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Is there any differentiation between the two on API stability? I got burned last fall trying to build an app with Ember as they kept making breaking changes, e

Is there any differentiation between the two on API stability? I got burned last fall trying to build an app with Ember as they kept making breaking changes, even between release candidates (!). Technically Ember was stable, but Ember Data (which is separate I guess?) was doing major refactoring on their API, and it cost us quite a bit of time just trying to keep up. Even today, their GitHub has a disclaimer that it's beta quality and under active development[1]. Ember CLI also says it's very much WIP[2], even though it seems to be the officially endorsed way to build Ember apps. Does Angular make stronger promises about their stability? Is this sort of thing just the cost of doing business with cutting-edge frameworks? Or am I missing something? [1]: https://github.com/emberjs/data#api-stability https://github.com/emberjs/data#api-stability [2]: http://www.ember-cli.com/#community http://www.ember-cli.com/#community

tunesmith 12y ago
It seems like it is a bad time for finding enterprise-grade js frameworks. Ember has its disclaimer, Angular is impossible to recommend for new projects since 2.0 isn't out yet and will be entirely different than 1.x, react/flux is still releasing breaking changes, and I'm not sure what else would be considered a very strong candidate.
steveklabnik 12y ago
> Is there any differentiation between the two on API stability? Compare http://angularjs.blogspot.co.il/2014/10/ng-europe-angular-13-and-beyond.html http://angularjs.blogspot.co.il/2014/10/ng-europe-angular-13... > Our goal with Angular 2 is to make the best possible set of tools for building web apps not constrained by maintaining backwards compatibility with existing APIs vs https://github.com/emberjs/rfcs/pull/15 https://github.com/emberjs/rfcs/pull/15 > This is not a big-bang rewrite; we will continue development on the master branch, and roll out changes incrementally on the 1.x release train. The 2.0.0 release will simply remove features that have been deprecated between now and then. Our goal is that you can move your Ember app to 2.0 incrementally, one sprint at a time.
- dchuk 12y ago
  The AngularJS guys have since modified their plans a bit: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1dZdq2L8EkzimgvU93ypLF9GJpdzD2jjm08Zal6sfxMQ/edit?hl=en&forcehl=1 https://docs.google.com/document/d/1dZdq2L8EkzimgvU93ypLF9GJ... TL;DR: they're dedicating team members to continue working on 1.X while they build 2.0. They're also planning out a migration strategy for anyone on 1.X when 2.0 launches
  - steveklabnik 12y ago
    Ah! Good to know, thank you!
  - fervisa 12y ago
    Those are great news!
- patrickaljord 12y ago
  You forgot to quote the second part of the paragraph that says: > Once we have an initial version of Angular 2, we'll start to work on a migration path for Angular 1 apps. Not very intellectually honest of you, in addition you forgot to mention that you're an Ember contributor. Also, as have been said, this: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1dZdq2L8EkzimgvU93ypLF9GJpdzD2jjm08Zal6sfxMQ/edit?hl=en&forcehl=1 https://docs.google.com/document/d/1dZdq2L8EkzimgvU93ypLF9GJ...
  - steveklabnik 12y ago
    > in addition you forgot to mention that you're an Ember contributor. I don't have any patches into Ember. I believe they added in the migration path after I had read it, as that's why everyone had been so upset over the announcement.
  - sandstrom 12y ago
    Not much in terms of contribution to be found on Github: https://github.com/emberjs/ember.js/commits?author=steveklabnik https://github.com/emberjs/ember.js/commits?author=steveklab... He has contributed to a great deal of other open source projects though. Mostly Rust lately it seems: https://github.com/steveklabnik?tab=activity https://github.com/steveklabnik?tab=activity
thibaut_barrere 12y ago
I found that http://knockoutjs.com/ http://knockoutjs.com/ (which I ultimately picked instead of Angular or Ember) takes backward compatibility very seriously (http://knockoutjs.com/upgrade-notes/v3.0.0.html http://knockoutjs.com/upgrade-notes/v3.0.0.html).

tunesmith 12y ago

It seems like it is a bad time for finding enterprise-grade js frameworks. Ember has its disclaimer, Angular is impossible to recommend for new projects since 2.0 isn't out yet and will be entirely different than 1.x, react/flux is still releasing breaking changes, and I'm not sure what else would be considered a very strong candidate.

steveklabnik 12y ago

> Is there any differentiation between the two on API stability? Compare http://angularjs.blogspot.co.il/2014/10/ng-europe-angular-13-and-beyond.html http://angularjs.blogspot.co.il/2014/10/ng-europe-angular-13... > Our goal with Angular 2 is to make the best possible set of tools for building web apps not constrained by maintaining backwards compatibility with existing APIs vs https://github.com/emberjs/rfcs/pull/15 https://github.com/emberjs/rfcs/pull/15 > This is not a big-bang rewrite; we will continue development on the master branch, and roll out changes incrementally on the 1.x release train. The 2.0.0 release will simply remove features that have been deprecated between now and then. Our goal is that you can move your Ember app to 2.0 incrementally, one sprint at a time.

dchuk 12y ago
The AngularJS guys have since modified their plans a bit: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1dZdq2L8EkzimgvU93ypLF9GJpdzD2jjm08Zal6sfxMQ/edit?hl=en&forcehl=1 https://docs.google.com/document/d/1dZdq2L8EkzimgvU93ypLF9GJ... TL;DR: they're dedicating team members to continue working on 1.X while they build 2.0. They're also planning out a migration strategy for anyone on 1.X when 2.0 launches
- steveklabnik 12y ago
  Ah! Good to know, thank you!
- fervisa 12y ago
  Those are great news!
patrickaljord 12y ago
You forgot to quote the second part of the paragraph that says: > Once we have an initial version of Angular 2, we'll start to work on a migration path for Angular 1 apps. Not very intellectually honest of you, in addition you forgot to mention that you're an Ember contributor. Also, as have been said, this: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1dZdq2L8EkzimgvU93ypLF9GJpdzD2jjm08Zal6sfxMQ/edit?hl=en&forcehl=1 https://docs.google.com/document/d/1dZdq2L8EkzimgvU93ypLF9GJ...
- steveklabnik 12y ago
  > in addition you forgot to mention that you're an Ember contributor. I don't have any patches into Ember. I believe they added in the migration path after I had read it, as that's why everyone had been so upset over the announcement.
- sandstrom 12y ago
  Not much in terms of contribution to be found on Github: https://github.com/emberjs/ember.js/commits?author=steveklabnik https://github.com/emberjs/ember.js/commits?author=steveklab... He has contributed to a great deal of other open source projects though. Mostly Rust lately it seems: https://github.com/steveklabnik?tab=activity https://github.com/steveklabnik?tab=activity

thibaut_barrere 12y ago

I found that http://knockoutjs.com/ http://knockoutjs.com/ (which I ultimately picked instead of Angular or Ember) takes backward compatibility very seriously (http://knockoutjs.com/upgrade-notes/v3.0.0.html http://knockoutjs.com/upgrade-notes/v3.0.0.html).