4 ms·

Fascinating stuff but the concept of intelligence is rather nebulous. Their operational definition is cobbled together from things that people have intuitively

Fascinating stuff but the concept of intelligence is rather nebulous. Their operational definition is cobbled together from things that people have intuitively considered important like eye tracking and tool use. But these aren't connected to any deeper explanatory theories. Personally I'd be inclined to selectively breed chimps on the basis of how well they follow instructions (since instructions are perforce couched in abstract symbols and language is the quintessentially human trait).

wyager 12y ago
>how well they follow instructions It is possible to be intelligent and unwilling to follow instructions. In fact, I would not be surprised if there was an inverse correlation between the two in humans.
- ytturbed 12y ago
  >It is possible to be intelligent and unwilling to follow instructions True. But whether an instruction has been followed is easy to measure and relates directly to language, unlike the other criteria in Table 1. Also, note that chimps are capable of tearing limbs from humans. So if people could be bred from them I would like them to be basically friendly and cooperative.
jsnk 12y ago
I feel like every chatter about intelligence comes down to arguing over the operational definition of intelligence. Isn't it obvious that abilities such as simple arithmetics, memory, linguistic ability, recognizing patterns have at least something to do with intelligence?
- ytturbed 12y ago
  No, it's not obvious. If it were then we'd have programmed an AGI by now.
  - JamesArgo 12y ago
    So basically, we can't make a photodetector without first being able to create a sun?
    - ytturbed 12y ago
      We can't measure things we don't understand. Note that a photodetector detects light, not suns.
      - JamesArgo 12y ago
        >We can't measure things we don't understand. What? Was everyone blind before the discovery of quantum mechanics? If we can't measure things we don't understand, how the heck would we come to understand them? Through their affects on the world? "No, you say, "we can not perceive things whose causes we don't understand." Where did you get your epistemology? Was it The Secret?
        ytturbed 12y ago
        >Where did you get your epistemology? Karl Popper. >If we can't measure things we don't understand, how the heck would we come to understand them? We get new ideas, such as the concept of distance, by guessing them in response to problems.

wyager 12y ago

>how well they follow instructions It is possible to be intelligent and unwilling to follow instructions. In fact, I would not be surprised if there was an inverse correlation between the two in humans.

ytturbed 12y ago
>It is possible to be intelligent and unwilling to follow instructions True. But whether an instruction has been followed is easy to measure and relates directly to language, unlike the other criteria in Table 1. Also, note that chimps are capable of tearing limbs from humans. So if people could be bred from them I would like them to be basically friendly and cooperative.

jsnk 12y ago

I feel like every chatter about intelligence comes down to arguing over the operational definition of intelligence. Isn't it obvious that abilities such as simple arithmetics, memory, linguistic ability, recognizing patterns have at least something to do with intelligence?

ytturbed 12y ago
No, it's not obvious. If it were then we'd have programmed an AGI by now.
- JamesArgo 12y ago
  So basically, we can't make a photodetector without first being able to create a sun?
  - ytturbed 12y ago
    We can't measure things we don't understand. Note that a photodetector detects light, not suns.
    - JamesArgo 12y ago
      >We can't measure things we don't understand. What? Was everyone blind before the discovery of quantum mechanics? If we can't measure things we don't understand, how the heck would we come to understand them? Through their affects on the world? "No, you say, "we can not perceive things whose causes we don't understand." Where did you get your epistemology? Was it The Secret?
      - ytturbed 12y ago
        >Where did you get your epistemology? Karl Popper. >If we can't measure things we don't understand, how the heck would we come to understand them? We get new ideas, such as the concept of distance, by guessing them in response to problems.