7 ms·

I never quite got why it's ok for the stupid hackathon projects to be negative, demeaning, and have NSFW content, even though these things are completely verbot

I never quite got why it's ok for the stupid hackathon projects to be negative, demeaning, and have NSFW content, even though these things are completely verboten in every other tech event. Is there some kind of certification[0] that the hackathon organizers got to be allowed to do this? EDIT: [0] What I meant was that it is as if organizations like this hackathon have some kind of certification that allows them to have this kind of content, without being attacked by the social justice movement. E.g. if Microsoft had sexual content at one of its conferences, or organized a "fun" conference with sexual content, they would be immediately attacked and forced to apologize. My claim is that having progressive politics and being implicitly endorsed by the progressive community, acts like a kind of certification.

detaro 11y ago
There certainly are tech events that not shy away from such things, as much as there are hackathons that do not like such projects. Also, most hackathons don't select the projects beforehand, whereas other events have to explain why they selected "bad" content.
- formulaT 11y ago
  What other tech events did you have in mind? And if you check out the hackathons website [0] and the previous hackathon [1], they are showcasing exactly the offensive content that I was describing in my post. [0] http://stupidhackathon.github.io/ http://stupidhackathon.github.io/ [1] http://www.stupidhackathon.com/ http://www.stupidhackathon.com/
  - kelnos 11y ago
    Looking at those links, I don't see anything "negative" or "demeaning" as you suggest farther up the thread. NSFW, sure, there are some projects that would easily qualify, but... who cares? Many things that are NSFW are what make life worth living. Remember, we're talking about subjective measures here. One person's "demeaning" might be another's "hilarious". Are you now the arbiter of taste? Standard rules apply: if you don't like it, don't participate. If you feel the need to protest, that's your right, but understand that many people will consider you uptight and unreasonable.
  - deleted 11y ago
    [deleted]
  - wongarsu 11y ago
    If you name your Hackathon "Stupid Shit No One Needs & Terrible Ideas Hackathon", I think it's perfectly acceptable to allow slightly NSFW content. And I don't agree anything there was overly negative or demeaning, it was all healthy satire. We don't have to hold every single developer event to the same standards as a Microsoft developer conference (which themselves don't always set high standards [1]). There are places for being serious, but there also have to be places where we can have fun and introspect with some lighthearted satire. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zww2ivWdLas https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zww2ivWdLas
    - formulaT 11y ago
      I don't believe that the difference is serious vs non-serious events. It's pretty clear that no company or group would dare to create a light hearted hackathon featuring sexual content, if it hadn't been proposed first by a progressive cause (in this case mocking startup culture for being a White cishet male bubble). And Microsoft apologized for that song[0]. Note that this event is sponsored by real tech companies. Here is the content I thought would be considered offensive it it didn't come from a progressive source (repeated from [1]): Here are some examples from the previous New York hackathon [2]: Sexual content: Golden Bitcoin Pasties, Focus Tools, Collaborative Fuck Bike, E.T. Strapon, Sado-Masochistic Macrame Planter, Tinder For Babies, "ok glass, vomit" Making fun of mental health/development issues: Stupid Font Body shaming and objectification: Intellectual Babes Calendar And here are some prize categories in the current hackathon that are similarly offensive: Peter Thiel, Scatological APIs, Targetting The "Hikikomori" Space [0] http://www.zdnet.com/article/microsoft-apologizes-for-cringeworthy-penis-song-at-ndc-2012/ http://www.zdnet.com/article/microsoft-apologizes-for-cringe... [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9521510 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9521510 [2] http://www.stupidhackathon.com/ http://www.stupidhackathon.com/
      - wongarsu 11y ago
        Saying the Stupid Font makes fun of mental health/development issues seems like a stretch. Being stupid is a broad term. Sometimes I do stupid things (as all humans do), and in that moment I am stupid. It's not exactly a medical term. The Intellectual Babes Calendar is objectifying men, but I think by parodying and creating awareness for objectifying females it is still a net positive for society. That may change at some point, but that's why we view things in context. You are obviously right that there is a lot of sexual content, and that that Hackathon was an industry event. But as long as everybody is aware of that when visiting the Hackathon, I fail to see any harm in that. This isn't even sex-deprived male cisgender nerds, most of the sexual content is created by females of various ethnicities. Saying that sexual content is inappropriate during all work/industry related events seems overly broad to me. After all, our industry is diverse and even includes respected companies like pornhub. There are bound to be people in this industry who are very comfortable with sexual content, and it's not my place to judge them for expressing that in an appropriate context.
Bjartr 11y ago
Hackathon certification, what?
lelandbatey 11y ago
I think you might misunderstand what happens at a hackathon. Usually participants show up with ideas for things to work on in their heads, or they join a project that someone else is working on while there. There isn't anyone dictating what people work on, and no one has to "approve" their projects. It's functionally not that different from the participants doing their work by themselves at home. The only difference is a hackathon is an arbitrary time and place just for working on projects.
Devthrowaway80 11y ago
> Is there some kind of certification that the hackathon organizers got to be allowed to do this? They are certified to produce software at Level 3 Free Speech as laid out in ISO 4328. Compliance was verified at great cost by Certified Enterprise Thought Inspectors from McKinsey, Bain and Boston. The key to being a good hacker is to make sure everyone is OK with what you're doing before you do it, and the organizers are very responsible in that regard.
angersock 11y ago
Is there some kind of certification that the hackathon organizers got to be allowed to do this? u wot m8? More specifically, though it may be easy to forget in this age of all-corporate and sponsored and sold-out meetups, the only thing it takes to make a hackathon is to show up with computers and friends and hack code. The only thing required to do a themed hackathon is to say "Yo, here's the theme for our hackathon." That's the magic of being a hacker.
cmdrfred 11y ago
I don't know where you are from but my forefathers wrote up mailed all the 'certification' I need to king George in 1776.
GuamPirate 11y ago
How is this any of negative, demeaning, or NSFW?
- formulaT 11y ago
  see http://stupidhackathon.github.io/ http://stupidhackathon.github.io/ and http://www.stupidhackathon.com/ http://www.stupidhackathon.com/ and also https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9521510 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9521510
  - davidgerard 11y ago
    Given the comment you've just linked there leads with "This hackathon is a good example of the hypocrisy of the progressive movement", and you think "hackathon" is some sort of brand name requiring certification ... I urge you to consider the possibility that the problem lies not in the rest of the world outside yourself.
    - deleted 11y ago
      [deleted]
    - formulaT 11y ago
      See my footnote at the start of this thread. And please stop progressive-splaining to me.
      - angersock 11y ago
        "progressive-splaining* means what, exactly? I have a similar issue with the misused mansplaining, for what it's worth.
        davidgerard 11y ago
        Please don't feed the sincerely querulous poster.
Profan 11y ago
... Do we have to censor everything now?
- formulaT 11y ago
  I don't care. I'm just pointing out the hypocrisy where any remotely sexual imagery[0], comment[1] or performance[2] in tech results in controversy, firings and apologies, and yet events like this are ok because they wear progressive politics on their sleeve. [0] http://www.theguardian.com/science/2014/nov/14/rosetta-comet-dr-matt-taylor-apology-sexist-shirt http://www.theguardian.com/science/2014/nov/14/rosetta-comet... [1] http://www.wired.com/2013/03/richards-affair-and-misogyny-in-tech/ http://www.wired.com/2013/03/richards-affair-and-misogyny-in... [2] http://www.zdnet.com/article/microsoft-apologizes-for-cringeworthy-penis-song-at-ndc-2012/ http://www.zdnet.com/article/microsoft-apologizes-for-cringe...
GFK_of_xmaspast 11y ago
Have you considered that 'context' exists.
saaaam 11y ago
Hi, founders of the Stupid Shit No One Needs & Terrible Ideas Hackathon (AKA "Stupid Hackathon") here, and yes we do have a certificate, linked below for future reference. http://i.imgur.com/8Qp91cE.gif http://i.imgur.com/8Qp91cE.gif
- formulaT 11y ago
  Whatever issues I have with your hackathon, I gotta hand it to your for trying to pull off George Bush jokes in 2015. Same for Mitt Romney.
kelnos 11y ago
Guess what: not everyone finds these sorts of things offensive. If a company that was trying to appeal to a very broad audience attempted something like this, sure, they'd be crucified (and I wouldn't be surprised or find anything wrong with that outcome). But events like these target the sorts of irreverent people who enjoy this type of humor. If you don't get it or find it offensive, I'm sure they don't really care, as you aren't their target audience. I'm getting quite tired of the idea that there isn't room in the world for things like this. Lighten up, don't be so uptight, and recognize that people's tastes are different, and events like this don't have to inherently be of harm to anyone. Hell, if you look at the main page for the SF event at Noisebridge[1], they explicitly call out a link to Noisebridge's anti-harassment policy and community standards for the event. They seem well aware of the concept of keeping the event a safe place. [1] https://stupidhackathon.github.io/ https://stupidhackathon.github.io/
- formulaT 11y ago
  If by safe you mean you can ridicule anyone as long as they are a cis white male, then I'm sure they are keeping it very safe.
kmill 11y ago
I've been trying to understand what you were talking about, and I didn't realize there was another hackathon with the same name in NYC. This one was in SF, and the organizers even had this on the submission page for signing up to present: 'In particular, [quoting the hackerspace code of conduct] "Nobody should be forced to experience sexual or sexualised language or imagery." For real.'
bcg1 11y ago
Its kind of cute that you believe in the whole "blue team" vs. "red team" thing, and that it is relevant to the topic. And to answer your question... no, you don't need a certification to make an ass of yourself: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9521343 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9521343

detaro 11y ago

There certainly are tech events that not shy away from such things, as much as there are hackathons that do not like such projects. Also, most hackathons don't select the projects beforehand, whereas other events have to explain why they selected "bad" content.

formulaT 11y ago
What other tech events did you have in mind? And if you check out the hackathons website [0] and the previous hackathon [1], they are showcasing exactly the offensive content that I was describing in my post. [0] http://stupidhackathon.github.io/ http://stupidhackathon.github.io/ [1] http://www.stupidhackathon.com/ http://www.stupidhackathon.com/
- kelnos 11y ago
  Looking at those links, I don't see anything "negative" or "demeaning" as you suggest farther up the thread. NSFW, sure, there are some projects that would easily qualify, but... who cares? Many things that are NSFW are what make life worth living. Remember, we're talking about subjective measures here. One person's "demeaning" might be another's "hilarious". Are you now the arbiter of taste? Standard rules apply: if you don't like it, don't participate. If you feel the need to protest, that's your right, but understand that many people will consider you uptight and unreasonable.
- deleted 11y ago
  [deleted]
- wongarsu 11y ago
  If you name your Hackathon "Stupid Shit No One Needs & Terrible Ideas Hackathon", I think it's perfectly acceptable to allow slightly NSFW content. And I don't agree anything there was overly negative or demeaning, it was all healthy satire. We don't have to hold every single developer event to the same standards as a Microsoft developer conference (which themselves don't always set high standards [1]). There are places for being serious, but there also have to be places where we can have fun and introspect with some lighthearted satire. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zww2ivWdLas https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zww2ivWdLas
  - formulaT 11y ago
    I don't believe that the difference is serious vs non-serious events. It's pretty clear that no company or group would dare to create a light hearted hackathon featuring sexual content, if it hadn't been proposed first by a progressive cause (in this case mocking startup culture for being a White cishet male bubble). And Microsoft apologized for that song[0]. Note that this event is sponsored by real tech companies. Here is the content I thought would be considered offensive it it didn't come from a progressive source (repeated from [1]): Here are some examples from the previous New York hackathon [2]: Sexual content: Golden Bitcoin Pasties, Focus Tools, Collaborative Fuck Bike, E.T. Strapon, Sado-Masochistic Macrame Planter, Tinder For Babies, "ok glass, vomit" Making fun of mental health/development issues: Stupid Font Body shaming and objectification: Intellectual Babes Calendar And here are some prize categories in the current hackathon that are similarly offensive: Peter Thiel, Scatological APIs, Targetting The "Hikikomori" Space [0] http://www.zdnet.com/article/microsoft-apologizes-for-cringeworthy-penis-song-at-ndc-2012/ http://www.zdnet.com/article/microsoft-apologizes-for-cringe... [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9521510 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9521510 [2] http://www.stupidhackathon.com/ http://www.stupidhackathon.com/
    - wongarsu 11y ago
      Saying the Stupid Font makes fun of mental health/development issues seems like a stretch. Being stupid is a broad term. Sometimes I do stupid things (as all humans do), and in that moment I am stupid. It's not exactly a medical term. The Intellectual Babes Calendar is objectifying men, but I think by parodying and creating awareness for objectifying females it is still a net positive for society. That may change at some point, but that's why we view things in context. You are obviously right that there is a lot of sexual content, and that that Hackathon was an industry event. But as long as everybody is aware of that when visiting the Hackathon, I fail to see any harm in that. This isn't even sex-deprived male cisgender nerds, most of the sexual content is created by females of various ethnicities. Saying that sexual content is inappropriate during all work/industry related events seems overly broad to me. After all, our industry is diverse and even includes respected companies like pornhub. There are bound to be people in this industry who are very comfortable with sexual content, and it's not my place to judge them for expressing that in an appropriate context.

Bjartr 11y ago

Hackathon certification, what?

lelandbatey 11y ago

I think you might misunderstand what happens at a hackathon. Usually participants show up with ideas for things to work on in their heads, or they join a project that someone else is working on while there. There isn't anyone dictating what people work on, and no one has to "approve" their projects. It's functionally not that different from the participants doing their work by themselves at home. The only difference is a hackathon is an arbitrary time and place just for working on projects.

Devthrowaway80 11y ago

> Is there some kind of certification that the hackathon organizers got to be allowed to do this? They are certified to produce software at Level 3 Free Speech as laid out in ISO 4328. Compliance was verified at great cost by Certified Enterprise Thought Inspectors from McKinsey, Bain and Boston. The key to being a good hacker is to make sure everyone is OK with what you're doing before you do it, and the organizers are very responsible in that regard.

angersock 11y ago

Is there some kind of certification that the hackathon organizers got to be allowed to do this? u wot m8? More specifically, though it may be easy to forget in this age of all-corporate and sponsored and sold-out meetups, the only thing it takes to make a hackathon is to show up with computers and friends and hack code. The only thing required to do a themed hackathon is to say "Yo, here's the theme for our hackathon." That's the magic of being a hacker.

cmdrfred 11y ago

I don't know where you are from but my forefathers wrote up mailed all the 'certification' I need to king George in 1776.

GuamPirate 11y ago

How is this any of negative, demeaning, or NSFW?

formulaT 11y ago
see http://stupidhackathon.github.io/ http://stupidhackathon.github.io/ and http://www.stupidhackathon.com/ http://www.stupidhackathon.com/ and also https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9521510 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9521510
- davidgerard 11y ago
  Given the comment you've just linked there leads with "This hackathon is a good example of the hypocrisy of the progressive movement", and you think "hackathon" is some sort of brand name requiring certification ... I urge you to consider the possibility that the problem lies not in the rest of the world outside yourself.
  - deleted 11y ago
    [deleted]
  - formulaT 11y ago
    See my footnote at the start of this thread. And please stop progressive-splaining to me.
    - angersock 11y ago
      "progressive-splaining* means what, exactly? I have a similar issue with the misused mansplaining, for what it's worth.
      - davidgerard 11y ago
        Please don't feed the sincerely querulous poster.

Profan 11y ago

... Do we have to censor everything now?

formulaT 11y ago
I don't care. I'm just pointing out the hypocrisy where any remotely sexual imagery[0], comment[1] or performance[2] in tech results in controversy, firings and apologies, and yet events like this are ok because they wear progressive politics on their sleeve. [0] http://www.theguardian.com/science/2014/nov/14/rosetta-comet-dr-matt-taylor-apology-sexist-shirt http://www.theguardian.com/science/2014/nov/14/rosetta-comet... [1] http://www.wired.com/2013/03/richards-affair-and-misogyny-in-tech/ http://www.wired.com/2013/03/richards-affair-and-misogyny-in... [2] http://www.zdnet.com/article/microsoft-apologizes-for-cringeworthy-penis-song-at-ndc-2012/ http://www.zdnet.com/article/microsoft-apologizes-for-cringe...

GFK_of_xmaspast 11y ago

Have you considered that 'context' exists.

saaaam 11y ago

Hi, founders of the Stupid Shit No One Needs & Terrible Ideas Hackathon (AKA "Stupid Hackathon") here, and yes we do have a certificate, linked below for future reference. http://i.imgur.com/8Qp91cE.gif http://i.imgur.com/8Qp91cE.gif

formulaT 11y ago
Whatever issues I have with your hackathon, I gotta hand it to your for trying to pull off George Bush jokes in 2015. Same for Mitt Romney.

kelnos 11y ago

Guess what: not everyone finds these sorts of things offensive. If a company that was trying to appeal to a very broad audience attempted something like this, sure, they'd be crucified (and I wouldn't be surprised or find anything wrong with that outcome). But events like these target the sorts of irreverent people who enjoy this type of humor. If you don't get it or find it offensive, I'm sure they don't really care, as you aren't their target audience. I'm getting quite tired of the idea that there isn't room in the world for things like this. Lighten up, don't be so uptight, and recognize that people's tastes are different, and events like this don't have to inherently be of harm to anyone. Hell, if you look at the main page for the SF event at Noisebridge[1], they explicitly call out a link to Noisebridge's anti-harassment policy and community standards for the event. They seem well aware of the concept of keeping the event a safe place. [1] https://stupidhackathon.github.io/ https://stupidhackathon.github.io/

formulaT 11y ago
If by safe you mean you can ridicule anyone as long as they are a cis white male, then I'm sure they are keeping it very safe.

kmill 11y ago

I've been trying to understand what you were talking about, and I didn't realize there was another hackathon with the same name in NYC. This one was in SF, and the organizers even had this on the submission page for signing up to present: 'In particular, [quoting the hackerspace code of conduct] "Nobody should be forced to experience sexual or sexualised language or imagery." For real.'

bcg1 11y ago

Its kind of cute that you believe in the whole "blue team" vs. "red team" thing, and that it is relevant to the topic. And to answer your question... no, you don't need a certification to make an ass of yourself: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9521343 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9521343