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That doesn't make it any less of a hustle and probably why rent-to-own places still get customers. So yeah if you have to have the most expensive phones but can

by bbakkd 11y ago

That doesn't make it any less of a hustle and probably why rent-to-own places still get customers. So yeah if you have to have the most expensive phones but can't afford them you will do this. The thing is they are pretty much forcing everyone into these plans by almost doubling the old plan prices. Plus the old family plans are no longer cheaper if you don't have a smartphone and don't use data--you pay the same price for all phones.

intopieces 11y ago
>That doesn't make it any less of a hustle. Still not quite understanding your use of this word. How can the deal be a fraud or swindle if the terms are given up front? Let's set aside the argument about whether you think it's a good deal or not, as that is not the meaning of the word "hustle". They're not intentionally selling you a defective product masked as a new one. They're not signing you up for something and then changing the terms. As far as I can tell, the word hustle is being used here to mean "trying to convince people that a product is a better deal than it is." But again, this is a matter of opinion and situation. What is a good deal for you may not be available to others because of the up front cost And here again, the math behind the swindle claim doesn't add up. You are still paying the retail price of the phone whether you sign up for two years contract or with Next. AT&T does not lose money on either contract.
- Evolved 11y ago
  It seems what AT&T are trying to do is stop losing money to subsidizing phones since other carriers (T-mobile, for example) are doing this. If this is the case then why not just discontinue the subsidization of phones at the $199, $299, etc. price points and just allow you to buy it at 0% interest if you agree to a 2-year contract. They still get their customer locked in for 2 years and they recover the full cost of the phone and the customer most likely stays loyal since they aren't feeling ripped off. Otherwise, what is keeping them from jumping ship to another carrier if the waters are muddied enough that the phone and the plan become commodities?
  - intopieces 11y ago
    You've pivoted to another topic. The question I asked is: what part of the AT&T Next plan qualifies as a hustle?
    - Evolved 11y ago
      hustle - verb (used without object), hustled, hustling. 3. to be aggressive, especially in business or other financial dealings. 4. Slang. to earn one's living by illicit or unethical means. The hustle part of what I said has to do with the pushyness of the salespeople at AT&T and the unethical part of lying about the pricing (to me when this deal was not better for me even though perhaps it may be better for someone else). I think this meets the prima facie definition of hustle. Hustle doesn't have to mean fraudulent but it can mean shady, unscrupulous or sneaky.
      - m8urn 11y ago
        Another aspect of this is that they make the regular contract plans cost more than twice what they did before, even with a non-smartphone, essentially pushing you into the Next plan.
        Evolved 11y ago
        Can they really do this if you're just upgrading the phone and signing a new contract since you're not required to choose a new plan? If you were absolutely required to choose a new plan when you upgradethen how can people with unlimited data still be grandfathered in?
  - deleted 11y ago
    [deleted]
- Evolved 11y ago
  intentionally selling you a defective product masked as a new one. signing you up for something and then changing the terms. - fraud And here again, the math behind the swindle claim doesn't add up. You are still paying the retail price of the phone whether you sign up for two years contract or with Next. AT&T does not lose money on either contract. - hustle I've paid $175/month for 3 lines (2 are unlimited data and 1 is 2gb) for over 8 years now and I've always bought the $199 iPhone (with upgrade). A comparable plan with high-capped data (closest you can get to unlimited) runs only a little bit more ($185-190) for 3 lines. When I recently went to upgrade I was offered Next and the monthly cost wouldn't have been any cheaper for the lines yet I'd have had to pay an extra $2X.XX/month for the phone. Trying to persuade me that this is a better deal when it is not qualifies as a hustle. It isn't fraud since there's no bait and switch. They're just bullshitting.
  - intopieces 11y ago
    >Trying to persuade me that this is a better deal when it is not qualifies as a hustle. There are different terms and benefits. They're not exactly alike. What you're saying is, essentially, "The salesman tried to sell me something I don't want and that's dishonest." Well, no, not really. Lots of people find value in the ability to upgrade their phone without having to pay the entire ETF, choosing instead to give back their phone. That you don't find this valuable does not make it dishonest. You would have a case if the two deals (2 year contract or Next) were precisely the same. They are not. In fact, you summarily ignore the main feature of the offer to make your point!
  - Evolved 11y ago
    intopieces - I can't reply to your comment so I'll post my reply here. There are different terms and benefits. They're not exactly alike. What you're saying is, essentially, "The salesman tried to sell me something I don't want and that's dishonest." This is patently false and not what I said or meant. What is the hustle about this is trying to persuade me that their deal is better when it is in fact, not. Lots of people find value in the ability to upgrade their phone without having to pay the entire ETF, choosing instead to give back their phone. That you don't find this valuable does not make it dishonest.You would have a case if the two deals (2 year contract or Next) were precisely the same. They are not. In fact, you summarily ignore the main feature of the offer to make your point! My point is that the deals are as close as they can and they were trying to A. persuade me to pay more money, B. persuade me to give up my unlimited data and C. persuade me to pay full price for my phone when I normally don't. In addition, I've never paid an ETF as ETF means Early Termination Fee and since I clearly stated I complete the full contract then there would not be any ETF. Summary: AT&T Next is a hustle for most of their customers.

by bbakkd 11y ago

intopieces 11y ago

>That doesn't make it any less of a hustle. Still not quite understanding your use of this word. How can the deal be a fraud or swindle if the terms are given up front? Let's set aside the argument about whether you think it's a good deal or not, as that is not the meaning of the word "hustle". They're not intentionally selling you a defective product masked as a new one. They're not signing you up for something and then changing the terms. As far as I can tell, the word hustle is being used here to mean "trying to convince people that a product is a better deal than it is." But again, this is a matter of opinion and situation. What is a good deal for you may not be available to others because of the up front cost And here again, the math behind the swindle claim doesn't add up. You are still paying the retail price of the phone whether you sign up for two years contract or with Next. AT&T does not lose money on either contract.

Evolved 11y ago
It seems what AT&T are trying to do is stop losing money to subsidizing phones since other carriers (T-mobile, for example) are doing this. If this is the case then why not just discontinue the subsidization of phones at the $199, $299, etc. price points and just allow you to buy it at 0% interest if you agree to a 2-year contract. They still get their customer locked in for 2 years and they recover the full cost of the phone and the customer most likely stays loyal since they aren't feeling ripped off. Otherwise, what is keeping them from jumping ship to another carrier if the waters are muddied enough that the phone and the plan become commodities?
- intopieces 11y ago
  You've pivoted to another topic. The question I asked is: what part of the AT&T Next plan qualifies as a hustle?
  - Evolved 11y ago
    hustle - verb (used without object), hustled, hustling. 3. to be aggressive, especially in business or other financial dealings. 4. Slang. to earn one's living by illicit or unethical means. The hustle part of what I said has to do with the pushyness of the salespeople at AT&T and the unethical part of lying about the pricing (to me when this deal was not better for me even though perhaps it may be better for someone else). I think this meets the prima facie definition of hustle. Hustle doesn't have to mean fraudulent but it can mean shady, unscrupulous or sneaky.
    - m8urn 11y ago
      Another aspect of this is that they make the regular contract plans cost more than twice what they did before, even with a non-smartphone, essentially pushing you into the Next plan.
      - Evolved 11y ago
        Can they really do this if you're just upgrading the phone and signing a new contract since you're not required to choose a new plan? If you were absolutely required to choose a new plan when you upgradethen how can people with unlimited data still be grandfathered in?
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
Evolved 11y ago
intentionally selling you a defective product masked as a new one. signing you up for something and then changing the terms. - fraud And here again, the math behind the swindle claim doesn't add up. You are still paying the retail price of the phone whether you sign up for two years contract or with Next. AT&T does not lose money on either contract. - hustle I've paid $175/month for 3 lines (2 are unlimited data and 1 is 2gb) for over 8 years now and I've always bought the $199 iPhone (with upgrade). A comparable plan with high-capped data (closest you can get to unlimited) runs only a little bit more ($185-190) for 3 lines. When I recently went to upgrade I was offered Next and the monthly cost wouldn't have been any cheaper for the lines yet I'd have had to pay an extra $2X.XX/month for the phone. Trying to persuade me that this is a better deal when it is not qualifies as a hustle. It isn't fraud since there's no bait and switch. They're just bullshitting.
- intopieces 11y ago
  >Trying to persuade me that this is a better deal when it is not qualifies as a hustle. There are different terms and benefits. They're not exactly alike. What you're saying is, essentially, "The salesman tried to sell me something I don't want and that's dishonest." Well, no, not really. Lots of people find value in the ability to upgrade their phone without having to pay the entire ETF, choosing instead to give back their phone. That you don't find this valuable does not make it dishonest. You would have a case if the two deals (2 year contract or Next) were precisely the same. They are not. In fact, you summarily ignore the main feature of the offer to make your point!
- Evolved 11y ago
  intopieces - I can't reply to your comment so I'll post my reply here. There are different terms and benefits. They're not exactly alike. What you're saying is, essentially, "The salesman tried to sell me something I don't want and that's dishonest." This is patently false and not what I said or meant. What is the hustle about this is trying to persuade me that their deal is better when it is in fact, not. Lots of people find value in the ability to upgrade their phone without having to pay the entire ETF, choosing instead to give back their phone. That you don't find this valuable does not make it dishonest.You would have a case if the two deals (2 year contract or Next) were precisely the same. They are not. In fact, you summarily ignore the main feature of the offer to make your point! My point is that the deals are as close as they can and they were trying to A. persuade me to pay more money, B. persuade me to give up my unlimited data and C. persuade me to pay full price for my phone when I normally don't. In addition, I've never paid an ETF as ETF means Early Termination Fee and since I clearly stated I complete the full contract then there would not be any ETF. Summary: AT&T Next is a hustle for most of their customers.