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> By one count 48 million people in China lack sufficient drinking water. The number of people facing severe drinking water shortages doubled to 5.9 million in

by blue4 8y ago

> By one count 48 million people in China lack sufficient drinking water. The number of people facing severe drinking water shortages doubled to 5.9 million in early 2008 because of a severe winter drought. China has more than a fifth of the world's population but only 7 percent of its fresh water. Not from the article, but if there was a startup needed and one that could jump start their sector there, a significant problem to solve is clean water.

adventured 8y ago
What's China's position when it comes to desalination? I'd expect they have massive desalination plants along their large coast.
- yorwba 8y ago
  Apparently there are desalination plants, but they are not cost-competitive with other freshwater sources, so only industrial developments that are required to provide their own water supply use them. https://www.technologyreview.com/s/601861/chinas-massive-effort-to-purify-seawater-is-drying-up/ https://www.technologyreview.com/s/601861/chinas-massive-eff...
- exabrial 8y ago
  The problem isn't the lack of fresh water sources, the distribution network is riddled with pathogens. This is due to poor design and workers taking shortcuts (not performing sanitation steps to meet deadlines).
- baybal2 8y ago
  China has enormous amount of freshwater, it's just not managed properly. Pakistan - same story.
ElBarto 8y ago
This is an infrastructure problem. A startup isn't going to solve this. Between lack of water and unsafe water, I'm not sure that the proportion in the US is much different.
- rockxloose 8y ago
  > This is an infrastructure problem. A startup isn't going to solve this. Opportunity in the Himalayas. Bottle the snow melt rivers flowing in unbelievable blue before they turn shitbrown. Did Steve Jobs get cancer in China from drinking contaminated water?
- adventured 8y ago
  > Between lack of water and unsafe water, I'm not sure that the proportion in the US is much different. Care to show me the figures on that? I don't believe for a second that the US and China are comparable on freshwater when it comes to quality and supply. The US is among the top several nations on freshwater per capita and has a truly vast supply of inexpensive, safe water. Flint was/is such a big deal because it's an exception, not the common. Freshwater supply challenges are exclusive to building large cities in deserts (eg Las Vegas), or poor decisions on allocation (eg California agriculture, which is ~80% of their water use).
  - ElBarto 8y ago
    One of the first results on Google: https://eu.usatoday.com/story/news/health/2018/02/12/tens-millions-americans-exposed-unsafe-drinking-water-each-year/330516002/ https://eu.usatoday.com/story/news/health/2018/02/12/tens-mi...
    - adventured 8y ago
      Your result is including all infractions of any type across the board and indicates that poor water safety is rare and isolated. To get the total sum, it's compiled over 34 years, and says: "relatively few community water systems (3–10%) incur health-based violations in a given year." It also states that in the most dense parts of the country, urban regions, there are rarely problems. As well as this conclusion: "Generally, water systems in the United States provide reliable and high-quality drinking water. Violations tend to be infrequent."
      - ElBarto 8y ago
piokoch 8y ago
Unrelated, but interesting in this context: Michael Burry, one of the guys who predicted 2007 housing bubble (and made good money thanks to that), is investing in water. Looks like he might be right again.
- hangonhn 8y ago
  How does one (without access to exotic financial instruments) even do that?
  - vitohuang 8y ago
    There are two sides 1. Buy-side - ETF for companies leading in clean water or purification, or the second level that companies provide components for those companies in the first group. 2. Sell-side - bet on the companies will do badly in the situation e.g big polluters. But the hard thing is timing, you can sit there for decades for the outcome and so many factors can affect your bet between now and then.
- rchaud 8y ago
  In 2007, the reading list for my Political Economy class had a book focused entirely on the water wars of the future. Lack of clean water isn't a hidden opportunity, it's a planet-altering challenge.
rchaud 8y ago
I mean, there are significant environmental problems in the US as well, but that doesn't mean VCs are going to suddenly start moving money away from food delivery and rent-a-bike plays. Access to resources historically is a problem "solved" by military action. VCs will only get in on the action when the resources are secured, and they find a way to insert themselves into the action.
tha_nose 8y ago
China has 7% of the world's fresh water but that 7% can easily sustain every human being on earth. China controls the tibetan plateau which is the source of the water for a significant portion of the world's largest rivers and a source for a significant amount of fresh water. If 48 million people in china lack drinking water, that's a problem of resource management rather than resource. China has a 5th of the world's population but they also have ridiculously rich soil along it's many large rivers - especially towards the southern portion of china. The same thing with india. They have immensely rich lands that can support a huge number of people. Unlike canada who has a lot of freshwater but is mostly frozen tundra. This is why stats are so deceiving. India is about 1/4th the size of siberia but india can support 1000X the population of siberia because india's land/soil is rich and productive while siberia is not.

by blue4 8y ago

adventured 8y ago

What's China's position when it comes to desalination? I'd expect they have massive desalination plants along their large coast.

yorwba 8y ago
Apparently there are desalination plants, but they are not cost-competitive with other freshwater sources, so only industrial developments that are required to provide their own water supply use them. https://www.technologyreview.com/s/601861/chinas-massive-effort-to-purify-seawater-is-drying-up/ https://www.technologyreview.com/s/601861/chinas-massive-eff...
exabrial 8y ago
The problem isn't the lack of fresh water sources, the distribution network is riddled with pathogens. This is due to poor design and workers taking shortcuts (not performing sanitation steps to meet deadlines).
baybal2 8y ago
China has enormous amount of freshwater, it's just not managed properly. Pakistan - same story.

ElBarto 8y ago

This is an infrastructure problem. A startup isn't going to solve this. Between lack of water and unsafe water, I'm not sure that the proportion in the US is much different.

rockxloose 8y ago
> This is an infrastructure problem. A startup isn't going to solve this. Opportunity in the Himalayas. Bottle the snow melt rivers flowing in unbelievable blue before they turn shitbrown. Did Steve Jobs get cancer in China from drinking contaminated water?
adventured 8y ago
> Between lack of water and unsafe water, I'm not sure that the proportion in the US is much different. Care to show me the figures on that? I don't believe for a second that the US and China are comparable on freshwater when it comes to quality and supply. The US is among the top several nations on freshwater per capita and has a truly vast supply of inexpensive, safe water. Flint was/is such a big deal because it's an exception, not the common. Freshwater supply challenges are exclusive to building large cities in deserts (eg Las Vegas), or poor decisions on allocation (eg California agriculture, which is ~80% of their water use).
- ElBarto 8y ago
  One of the first results on Google: https://eu.usatoday.com/story/news/health/2018/02/12/tens-millions-americans-exposed-unsafe-drinking-water-each-year/330516002/ https://eu.usatoday.com/story/news/health/2018/02/12/tens-mi...
  - adventured 8y ago
    Your result is including all infractions of any type across the board and indicates that poor water safety is rare and isolated. To get the total sum, it's compiled over 34 years, and says: "relatively few community water systems (3–10%) incur health-based violations in a given year." It also states that in the most dense parts of the country, urban regions, there are rarely problems. As well as this conclusion: "Generally, water systems in the United States provide reliable and high-quality drinking water. Violations tend to be infrequent."
    - ElBarto 8y ago

piokoch 8y ago

Unrelated, but interesting in this context: Michael Burry, one of the guys who predicted 2007 housing bubble (and made good money thanks to that), is investing in water. Looks like he might be right again.

hangonhn 8y ago
How does one (without access to exotic financial instruments) even do that?
- vitohuang 8y ago
  There are two sides 1. Buy-side - ETF for companies leading in clean water or purification, or the second level that companies provide components for those companies in the first group. 2. Sell-side - bet on the companies will do badly in the situation e.g big polluters. But the hard thing is timing, you can sit there for decades for the outcome and so many factors can affect your bet between now and then.
rchaud 8y ago
In 2007, the reading list for my Political Economy class had a book focused entirely on the water wars of the future. Lack of clean water isn't a hidden opportunity, it's a planet-altering challenge.

rchaud 8y ago

I mean, there are significant environmental problems in the US as well, but that doesn't mean VCs are going to suddenly start moving money away from food delivery and rent-a-bike plays. Access to resources historically is a problem "solved" by military action. VCs will only get in on the action when the resources are secured, and they find a way to insert themselves into the action.

tha_nose 8y ago

China has 7% of the world's fresh water but that 7% can easily sustain every human being on earth. China controls the tibetan plateau which is the source of the water for a significant portion of the world's largest rivers and a source for a significant amount of fresh water. If 48 million people in china lack drinking water, that's a problem of resource management rather than resource. China has a 5th of the world's population but they also have ridiculously rich soil along it's many large rivers - especially towards the southern portion of china. The same thing with india. They have immensely rich lands that can support a huge number of people. Unlike canada who has a lot of freshwater but is mostly frozen tundra. This is why stats are so deceiving. India is about 1/4th the size of siberia but india can support 1000X the population of siberia because india's land/soil is rich and productive while siberia is not.