5 ms·

Cemeteries are beyond ridiculous, and growing up, I thought there would be a cultural shift away from such non-sense, but maybe not?

jewel 11y ago
48.2% of bodies in the US are cremated now, but it varies significantly by state. The NFDA predicts that it will be up to 70% by 2030. http://nfda.org/about-funeral-service-/trends-and-statistics.html http://nfda.org/about-funeral-service-/trends-and-statistics...
- acheron 11y ago
  My grandparents were cremated, but then the ashes were buried in an old cemetery similar to the one in the article, with gravestones and all that. So "cremation" and "using land as a cemetery" aren't necessarily opposed.
judk 11y ago
Cemeteries aren't ridiculous a priori, they just become less sensible as population density and community age (#of corpses) increases.
- mhurron 11y ago
  Setting aside land for the dead is ridiculous.
  - slapshot 11y ago
    It's not for the dead. It's for the survivors. Many people want a place to gather, pay their respects, and create a tangible connection to their loved ones. There's no theoretic reason why it has to be an individual headstone (versus more dense monuments) or even an outdoor headstone setting (versus cremains in an urn or scattered in a meaningful place) but don't pretend that it has anything to do with the dead. It's a ritual for the living.
    - mhurron 11y ago
      > don't pretend that it has anything to do with the dead It is for the dead. No one is visiting graves of someone who died 200 years ago, yet everyone is up in arms if you mention moving an old cemetery. If you own farmland with a family cemetery (again, 2-300 years old), you have to farm around it, you can not move it. It is for the dead.
      - cge 11y ago
        Moving the bodies themselves seems to be an issue, and I expect there would be awkwardness about allowing farming where there had been a cemetery for perceived health reasons, but there have certainly been cases of repurposing cemeteries. Pioneer Park in San Diego, while having a scan few recent articles about how it was probably a bad idea, didn't seem to cause a huge controversy: the city took an old cemetery in disrepair, took out most of the markers, put up a little memorial in the corner, and turned the rest into parkland. The primary school right next to it, at least when I went there, even used it occasionally for classes, though I expect that has stopped for perceived security reasons.
      - andrewem 11y ago
        Perhaps they're special cases, but I've visited cemeteries of people who died in the 1600s and 1700s in Boston, Plymouth and Salem, Massachusetts. You'll find two cemeteries almost across the street from each other in Boston, right in the center of the city. They're tourist attractions, both for the now-obsolete grave decorations, and for some of the famous people who are buried or at least commemorated there. For instance, you can see markers for people who died in the Boston Massacre in 1770 in the Old Granary Burying Ground; needless to say, it's named for a building which used to stand nearby. King's Chapel Burying Ground, just down the street, has a bonus historical feature - a ventilation shaft for the subway, which I think dates to roughly 1900. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granary_Burying_Ground http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granary_Burying_Ground http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King%27s_Chapel_Burying_Ground http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King%27s_Chapel_Burying_Ground
        mhurron 11y ago
  - Crito 11y ago
    There is a truly ludicrous amount of unused/underused land left in the US. The only problem is where we are burying people, not that we are burying people in the general case. Cemeteries in cities/suburbs get in the way, but otherwise it isn't a real concern. Seriously, drive across Wyoming sometime and then try to say with a straight face that we are running out of land.
ovulator 11y ago
There is a shift towards cremation in the US http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_cremation_rate http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_cremation_..., though seems to still be eschewed in the south. I don't know if there is any Baptist, or other religious teaching against cremation, or maybe it just has to do with cheaper land.
- mhurron 11y ago
  Cremation in general has been frowned upon by christianity as pagan.
  - jacquesm 11y ago
    At 2 square meters per grave in densely populated areas they're going to sooner or later have to bury people stacked if they don't want the dead to crowd out the living.
    - detaro 11y ago
      How long are grave sites kept in the US? Here in Germany they are reused (25 years is a common period), and family graves are "people buried stacked".
      - zrail 11y ago
        As far as I know burial plots are not reused in the US. You generally buy the plot in perpetuity.
        maxerickson 11y ago
        It varies. There are sometimes problems with private or small cemeteries that are run by an association running out of funds (or the association can end up with no members left). A search for "cemetery disrepair" returns lots and lots of local news stories.
        deleted 11y ago
GregBuchholz 11y ago
And think of all the lost phosphorous, for Ford's sake.
- acheron 11y ago
  It is every citizen's final duty to go into the tanks and become one with all the people. - Chairman Yang, https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Sid_Meier%27s_Alpha_Centauri https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Sid_Meier%27s_Alpha_Centauri
Houshalter 11y ago
My mother is into local history. She would often take me to cemeteries and show me several generations of family members. She told me many stories about them, even though they are long since dead. She knew where all sorts of notable people were buried, and told me stories about them. The graves of the first settlers, a soldier who received the medal of honor in the civil war in the locomotive chase, to a tombstone that was carved out of a meteorite. We spent time planting flowers and keeping the graves nice. Cemeteries are not empty places, there is always someone showing up to visit and mourn for the dead. It's also not wasted land. Every cemetery I've been to was built on land no one wanted. Usually sandy hills that weren't farmable. If and when she dies there is no way I will have her cremated. I hope my great grandchildren tell stories about her in a hundred years.
speeder 11y ago
I like the idea of cemeteries. When my grandma died, I had a blast not only looking at all the art (that is usually very interesting by itself), but also visiting my grandpa grave. The grandpa died when my dad was 6 years old, so I never met him, he was historically important, not just to my family, but to his city, and visiting his grave was nice, people started to remember stuff and talk about him, and I could learn a lot, also could see how he looked like (his grave had a photo of him). Despite never meeting him, I can now use him as a life example to follow.

jewel 11y ago

48.2% of bodies in the US are cremated now, but it varies significantly by state. The NFDA predicts that it will be up to 70% by 2030. http://nfda.org/about-funeral-service-/trends-and-statistics.html http://nfda.org/about-funeral-service-/trends-and-statistics...

acheron 11y ago
My grandparents were cremated, but then the ashes were buried in an old cemetery similar to the one in the article, with gravestones and all that. So "cremation" and "using land as a cemetery" aren't necessarily opposed.

judk 11y ago

Cemeteries aren't ridiculous a priori, they just become less sensible as population density and community age (#of corpses) increases.

mhurron 11y ago
Setting aside land for the dead is ridiculous.
- slapshot 11y ago
  It's not for the dead. It's for the survivors. Many people want a place to gather, pay their respects, and create a tangible connection to their loved ones. There's no theoretic reason why it has to be an individual headstone (versus more dense monuments) or even an outdoor headstone setting (versus cremains in an urn or scattered in a meaningful place) but don't pretend that it has anything to do with the dead. It's a ritual for the living.
  - mhurron 11y ago
    > don't pretend that it has anything to do with the dead It is for the dead. No one is visiting graves of someone who died 200 years ago, yet everyone is up in arms if you mention moving an old cemetery. If you own farmland with a family cemetery (again, 2-300 years old), you have to farm around it, you can not move it. It is for the dead.
    - cge 11y ago
      Moving the bodies themselves seems to be an issue, and I expect there would be awkwardness about allowing farming where there had been a cemetery for perceived health reasons, but there have certainly been cases of repurposing cemeteries. Pioneer Park in San Diego, while having a scan few recent articles about how it was probably a bad idea, didn't seem to cause a huge controversy: the city took an old cemetery in disrepair, took out most of the markers, put up a little memorial in the corner, and turned the rest into parkland. The primary school right next to it, at least when I went there, even used it occasionally for classes, though I expect that has stopped for perceived security reasons.
    - andrewem 11y ago
      Perhaps they're special cases, but I've visited cemeteries of people who died in the 1600s and 1700s in Boston, Plymouth and Salem, Massachusetts. You'll find two cemeteries almost across the street from each other in Boston, right in the center of the city. They're tourist attractions, both for the now-obsolete grave decorations, and for some of the famous people who are buried or at least commemorated there. For instance, you can see markers for people who died in the Boston Massacre in 1770 in the Old Granary Burying Ground; needless to say, it's named for a building which used to stand nearby. King's Chapel Burying Ground, just down the street, has a bonus historical feature - a ventilation shaft for the subway, which I think dates to roughly 1900. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granary_Burying_Ground http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Granary_Burying_Ground http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King%27s_Chapel_Burying_Ground http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King%27s_Chapel_Burying_Ground
      - mhurron 11y ago
- Crito 11y ago
  There is a truly ludicrous amount of unused/underused land left in the US. The only problem is where we are burying people, not that we are burying people in the general case. Cemeteries in cities/suburbs get in the way, but otherwise it isn't a real concern. Seriously, drive across Wyoming sometime and then try to say with a straight face that we are running out of land.

ovulator 11y ago

There is a shift towards cremation in the US http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_cremation_rate http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_cremation_..., though seems to still be eschewed in the south. I don't know if there is any Baptist, or other religious teaching against cremation, or maybe it just has to do with cheaper land.

mhurron 11y ago
Cremation in general has been frowned upon by christianity as pagan.
- jacquesm 11y ago
  At 2 square meters per grave in densely populated areas they're going to sooner or later have to bury people stacked if they don't want the dead to crowd out the living.
  - detaro 11y ago
    How long are grave sites kept in the US? Here in Germany they are reused (25 years is a common period), and family graves are "people buried stacked".
    - zrail 11y ago
      As far as I know burial plots are not reused in the US. You generally buy the plot in perpetuity.
      - maxerickson 11y ago
        It varies. There are sometimes problems with private or small cemeteries that are run by an association running out of funds (or the association can end up with no members left). A search for "cemetery disrepair" returns lots and lots of local news stories.
      - deleted 11y ago

GregBuchholz 11y ago

And think of all the lost phosphorous, for Ford's sake.

acheron 11y ago
It is every citizen's final duty to go into the tanks and become one with all the people. - Chairman Yang, https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Sid_Meier%27s_Alpha_Centauri https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Sid_Meier%27s_Alpha_Centauri

Houshalter 11y ago

My mother is into local history. She would often take me to cemeteries and show me several generations of family members. She told me many stories about them, even though they are long since dead. She knew where all sorts of notable people were buried, and told me stories about them. The graves of the first settlers, a soldier who received the medal of honor in the civil war in the locomotive chase, to a tombstone that was carved out of a meteorite. We spent time planting flowers and keeping the graves nice. Cemeteries are not empty places, there is always someone showing up to visit and mourn for the dead. It's also not wasted land. Every cemetery I've been to was built on land no one wanted. Usually sandy hills that weren't farmable. If and when she dies there is no way I will have her cremated. I hope my great grandchildren tell stories about her in a hundred years.

speeder 11y ago

I like the idea of cemeteries. When my grandma died, I had a blast not only looking at all the art (that is usually very interesting by itself), but also visiting my grandpa grave. The grandpa died when my dad was 6 years old, so I never met him, he was historically important, not just to my family, but to his city, and visiting his grave was nice, people started to remember stuff and talk about him, and I could learn a lot, also could see how he looked like (his grave had a photo of him). Despite never meeting him, I can now use him as a life example to follow.