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I'd love to switch to BSD, but > Docker on FreeBSD is experimental. https://wiki.freebsd.org/Docker https://wiki.freebsd.org/Docker I don't want to run yet a

I'd love to switch to BSD, but > Docker on FreeBSD is experimental. https://wiki.freebsd.org/Docker https://wiki.freebsd.org/Docker I don't want to run yet another operating system just to have to run VMs on top of it...

deathtrader666 8y ago
Why not use FreeBSD jails?
- bauerd 8y ago
  * Because my company runs OCI images (aka uses Docker), not jails. * Because you can't orchestrate jails with Kubernetes, and that's what my company uses. Docker won over the industry, jails and friends did not.
  - kev009 8y ago
    It really didn't. I can tell you with first hand knowledge the majority of the internet by any measure, but especially high scale systems where I've worked and know much of the small community, use neither Docker nor Kubernetes. That's not any indictment on either technology it's just simple fact. Fad tech appears a much bigger tiger in echo chambers like this website but the majority of the companies aren't even using languages that are popular to this crowd let alone tooling. Whether or not these tools have staying power or contribute meaningfully to the industry the jury is still out on, and will have to wait about 5 years to tell. In the past you "were an idiot" if you weren't using C++ or CORBA or RPC or Java or SOAP or message queues or Ruby on Rails or AWS or or Hadoop or OpenStack or blockchain or machine learning or.. all of these are fads and all that mattered then and now for consumers of the tech is solving business problems cost effectively. Software developers are an incredibly easy demographic to influence with marketing. There is an industry of startups that have been minting money on this for a long time. But it's important to know that a lot of software development tools we use are just fashion statements.
    - bauerd 8y ago
      It's not about current market share but about adoption rates. Which container technology/toolset/ecosystem is more likely to be adopted by the average software shop today?
      - kev009 8y ago
        It's the wrong question unless you are in the business of profiting off of container tech directly. What are you doing for the stakeholders delegating your pay checks and the person authorized to fire you? If they are happy, then it doesn't matter what the company uses. Most transactions and the world's wealth are stored and processed on operating systems and frameworks most people have never heard of which will outlast either of these by decades but that doesn't mean you should or shouldn't use them necessarily..
        bauerd 8y ago
        I'm well aware that there's tons of time proven software that serves us well and will continue to do so for some decades. Yes, most of this is not written in the PL/framework combo du jour, true. You seem to think I want everyone to switch to Docker/Kubernetes. I don't.
        kev009 8y ago
        Fair enough, and the parent topic about /switching/ between broadly similar technology like operating systems is where departments usually go awry. My axe to grind is about initial selection when starting from scratch (do you really need fad tech? Statistically, likely not), or playing nicely in an existing environment and being very careful with new tech (can the company internalize and support fad tech? Statistically, likely not)
        bauerd 8y ago
        OP asked what stops people from switching to BSD. I agreed that for me, too, the missing Docker toolchain/runtime is a dealbreaker for me, as I have to work with these technologies on a daily basis. As Docker and friends see rapid adoption, others will think twice whether they switch to a BSD and have to run a Linux VM, too. I'm not sure what you're after here. You seem to think that Docker and Kubernetes are "fad technology" and are inferior to some alternative? Which orchestrator would you recommend? Which container tech?

deathtrader666 8y ago

Why not use FreeBSD jails?

bauerd 8y ago
* Because my company runs OCI images (aka uses Docker), not jails. * Because you can't orchestrate jails with Kubernetes, and that's what my company uses. Docker won over the industry, jails and friends did not.
- kev009 8y ago
  It really didn't. I can tell you with first hand knowledge the majority of the internet by any measure, but especially high scale systems where I've worked and know much of the small community, use neither Docker nor Kubernetes. That's not any indictment on either technology it's just simple fact. Fad tech appears a much bigger tiger in echo chambers like this website but the majority of the companies aren't even using languages that are popular to this crowd let alone tooling. Whether or not these tools have staying power or contribute meaningfully to the industry the jury is still out on, and will have to wait about 5 years to tell. In the past you "were an idiot" if you weren't using C++ or CORBA or RPC or Java or SOAP or message queues or Ruby on Rails or AWS or or Hadoop or OpenStack or blockchain or machine learning or.. all of these are fads and all that mattered then and now for consumers of the tech is solving business problems cost effectively. Software developers are an incredibly easy demographic to influence with marketing. There is an industry of startups that have been minting money on this for a long time. But it's important to know that a lot of software development tools we use are just fashion statements.
  - bauerd 8y ago
    It's not about current market share but about adoption rates. Which container technology/toolset/ecosystem is more likely to be adopted by the average software shop today?
    - kev009 8y ago
      It's the wrong question unless you are in the business of profiting off of container tech directly. What are you doing for the stakeholders delegating your pay checks and the person authorized to fire you? If they are happy, then it doesn't matter what the company uses. Most transactions and the world's wealth are stored and processed on operating systems and frameworks most people have never heard of which will outlast either of these by decades but that doesn't mean you should or shouldn't use them necessarily..
      - bauerd 8y ago
        I'm well aware that there's tons of time proven software that serves us well and will continue to do so for some decades. Yes, most of this is not written in the PL/framework combo du jour, true. You seem to think I want everyone to switch to Docker/Kubernetes. I don't.
        kev009 8y ago
        Fair enough, and the parent topic about /switching/ between broadly similar technology like operating systems is where departments usually go awry. My axe to grind is about initial selection when starting from scratch (do you really need fad tech? Statistically, likely not), or playing nicely in an existing environment and being very careful with new tech (can the company internalize and support fad tech? Statistically, likely not)
        bauerd 8y ago
        OP asked what stops people from switching to BSD. I agreed that for me, too, the missing Docker toolchain/runtime is a dealbreaker for me, as I have to work with these technologies on a daily basis. As Docker and friends see rapid adoption, others will think twice whether they switch to a BSD and have to run a Linux VM, too. I'm not sure what you're after here. You seem to think that Docker and Kubernetes are "fad technology" and are inferior to some alternative? Which orchestrator would you recommend? Which container tech?