7 ms·

I've an efficiency fantasy of them piggybacking on the roofs of trucks going in the right direction in order to save fuel, then hopping off when the truck start

by muxxa 12y ago

I've an efficiency fantasy of them piggybacking on the roofs of trucks going in the right direction in order to save fuel, then hopping off when the truck starts to head in a different direction. Techno parasitism.

psb217 12y ago
This is actually how (some) couriers worked in Neal Stephenson's Snow Crash. They latched on to the back of passing cars/trucks with magnetic harpoons and hitched a free ride until they needed to head another way.
- pyre 12y ago
  In a very "Back to the Future meets Cyberpunk" fashion.
- thisjepisje 12y ago
  Donald Duck also did this once.
- Nicholas_C 12y ago
  Dammit, I hear about that book just about every week. I think I might finally cave and read it.
  - esMazer 12y ago
    you know you have to
  - e12e 12y ago
    You should, it's a great book. Published before Stephenson became (apparently) famous enough to ignore his editors and stopped cutting down his material... Both "Snowcrash" and "Diamond Age" are very good.
- neumann 12y ago
  That's how I used to hitch lifts with trucks when doing bike messenger runs that took me down at the docks. Dumb and foolish I was.
  - TeMPOraL 12y ago
    Did you use magnetic harpoons? ;).
acveilleux 12y ago
That would actually cause a net increase of fuel consumption. The drag on the truck would offset the drone's saving. Overpass clearance could also be problematic. The net result would be lawsuits and damaged drones I'm afraid. At least until a drone operator enters into an agreement with a hauling company.
- icegreentea 12y ago
  I think the net change in fuel consumption would be largely dependent on a lot of factors - but mostly on the speed of the truck. Since rolling friction tends to dominate at lower speeds, and a quadcopter expends a lot of energy to stay afloat, then it's likely that for most truck - quadcopter configuration, there exists a critical speed where net fuel (or energy) consumption flips over. My wildass guess is that for most configurations, it would be somewhere above residential speeds (~40km/h), but far below highway speeds (~100km/h).
  - acveilleux 12y ago
    That's what I think too. I've seen the figures on the aerodynamic roof air deflectors they put on semi-trailers and they can get as much as ~8-10% fuel saving at highway speed (ideal size/fit) where the aerodynamic drag is dominant. Semis average around 6.5 mpg these days (flat, highway) so a 10% saving is close to 1 gph of diesel fuel or about 2.80-3.00$/h. So I'd guess drones would add about 1-1.50$/h in fuel cost or so when they latch on. Enough to be noticeable.
- TeMPOraL 12y ago
  I don't think the increase would be that significant, after all you're adding a few kilos to a multi-ton vehicle. But I can see another solution: imagine that the company allows people (not only truckers, but even ordinary car drivers) to lease a roof-mounted drone docking station in exchange for free shipping of all ordered items and/or some meaningful discounts. This would easily offset additional fuel costs, create an incentive for a part of the population to participate in the program, and the dedicated roof station could have some guidance hardware that would help the drone land, as well as a charging station that would let the drone recharge from car's alternator. Seems like a win for everyone, though not very much in a hacker spirit. I'd love to see drones just hitching a ride.
jahewson 12y ago
There's going to be some problematic airflow around vehicles like this. The air behind and to the sides will be turbulent, I'm not sure a drone could safely approach a truck this closely. It might require more powerful motors. A truck on the freeway could be even harder, a drone would need to hold 55mph, throw in a headwind of say 15mph and you'll need a 70mph drone. Even on a highway at 40 + 15mph you're looking at 55mph in an environment with overhead lines, other vehicles, people. Takeoff would be harder still, once the drone is released from a truck then it's instantly doing 55mph, or more if there is a tailwind. Should there be a failure during this mavouvre, there's no safety mechanism: the drone would become a 55mph+ projectile heading straight towards the following car's windshield. So it's insanely dangerous.
- AndrewKemendo 12y ago
  The simple solution is to only deploy/mate when stopped.
  - jahewson 12y ago
    Yes but that's not really what OP was suggesting. A truck on the freeway might be in another state before it stops.
    - josephjrobison 12y ago
      How about putting up a windshield on the top part of the truck?
      - smeyer 12y ago
        Why would you do that? Then the truck would have bad aerodynamics all the time just in case a third party drone wanted to hitch a ride some of the time. If you're going to start using trucks in bulk to transport drones intentionally, then you can probably come up with much better designs.
        12y ago
emiliobumachar 12y ago
Until one of the trucks opens a trapdoor and eats the drone! Techno-predation.

by muxxa 12y ago

psb217 12y ago

This is actually how (some) couriers worked in Neal Stephenson's Snow Crash. They latched on to the back of passing cars/trucks with magnetic harpoons and hitched a free ride until they needed to head another way.

pyre 12y ago
In a very "Back to the Future meets Cyberpunk" fashion.
thisjepisje 12y ago
Donald Duck also did this once.
Nicholas_C 12y ago
Dammit, I hear about that book just about every week. I think I might finally cave and read it.
- esMazer 12y ago
  you know you have to
- e12e 12y ago
  You should, it's a great book. Published before Stephenson became (apparently) famous enough to ignore his editors and stopped cutting down his material... Both "Snowcrash" and "Diamond Age" are very good.
neumann 12y ago
That's how I used to hitch lifts with trucks when doing bike messenger runs that took me down at the docks. Dumb and foolish I was.
- TeMPOraL 12y ago
  Did you use magnetic harpoons? ;).

acveilleux 12y ago

That would actually cause a net increase of fuel consumption. The drag on the truck would offset the drone's saving. Overpass clearance could also be problematic. The net result would be lawsuits and damaged drones I'm afraid. At least until a drone operator enters into an agreement with a hauling company.

icegreentea 12y ago
I think the net change in fuel consumption would be largely dependent on a lot of factors - but mostly on the speed of the truck. Since rolling friction tends to dominate at lower speeds, and a quadcopter expends a lot of energy to stay afloat, then it's likely that for most truck - quadcopter configuration, there exists a critical speed where net fuel (or energy) consumption flips over. My wildass guess is that for most configurations, it would be somewhere above residential speeds (~40km/h), but far below highway speeds (~100km/h).
- acveilleux 12y ago
  That's what I think too. I've seen the figures on the aerodynamic roof air deflectors they put on semi-trailers and they can get as much as ~8-10% fuel saving at highway speed (ideal size/fit) where the aerodynamic drag is dominant. Semis average around 6.5 mpg these days (flat, highway) so a 10% saving is close to 1 gph of diesel fuel or about 2.80-3.00$/h. So I'd guess drones would add about 1-1.50$/h in fuel cost or so when they latch on. Enough to be noticeable.
TeMPOraL 12y ago
I don't think the increase would be that significant, after all you're adding a few kilos to a multi-ton vehicle. But I can see another solution: imagine that the company allows people (not only truckers, but even ordinary car drivers) to lease a roof-mounted drone docking station in exchange for free shipping of all ordered items and/or some meaningful discounts. This would easily offset additional fuel costs, create an incentive for a part of the population to participate in the program, and the dedicated roof station could have some guidance hardware that would help the drone land, as well as a charging station that would let the drone recharge from car's alternator. Seems like a win for everyone, though not very much in a hacker spirit. I'd love to see drones just hitching a ride.

jahewson 12y ago

There's going to be some problematic airflow around vehicles like this. The air behind and to the sides will be turbulent, I'm not sure a drone could safely approach a truck this closely. It might require more powerful motors. A truck on the freeway could be even harder, a drone would need to hold 55mph, throw in a headwind of say 15mph and you'll need a 70mph drone. Even on a highway at 40 + 15mph you're looking at 55mph in an environment with overhead lines, other vehicles, people. Takeoff would be harder still, once the drone is released from a truck then it's instantly doing 55mph, or more if there is a tailwind. Should there be a failure during this mavouvre, there's no safety mechanism: the drone would become a 55mph+ projectile heading straight towards the following car's windshield. So it's insanely dangerous.

AndrewKemendo 12y ago
The simple solution is to only deploy/mate when stopped.
- jahewson 12y ago
  Yes but that's not really what OP was suggesting. A truck on the freeway might be in another state before it stops.
  - josephjrobison 12y ago
    How about putting up a windshield on the top part of the truck?
    - smeyer 12y ago
      Why would you do that? Then the truck would have bad aerodynamics all the time just in case a third party drone wanted to hitch a ride some of the time. If you're going to start using trucks in bulk to transport drones intentionally, then you can probably come up with much better designs.
      - 12y ago

emiliobumachar 12y ago

Until one of the trucks opens a trapdoor and eats the drone! Techno-predation.