? They committed fraud and went bankrupt. How is that like shooting an elephant and putting it on youtube? And Lohan, she's still making movies. Where's the problem?
      - protomyth 15y ago
        Well, Ms. Lohan has been bounced from a couple of movies now due to her publicity, and the quote didn't have "stunt" in it and Enron certainly became a household name but not in a good way.
run4yourlives 15y ago
Because basic supply and demand suggests that their are way more rich Americans wanting to shoot elephants than there are elephants in need of shooting. Ergo: the idea itself isn't sustainable, economically or morally.
- ryanwatkins 15y ago
  Charge them a license fee to shoot the elephants in need of shooting, and increase that fee until supply meets demand. Now its sustainable economically, if possibly not morally.
  - xyzzyz 15y ago
    If only elephant supply was so easy to control...
  - run4yourlives 15y ago
    Yes because rich and stable African governments are completely able to ensure their wildlife is protected properly in the same way a western country can. I like the free market too, but let's be reasonable here. We can dump money into Africa at far greater levels than they can sustainably support.
Tichy 15y ago
He explained it - it gives an incentive for marking more elephants as "problem elephants" than needed. I wonder if a couple of fence (electric) might be a better solution than shooting the elephant. And all I saw in the video was a couple of square meters of trampled grass. I wonder what animal court in the world would give the death sentence for that.
- bpodgursky 15y ago
  It might look just like trampled grass, to you, but it's Sorghum (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sorghum http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sorghum) which a subsistence farmer was growing so he could feed himself, and to him it was the difference between eating and starving. It's ridiculous to glibly dismiss the farmer's worries about STARVING because you didn't see much damage in the video. And do you really think a poor village in remote Zimbabwe is going to have the electricity (and money) to put up an electric fence around all their fields?
  - Tichy 15y ago
    Would I be very far off if I would guess that a single photo safari for taking pictures of living elephants would earn more money than the whole village makes in farming the whole year? Maybe they can't afford electric fences, but the GoDaddy guy surely could. Also now I remember in the Zoo they also don't have electric fences. It sounds doable to me - certainly not more effort than for example building those rice terraces other countries seem to manage. Maybe these farmers really have no choice, which would be a purely political problem. They are definitely picking the wrong solution, though.
    - ars 15y ago
      Do they even have electrical service in that village - and more specifically in some distant field?
      - Tichy 15y ago
        I don't think electricity is needed, just some wall or burrow. Or even just some trees?
isleyaardvark 15y ago
He addressed that in the article: because "there is an immediate opportunity to mark more animals than needed as 'problematic' or 'diseased' than is really the case and that would cloud the issue considerably." As a thought experiment imagine some rich guy offers a tremendous amount of money (let's say millions) to allow authorities to perform an execution of a death row inmate. To allow that would be playing with fire. The government now has a financial interest in having more inmates on death row, as opposed to simply serving the public interest.
lupatus 15y ago
I wonder what the best way to cook corn-fed elephant is? Maybe montreal steak seasoning, a cajun dry-rub, southern-style malt vinegar bbq sauce, something else (http://funkymunky.co.za/elephantstew.html http://funkymunky.co.za/elephantstew.html)? But, seriously, if we as a society are so concerned about dwindling elephant numbers, why aren't we actively managing them as a luxury food source instead of leaving them to their own devices on the savannah where they frequently(?) tick-off the locals. Why aren't there enterprising elephant ranchers in the open spaces of Texas? I would think that mesquite-scrub country would be great elephant habitat. That rancher is going to make damn sure he has a sustainable population of elephants, because if he doesn't, there goes his livelihood. And, I imagine that the rancher could profit handsomely off of just the pure novelty of the product. I know I would pay quite a bit for elephant steaks.

by orbenn 15y ago

protomyth 15y ago

It has precious little to do with the legality or morality of the action. Circumstances don't really matter here. What "matters" is that you have a picture and video clip that can fuel a he said / she said segment on all the 24 hour news channels and various organizations now have something they can spin for their own purposes. CEOs should know better.

peterwwillis 15y ago
And they do. Any publicity is good publicity.
- protomyth 15y ago
  "Any publicity is good publicity" - tell that to Enron and Lindsay Lohan.
  - peterwwillis 15y ago
    What in the world does Enron have to do with a publicity stunt? They committed fraud and went bankrupt. How is that like shooting an elephant and putting it on youtube? And Lohan, she's still making movies. Where's the problem?
    - protomyth 15y ago
      Well, Ms. Lohan has been bounced from a couple of movies now due to her publicity, and the quote didn't have "stunt" in it and Enron certainly became a household name but not in a good way.

run4yourlives 15y ago

Because basic supply and demand suggests that their are way more rich Americans wanting to shoot elephants than there are elephants in need of shooting. Ergo: the idea itself isn't sustainable, economically or morally.

ryanwatkins 15y ago
Charge them a license fee to shoot the elephants in need of shooting, and increase that fee until supply meets demand. Now its sustainable economically, if possibly not morally.
- xyzzyz 15y ago
  If only elephant supply was so easy to control...
- run4yourlives 15y ago
  Yes because rich and stable African governments are completely able to ensure their wildlife is protected properly in the same way a western country can. I like the free market too, but let's be reasonable here. We can dump money into Africa at far greater levels than they can sustainably support.

Tichy 15y ago

He explained it - it gives an incentive for marking more elephants as "problem elephants" than needed. I wonder if a couple of fence (electric) might be a better solution than shooting the elephant. And all I saw in the video was a couple of square meters of trampled grass. I wonder what animal court in the world would give the death sentence for that.

bpodgursky 15y ago
It might look just like trampled grass, to you, but it's Sorghum (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sorghum http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sorghum) which a subsistence farmer was growing so he could feed himself, and to him it was the difference between eating and starving. It's ridiculous to glibly dismiss the farmer's worries about STARVING because you didn't see much damage in the video. And do you really think a poor village in remote Zimbabwe is going to have the electricity (and money) to put up an electric fence around all their fields?
- Tichy 15y ago
  Would I be very far off if I would guess that a single photo safari for taking pictures of living elephants would earn more money than the whole village makes in farming the whole year? Maybe they can't afford electric fences, but the GoDaddy guy surely could. Also now I remember in the Zoo they also don't have electric fences. It sounds doable to me - certainly not more effort than for example building those rice terraces other countries seem to manage. Maybe these farmers really have no choice, which would be a purely political problem. They are definitely picking the wrong solution, though.
  - ars 15y ago
    Do they even have electrical service in that village - and more specifically in some distant field?
    - Tichy 15y ago
      I don't think electricity is needed, just some wall or burrow. Or even just some trees?

isleyaardvark 15y ago

He addressed that in the article: because "there is an immediate opportunity to mark more animals than needed as 'problematic' or 'diseased' than is really the case and that would cloud the issue considerably." As a thought experiment imagine some rich guy offers a tremendous amount of money (let's say millions) to allow authorities to perform an execution of a death row inmate. To allow that would be playing with fire. The government now has a financial interest in having more inmates on death row, as opposed to simply serving the public interest.

lupatus 15y ago

I wonder what the best way to cook corn-fed elephant is? Maybe montreal steak seasoning, a cajun dry-rub, southern-style malt vinegar bbq sauce, something else (http://funkymunky.co.za/elephantstew.html http://funkymunky.co.za/elephantstew.html)? But, seriously, if we as a society are so concerned about dwindling elephant numbers, why aren't we actively managing them as a luxury food source instead of leaving them to their own devices on the savannah where they frequently(?) tick-off the locals. Why aren't there enterprising elephant ranchers in the open spaces of Texas? I would think that mesquite-scrub country would be great elephant habitat. That rancher is going to make damn sure he has a sustainable population of elephants, because if he doesn't, there goes his livelihood. And, I imagine that the rancher could profit handsomely off of just the pure novelty of the product. I know I would pay quite a bit for elephant steaks.