5 ms·

Yep, when I see "flat management" I really hesitate to apply. Especially as a minority in tech, I would rather find a hierarchical place with good managers who

by lk145 11y ago

Yep, when I see "flat management" I really hesitate to apply. Especially as a minority in tech, I would rather find a hierarchical place with good managers who value good arguments than trust the herd. Unless you have a team of unusually conscientious engineers, "democratic" or "flat" decision-making often translates to who shouts the loudest. Not to mention engineers often want to complete the project in the most technically exciting way possible, rather than the way that will most benefit the product. Flat structure + too many engineers like that and you end up with this http://www.smbc-comics.com/?id=2597 http://www.smbc-comics.com/?id=2597, written in Haskell.

monksy 11y ago
> "democratic" or "flat" decision-making often translates to who shouts the loudest. Or the one that has the most political capital.
crdoconnor 11y ago
>Not to mention engineers often want to complete the project in the most technically exciting way possible, rather than the way that will most benefit the product. Well, this has a habit of happening everywhere, no matter who is running the show.
codygman 11y ago
> Yep, when I see "flat management" I really hesitate to apply. Especially as a minority in tech, I would rather find a hierarchical place with good managers who value good arguments than trust the herd. If I were a minority or worse at getting along with others I'd definitely avoid flat management schemes as well. > Agreed Unless you have a team of unusually conscientious engineers, "democratic" or "flat" decision-making often translates to who shouts the loudest. > Not to mention engineers often want to complete the project in the most technically exciting way possible, rather than the way that will most benefit the product. Also sadly true and even has a name: Resume Driven Development > Flat structure + too many engineers like that and you end up with this http://www.smbc-comics.com/?id=2597 http://www.smbc-comics.com/?id=2597, written in Haskell. Aww, why pick on Haskell here? You know Bump[0] used Haskell. Point being that Haskell can be a choice which is a choice that most benefits the product. I recently had experience writing an app to deal with medical data sets that really benefited from correct by construction or wholemeal[1] programming. 0: https://www.fpcomplete.com/wp-content/uploads/Bump-case-study.pdf https://www.fpcomplete.com/wp-content/uploads/Bump-case-stud... 1: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/6957270/what-is-wholemeal-in-functional-programming http://stackoverflow.com/questions/6957270/what-is-wholemeal... Noted as a good example in the stack overflow answer: > I always found the Hutton/Bird Sudoku solver a good example of wholemeal programming: http://www.cs.nott.ac.uk/~gmh/sudoku.lhs http://www.cs.nott.ac.uk/~gmh/sudoku.lhs
- lk145 11y ago
  Yeah the Haskell part is mostly tongue and cheek :P I wouldn't use it for any old project but I could see how the benefits of Haskell could outweigh its difficulties in some scenarios. Personally, I like functional programming, but I'm not sure it's suitable for the masses (perhaps some day? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYk8CKH7OhE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYk8CKH7OhE).

by lk145 11y ago

monksy 11y ago

> "democratic" or "flat" decision-making often translates to who shouts the loudest. Or the one that has the most political capital.

crdoconnor 11y ago

>Not to mention engineers often want to complete the project in the most technically exciting way possible, rather than the way that will most benefit the product. Well, this has a habit of happening everywhere, no matter who is running the show.

codygman 11y ago

> Yep, when I see "flat management" I really hesitate to apply. Especially as a minority in tech, I would rather find a hierarchical place with good managers who value good arguments than trust the herd. If I were a minority or worse at getting along with others I'd definitely avoid flat management schemes as well. > Agreed Unless you have a team of unusually conscientious engineers, "democratic" or "flat" decision-making often translates to who shouts the loudest. > Not to mention engineers often want to complete the project in the most technically exciting way possible, rather than the way that will most benefit the product. Also sadly true and even has a name: Resume Driven Development > Flat structure + too many engineers like that and you end up with this http://www.smbc-comics.com/?id=2597 http://www.smbc-comics.com/?id=2597, written in Haskell. Aww, why pick on Haskell here? You know Bump[0] used Haskell. Point being that Haskell can be a choice which is a choice that most benefits the product. I recently had experience writing an app to deal with medical data sets that really benefited from correct by construction or wholemeal[1] programming. 0: https://www.fpcomplete.com/wp-content/uploads/Bump-case-study.pdf https://www.fpcomplete.com/wp-content/uploads/Bump-case-stud... 1: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/6957270/what-is-wholemeal-in-functional-programming http://stackoverflow.com/questions/6957270/what-is-wholemeal... Noted as a good example in the stack overflow answer: > I always found the Hutton/Bird Sudoku solver a good example of wholemeal programming: http://www.cs.nott.ac.uk/~gmh/sudoku.lhs http://www.cs.nott.ac.uk/~gmh/sudoku.lhs

lk145 11y ago
Yeah the Haskell part is mostly tongue and cheek :P I wouldn't use it for any old project but I could see how the benefits of Haskell could outweigh its difficulties in some scenarios. Personally, I like functional programming, but I'm not sure it's suitable for the masses (perhaps some day? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYk8CKH7OhE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYk8CKH7OhE).