6 ms·

Why do crops need to be grown in California or 'shipped' to China? Can't these crops be provided by other states in the U.S. that are more conducive to farming

Why do crops need to be grown in California or 'shipped' to China? Can't these crops be provided by other states in the U.S. that are more conducive to farming? It seems California is not a great state for farming, and was engineered to be suitable. I understand the economic value to the state, but using 80% of the water during a drought? It seems like an incredible waste of resources for the financial gain of a single state.

dragonwriter 11y ago
> Why do crops need to be grown in California or 'shipped' to China? Can't these crops be provided by other states in the U.S. that are more conducive to farming? If they could, they would. > It seems California is not a great state for farming, and was engineered to be suitable. No place is a great place for modern farming, which requires considerable man-made infrastructure in any case. But in terms of things that you can't easily engineer around (except, recently, fresh water within a convenient collection area) California is a very good place for farming.
- pkaye 11y ago
  What about Colorado? Seems like a good place for agriculture. And they are getting more rain than California at this time.
  - cwal37 11y ago
    Does Colorado[1] really look like such a great place to grow crops? Particularly in the context of what we're talking about here, water availability, snowpack changes, etc. Also, Colorado via Drought Monitor[3]. Iowa[2] for comparison. [1] https://www.google.com/maps/place/Colorado/@38.9252672,-105.5452078,540625m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m2!3m1!1s0x874014749b1856b7:0xc75483314990a7ff https://www.google.com/maps/place/Colorado/@38.9252672,-105.... [2] https://www.google.com/maps/place/Iowa/@41.9383166,-93.3897979,517519m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m2!3m1!1s0x87ee5e6ff1f86019:0xc6ef634a57c759d9 https://www.google.com/maps/place/Iowa/@41.9383166,-93.38979... [3] http://droughtmonitor.unl.edu/Home/StateDroughtMonitor.aspx?CO http://droughtmonitor.unl.edu/Home/StateDroughtMonitor.aspx?...
  - dragonwriter 11y ago
    > What about Colorado? Seems like a good place for agriculture. Most of the parts of Colorado that are good for agriculture (e.g., not the Rockies) are already being used for agriculture. You can't really replace the area of California currently being used for agriculture with agriculture-suitable land in Colorado that isn't already being used for agriculture.
  - Balgair 11y ago
    Ummm, because there is snow there and not in Salinas.
    - AnimalMuppet 11y ago
      Right. But the snow there means that there's going to be water there...
      - dragonwriter 11y ago
        Temperature (and, particularly for many crops, frequency and duration of freezes) is an important consideration in growing crops. Water is important, too, but its not the only consideration in agriculture.
        pkaye 11y ago
        But Minnesota is one of the top agriculture states and being up north, they have more severe winters.
        dragonwriter 11y ago
        > But Minnesota is one of the top agriculture states and being up north, they have more severe winters. It also has a very different crop mix than California.
        Balgair 11y ago
        Yeah, Cali has oranges and berries and whatnot. Good luck trying to get those to grow in Mn year round without a diesel heater.
cjensen 11y ago
Contrary to your entirely reasonable assumptions, California is more conducive to farming than most places. There is little to no frost, a nearly yearlong growing season, and plenty of water thanks to the natural reservoir that is the Sierra snowpack. The catch is that California has always been prone to multiyear droughts; while this is the worst single season on record, the drought itself is not particularly notable -- the last similar drought was just 40 years ago. So why do we clamp down on residential watering while allowing almonds to be grown? Simple: residential watering provides no economic purpose, and dead grass will grow back when the water comes back. Almonds provide an economic benefit and we usually have plenty of water for them. Diverting water from residences to almonds during a drought is simply the price of keeping that part of the economy alive.
- Quanticles 11y ago
  Almond growers better be paying a premium then in order to compensate the residents of the state who lost their water to them. If California is conducive to farming other than water then the high price in water should be fine.
  - curun1r 11y ago
    I think it's a mistake to keep harping on Almonds. California produces so much of the world's supply that ceasing production here would be hugely disruptive. Beef and Dairy, on the other hand, are produced in areas with far more available water. California could stop producing livestock and the world (and the state) would, for the most part, shrug and go about their normal business. Almonds get so much attention, but if you look at the amount of water necessary to produce almond milk vs the amount of water necessary to produce cow's milk, almonds start to look at lot more attractive.
- cmrdporcupine 11y ago
  Other nut crops can be grown in other parts of the US that have reliable annual rainfall. Hybrid hazelnuts could be used in lots of places that almonds are currently. Chestnuts. And there are hardy varieties of almonds that will grow in the east as well. Cheap Latino labour, powerful organized industry groups, state subsidies, and an inaccurate pricing for irrigation....

dragonwriter 11y ago

> Why do crops need to be grown in California or 'shipped' to China? Can't these crops be provided by other states in the U.S. that are more conducive to farming? If they could, they would. > It seems California is not a great state for farming, and was engineered to be suitable. No place is a great place for modern farming, which requires considerable man-made infrastructure in any case. But in terms of things that you can't easily engineer around (except, recently, fresh water within a convenient collection area) California is a very good place for farming.

pkaye 11y ago
What about Colorado? Seems like a good place for agriculture. And they are getting more rain than California at this time.
- cwal37 11y ago
  Does Colorado[1] really look like such a great place to grow crops? Particularly in the context of what we're talking about here, water availability, snowpack changes, etc. Also, Colorado via Drought Monitor[3]. Iowa[2] for comparison. [1] https://www.google.com/maps/place/Colorado/@38.9252672,-105.5452078,540625m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m2!3m1!1s0x874014749b1856b7:0xc75483314990a7ff https://www.google.com/maps/place/Colorado/@38.9252672,-105.... [2] https://www.google.com/maps/place/Iowa/@41.9383166,-93.3897979,517519m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m2!3m1!1s0x87ee5e6ff1f86019:0xc6ef634a57c759d9 https://www.google.com/maps/place/Iowa/@41.9383166,-93.38979... [3] http://droughtmonitor.unl.edu/Home/StateDroughtMonitor.aspx?CO http://droughtmonitor.unl.edu/Home/StateDroughtMonitor.aspx?...
- dragonwriter 11y ago
  > What about Colorado? Seems like a good place for agriculture. Most of the parts of Colorado that are good for agriculture (e.g., not the Rockies) are already being used for agriculture. You can't really replace the area of California currently being used for agriculture with agriculture-suitable land in Colorado that isn't already being used for agriculture.
- Balgair 11y ago
  Ummm, because there is snow there and not in Salinas.
  - AnimalMuppet 11y ago
    Right. But the snow there means that there's going to be water there...
    - dragonwriter 11y ago
      Temperature (and, particularly for many crops, frequency and duration of freezes) is an important consideration in growing crops. Water is important, too, but its not the only consideration in agriculture.
      - pkaye 11y ago
        But Minnesota is one of the top agriculture states and being up north, they have more severe winters.
        dragonwriter 11y ago
        > But Minnesota is one of the top agriculture states and being up north, they have more severe winters. It also has a very different crop mix than California.
        Balgair 11y ago
        Yeah, Cali has oranges and berries and whatnot. Good luck trying to get those to grow in Mn year round without a diesel heater.

cjensen 11y ago

Contrary to your entirely reasonable assumptions, California is more conducive to farming than most places. There is little to no frost, a nearly yearlong growing season, and plenty of water thanks to the natural reservoir that is the Sierra snowpack. The catch is that California has always been prone to multiyear droughts; while this is the worst single season on record, the drought itself is not particularly notable -- the last similar drought was just 40 years ago. So why do we clamp down on residential watering while allowing almonds to be grown? Simple: residential watering provides no economic purpose, and dead grass will grow back when the water comes back. Almonds provide an economic benefit and we usually have plenty of water for them. Diverting water from residences to almonds during a drought is simply the price of keeping that part of the economy alive.

Quanticles 11y ago
Almond growers better be paying a premium then in order to compensate the residents of the state who lost their water to them. If California is conducive to farming other than water then the high price in water should be fine.
- curun1r 11y ago
  I think it's a mistake to keep harping on Almonds. California produces so much of the world's supply that ceasing production here would be hugely disruptive. Beef and Dairy, on the other hand, are produced in areas with far more available water. California could stop producing livestock and the world (and the state) would, for the most part, shrug and go about their normal business. Almonds get so much attention, but if you look at the amount of water necessary to produce almond milk vs the amount of water necessary to produce cow's milk, almonds start to look at lot more attractive.
cmrdporcupine 11y ago
Other nut crops can be grown in other parts of the US that have reliable annual rainfall. Hybrid hazelnuts could be used in lots of places that almonds are currently. Chestnuts. And there are hardy varieties of almonds that will grow in the east as well. Cheap Latino labour, powerful organized industry groups, state subsidies, and an inaccurate pricing for irrigation....