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It's interesting blatant stereotypes about Asian and Asian Americans are thrown around like it's acceptable. Would you ever make statements like "it's cultural
by volgo 8y ago
It's interesting blatant stereotypes about Asian and Asian Americans are thrown around like it's acceptable. Would you ever make statements like "it's cultural acceptable for black community to condone thefts and petty crimes, and politicians won't do anythign because it's inconvenient?"
Just because statistics reveal a uptick for one group, does not make it acceptable for you to generalize. It's a racist remark, just so you understand the unconscious bias
- ndnxhs 8y agoIts not just statistics. Its painfully obvious to anyone currently in uni. Every single person I have seen cheating has been Asian. And the teachers do nothing. Had one guy in my class get caught cheating for the 3rd time and still nothing has happened.
- cortesoft 8y agoOh, so the racism isn't based on statistics, it is based on anecdote.
- darawk 8y agoIs it racism to be aware of another culture? What, exactly, makes this racist?
- cortesoft 8y agoI mean, there are a number of racists things. Saying something like "But apparently it is a cultural accepted thing to cheat blatantly in china" and then "Every single person I have seen cheating has been Asian". Imagine if someone said something like "Apparently it is culturally accepted thing for cops to shoot black people" I mean, you can find a ton of examples of this happening, and plenty of examples of nobody doing anything about it. Does that mean it is culturally accepted here?
- darawk 8y ago> I mean, there are a number of racists things. Saying something like "But apparently it is a cultural accepted thing to cheat blatantly in china" Maybe it is culturally accepted in China to cheat? Do you know? Is a statement racist if it is true?
- girvo 8y agoSome argue that yes, it’s still racist even if it’s true. Depends on the context I think.
- blt 8y agoLots of people would criticize USA culture by saying something like "Apparently it is culturally accepted thing for cops to shoot black people". Apparently it is, because we do not see any significant changes being made to the training, regulation, or military equipment of police.
- gpm 8y agoThis isn't racism. It has absolutely nothing to do with race. Most people who hold this view have no negative views against racially asian people who are culturally north american. It is culturist (to make up a word). There's a huge difference between this and racism in that culture, unlike race, creates clear statistical differences in behavior. There are good arguments that discriminating based on culture would have many negative effects, not unlike racism. That as a result of the negative effects we shouldn't treat people differently as a result of the culture they are coming from. Moreover there are already laws in many places attempting to enforce that. Burying your head in the sand and denying that there are culture differences however is insane. It's entirely obvious statistically, and anecdotally that they exist. Burying your head in the sand is exactly what you (or rather volgo) are suggesting when you are saying that people shouldn't be making statements about the differences between cultures.
- anu7df 8y agoSince we are dabbling in anecdotes.. I am not sure if you are including Indians in this "Asians cheat" assertion. This Indian for one was brought up with the philosophy that knowledge / teachers are identical to God. Whether or not I believe in God is a different question. However it was always clear that cheating in exams was not culturally accepted. Not by a long shot. There is an extremely unhealthy emphasis on grades, but cheating in all it's forms was looked down upon.
- yomritoyj 8y agoI'm an Indian teaching Indians in India, and there are quite a few students who don't see anything wrong in cheating. Not to say anything about the blatant cases of cheating and mass cheating in school-leaving exams that regularly make the news in India. I can't say if cheating is more of less acceptable in India than elsewhere, and for sure very many students in India are honest and genuinely interested in learning, but people treating knowledge and teachers as divine is far from reality.
- volgo 8y agoIt's also painfully obvious to anyone who lived in large urban centers in US that certain races steal statistically more than other races. Do you make a comment about that? No, because you have no context and you'll likely be shunned in polite society. You have a James Damore syndrome and probably will not help you in your career
- ndnxhs 8y agoI dont live in the US so I don't comment on these things but others do regularly.
- allthenews 8y agoNo. What is "interesting" is the blatant disregard for facts because of the association that they have with race. There is no question at this point that Chinese culture encourages cheating. It has been written about in media, it's all over Amazon, IP theft is a known issue, and it is ALL OVER universities. I regularly had Chinese students sitting in the back of class openly whispering during exams, while professors for some inane reason turned blind eyes. My anecdote is not unique. Facts do not change simply by being denied, and the fact that a pattern of behavior is associated with a nationality or race does not mean it should be swept under the rug. Problems are only solved when they are identified. >Would you ever make statements like "it's cultural acceptable for black community to condone it's cultural acceptable for black community to condone thefts and petty crimes, and politicians won't do anythign because it's inconvenient? If statistics showed such, then yes, any sane person would say that. Also ironic that ignoring only negative cultural differences is a privileged Western affordance - our friends make no such mistakes in China and much of Asia, speaking as someone who lived in the region for years.
- volgo 8y agoSorry it's sad you can't recognize your unconscious bias. The good news is that people like you are shunned in the modern work place. Good luck
- allthenews 8y agoFeel free to point out the irrationality of any part of my post. You are resolving your cognitive dissonance by ignoring documented differences among cultures, which is fundamentally illogical. This seems to be an increasingly common pattern "in the modern workplace" and outside of it too. What you should instead be doing is accepting that cultures are varied, but individuals must be given the benefit of the doubt in an ethical society.
- cortesoft 8y agoThe irrationality is assuming that you are able to be an impartial observer who can 'regularly' notice 'Chinese students sitting in the back of class openly whispering during exams' and that means that Chinese people cheat more. We have so much evidence that these sorts of observations can so often be wrong. You are likely to not notice all the majority group people doing this, or at least not connect it as a pattern. Once you have an expectation that Chinese people are cheating, you are more likely to see innocent behavior as cheating, or even if they ARE cheating, more likely to catch them than the white guy sitting next to you also cheating (because you are paying more attention to the person you EXPECT to be cheating) Now, of course, this could be wrong and your observations could be right. The irrationality comes in assuming you are right just because you observe something.
- biggio 8y agoPersonally I think all exams or any academic assessment should be open book/whatever. Entire class should be allowed to find solutions together with whatever means possible and there should not be time limit.
- vymague 8y agoSo, like group projects?
- biggio 8y agoI think people mostly waste time at the universities learning things they will forget. Giving students a novel problem to solve and ask them to come back when they find the solution might work better in terms of sticking knowledge. This doesn't necessarily need to be a group project.
- salty_biscuits 8y agoIt would be great for learning, but requires an enormous amount of work for the academics involved. That side is pretty important in explaining why the system is the way it is. It is due to have some novel ideas injected about how to balance effectiveness and efficiency.
- omegaham 8y agoWhat do you do when large numbers of people don't care, and are content to leech off the few conscientious students who actually want to learn the material? This was a normal state of affairs during my undergrad at a crappy community college and state university. Group projects were a nightmare. --- The best classes that I've taken have been "Feel free to collaborate, but turn in your own work." It allows people to work together on hard problems, but the slackers still fail.
- yesenadam 8y agoAgain with this SJW nonsense on here. Interesting - such a bland word, it says nothing. Why not say what you mean. Apparently you find it unacceptable, racist and biased. I find your comment ridiculous. If something the GP said was wrong, say so. You just tried to censor him, successfully it seems. I don't understand either of the sentences in your second paragraph. They both contain dubious, condescending claims. Apparently you are the police for this site. Telling others from on high what is not acceptable, what are their "unconscious biases". Who do you think you are? I don't buy it whatsoever. p.s. I submitted Hofstadter's amazing Person Paper on here yesterday, no-one commented. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18044595 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18044595 Edit: Now I'm flagged too, within a minute of posting.
- cmplxconjugate 8y agoWell his statement is definitely excessive, however I would agree that there is a shocking cultural problem with the acceptance of cheating in China. I speak Mandarin and have lived in China, my partner is Chinese. I was shocked during her undergraduate and masters to see just how often cheating took place. Of her close ~8-10 friends, every single one paid for their work to be completed on multiple occasions. It was cheap and quick, and justified with things like “I have to go see a friend for a week, but I need to have the paper written by Thursday”. Costs for most pieces was in the region of $70-120. The cultural attitude is that cheating is only bad unless you’re caught. Otherwise you’re cunning and able to succeed using any method; everyone does it so there’s nothing wrong.
- downrightmike 8y agoNow, notice that I didn't mention "Asians" or "Asian Americans" anywhere. You may be forcing your own perception on something just to vilify it.