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It's silly to say that a student should only go to college if they can afford to do it with no loans. I think a large part of the "student loan" problem is that

It's silly to say that a student should only go to college if they can afford to do it with no loans. I think a large part of the "student loan" problem is that we don't talk about income enough. It is completely reasonable for a comp sci major from a good school to graduate with $75k in loans ($900 payments). That will not be a burden for them. Likewise, a $20k student loan ($300 payments) should be manageable for someone who makes $40k a year. The issue is when the person who only real prospects pay $40k a year and they have $75k in loans.

paulpauper 8y ago
agree. when you break-down the math, it's not that big of a big deal.
okmokmz 8y ago
I was admitted to a relatively competitive university's (<10% acceptance rate) computer science program, but it would mean I would have to take on just over 100k of debt. After the first year I chose to transfer to a local community college to earn an associates, and then trasnfer to a state school. I was hired after my associates, got my bachelors paid for and completed it online, and graduated with no debt. I'm extremely happy I made the change, rather than paying 100k for a bachelor. Sure, I could've afforded it, but instead I was able to purchase a car in cash and buy a house pretty much straight out of school. I wouldn't recommend anyone go into debt for a bachelor; in my opinion the money could be better spent elsewhere, and it is unlikely to make a significant difference in position/pay having a name brand degree rather than something from a state school
- hellogoodbyeeee 8y ago
  I take a lot of pride in my liberal arts education and how it shaped my world view. I would never in a thousand years trade it in for a car and a house... And it cost less too.
  - geggam 8y ago
    Cant live in a degree or drive it to work, how you feel about things and their actual value might need some perspective shifting.
    - hellogoodbyeeee 8y ago
      Funny, no one has ever asked me whether or not I own a brand new car or own my own house in a job interview. However, every interview has asked me about my college education. Maybe you are the one who needs to reevaluate their priorities.
      - geggam 8y ago
        Revisit this thought 20 years from now when you finally finish paying off that loan and still have no place to sleep.
        hellogoodbyeeee 8y ago
        Who are you angry at? My loans will be paid off in less than four years from now (7 total) and possibly as little as two more years (if I can figure out how to not eat out so much...). My college education was a fantastic investment.
        geggam 8y ago
        I am not angry at all. I watched people around me in the same situation as you, job right out of school with a good payment plan have life happen and suddenly that 4 yr plan turned into 20. That was with much much lower debt than anyone I see today having.
        hellogoodbyeeee 8y ago
        All I can say is that my repayment plan is speeding up and not slowing down.
i88y6 8y ago
What's silly is to ever allow an institution to take 10% or more of your earnings. Unless they're doing 10% of the work for you, they're not entitled to any claim to the earnings. All that does is perpetuate the gatekeeper fallacy that somehow you need to "pay your dues (to the institution)"
notfromhere 8y ago
No one should owe 75k for a bachelors, and having educational loans take up 20% of your post-tax income for a decade is beyond ridiculous.
- toasterlovin 8y ago
  If you owe $75k for a bachelors that isn't a STEM degree from a top tier school, you're Doing It Wrong™.
- hellogoodbyeeee 8y ago
  Minimum student loan payments are fixed while your income should grow. What starts out as 20% of your first paycheck won't be 20% by year five.
  - WorldMaker 8y ago
    "Should" being a huge keyword there. Labor wage growth in general has barely kept up with inflation, on average. The software industry bubbles have kept it largely immune to this and overall still seems to be seeing relatively strong wage growth in certain cities and sectors, but there's no guarantee that will continue. Not to mention that with the time value of money, 20% of your first paycheck isn't just immediately a lot (which it is), it's also a potentially much larger chunk of long term savings and investments potential. But the main argument here remains that a lot of the complaints are the overall slow delay in people with student loan debt engaging with other economic concerns (buying homes, starting families, etc), and all you've done is exactly illuminate why it is considered such a crisis, people are rationally waiting for that "year five" when student loan payments are less than 20% (or whatever high water mark) of their income, rather than starting bigger projects earlier than that.
    - hellogoodbyeeee 8y ago
      Those wage growth numbers discussed are an average. It would be very strange to have someone not have any significant raises between year 0 of their career and year 10.

paulpauper 8y ago

agree. when you break-down the math, it's not that big of a big deal.

okmokmz 8y ago

I was admitted to a relatively competitive university's (<10% acceptance rate) computer science program, but it would mean I would have to take on just over 100k of debt. After the first year I chose to transfer to a local community college to earn an associates, and then trasnfer to a state school. I was hired after my associates, got my bachelors paid for and completed it online, and graduated with no debt. I'm extremely happy I made the change, rather than paying 100k for a bachelor. Sure, I could've afforded it, but instead I was able to purchase a car in cash and buy a house pretty much straight out of school. I wouldn't recommend anyone go into debt for a bachelor; in my opinion the money could be better spent elsewhere, and it is unlikely to make a significant difference in position/pay having a name brand degree rather than something from a state school

hellogoodbyeeee 8y ago
I take a lot of pride in my liberal arts education and how it shaped my world view. I would never in a thousand years trade it in for a car and a house... And it cost less too.
- geggam 8y ago
  Cant live in a degree or drive it to work, how you feel about things and their actual value might need some perspective shifting.
  - hellogoodbyeeee 8y ago
    Funny, no one has ever asked me whether or not I own a brand new car or own my own house in a job interview. However, every interview has asked me about my college education. Maybe you are the one who needs to reevaluate their priorities.
    - geggam 8y ago
      Revisit this thought 20 years from now when you finally finish paying off that loan and still have no place to sleep.
      - hellogoodbyeeee 8y ago
        Who are you angry at? My loans will be paid off in less than four years from now (7 total) and possibly as little as two more years (if I can figure out how to not eat out so much...). My college education was a fantastic investment.
        geggam 8y ago
        I am not angry at all. I watched people around me in the same situation as you, job right out of school with a good payment plan have life happen and suddenly that 4 yr plan turned into 20. That was with much much lower debt than anyone I see today having.
        hellogoodbyeeee 8y ago
        All I can say is that my repayment plan is speeding up and not slowing down.

i88y6 8y ago

What's silly is to ever allow an institution to take 10% or more of your earnings. Unless they're doing 10% of the work for you, they're not entitled to any claim to the earnings. All that does is perpetuate the gatekeeper fallacy that somehow you need to "pay your dues (to the institution)"

notfromhere 8y ago

No one should owe 75k for a bachelors, and having educational loans take up 20% of your post-tax income for a decade is beyond ridiculous.

toasterlovin 8y ago
If you owe $75k for a bachelors that isn't a STEM degree from a top tier school, you're Doing It Wrong™.
hellogoodbyeeee 8y ago
Minimum student loan payments are fixed while your income should grow. What starts out as 20% of your first paycheck won't be 20% by year five.
- WorldMaker 8y ago
  "Should" being a huge keyword there. Labor wage growth in general has barely kept up with inflation, on average. The software industry bubbles have kept it largely immune to this and overall still seems to be seeing relatively strong wage growth in certain cities and sectors, but there's no guarantee that will continue. Not to mention that with the time value of money, 20% of your first paycheck isn't just immediately a lot (which it is), it's also a potentially much larger chunk of long term savings and investments potential. But the main argument here remains that a lot of the complaints are the overall slow delay in people with student loan debt engaging with other economic concerns (buying homes, starting families, etc), and all you've done is exactly illuminate why it is considered such a crisis, people are rationally waiting for that "year five" when student loan payments are less than 20% (or whatever high water mark) of their income, rather than starting bigger projects earlier than that.
  - hellogoodbyeeee 8y ago
    Those wage growth numbers discussed are an average. It would be very strange to have someone not have any significant raises between year 0 of their career and year 10.