5 ms·

I'd only change it to "... blaming drivers on your toll bridge when you're the one ..." The drivers (customers) are paying for the bridge!

by awda 12y ago

will_work4tears 12y ago
Isn't that true with all bridges though? You don't have to pay for each use, but you sure paid for the construction and potentially the upkeep (or are likely to have paid).
- aroch 12y ago
  Some bridges, such as the Seattle Lake Washington bridge, require a toll to cross even though they're on a toll-free highway.
- awda 12y ago
  This is going very tangential, but no, not all bridges are directly paid for only by people driving on them. To make public bridges into an ISP analogy, imagine: municipal and state taxes as well as tax revenue from other states (via Federal highway dollars) pay for a municipal broadband network. You may or may not actually use the service, and you pay for it either way. You likely don't have any other choice of ISP. And it's not-for-profit, and the general public and lawmakers constantly clamor and legislate for better service at lower prices.
  - jdhzzz 12y ago
    Although not true, I always liked to think that taxes on my vehicle, fuel, and tolls paid for the infrastructure upon which I drive. I have no idea whether those are sufficient, but I'll bet in my state they state of high taxes and crappy infrastructure they are more than enough.
    - tomkarlo 12y ago
      Generally, the taxes and tolls levied on drivers only pay for ~50% of US road spending - the balance comes out of the general tax pool on both drivers and non-drivers, so it's (arguably) heavily subsidized. (But one could argue that non-drivers benefit from the road system in terms of things delivered to them by truck, etc.)
      - antsar 12y ago
        > non-drivers benefit from the road system in terms of things delivered to them by truck Perhaps, but they pay a delivery company for that, which pays taxes for its trucks to use those roads.
        vajrabum 12y ago
        Yes, once again, at about 50% of the cost of maintaining the provided road.
roc 12y ago
Sure, but they're only using the bridge to drive to McDonalds. It's McDonalds generating all that traffic -- they should pay the bridge operator too! /sarcasm.
- smsm42 12y ago
  If we had usage-paid highways (which we couldn't have earlier due to missing technology but now such things start to pop up), I can imagine some remotely-located mega-store could advertise as "come to us and we'll pay your road toll - both directions!".
  - Argorak 12y ago
    Usage-paid highways have been standard in some countries for ages - they just use toll bridges at every entrance and exit and deduce your price from entrance and exit position.
  - astrodust 12y ago
    Subsidized parking is a similar sort of thing.
- rodedwards 12y ago
  They do. Property taxes.
  - jjoonathan 12y ago
    Seeing as ISPs also receive money from the government and Netflix pays taxes, you could make the same pointless observation about Netflix and Verizon. But you shouldn't. This discussion is about a direct company-to-company attempted shakedown, not inefficient procurement.
  - wpietri 12y ago
    I'm not sure you mean to argue for a publicly funded Internet, but that's basically what this implies.
SeoxyS 12y ago
I'd say it's like blaming Toyota for the traffic jams when you close lanes on the bay bridge. Or alternatively like planing the SF Giants or AT&T Park for the traffic jams when you close lanes on the bay bridge.

I'd only change it to "... blaming drivers on your toll bridge when you're the one ..." The drivers (customers) are paying for the bridge!

by awda 12y ago

I'd only change it to "... blaming drivers on your toll bridge when you're the one ..." The drivers (customers) are paying for the bridge!

will_work4tears 12y ago

Isn't that true with all bridges though? You don't have to pay for each use, but you sure paid for the construction and potentially the upkeep (or are likely to have paid).

aroch 12y ago
Some bridges, such as the Seattle Lake Washington bridge, require a toll to cross even though they're on a toll-free highway.
awda 12y ago
This is going very tangential, but no, not all bridges are directly paid for only by people driving on them. To make public bridges into an ISP analogy, imagine: municipal and state taxes as well as tax revenue from other states (via Federal highway dollars) pay for a municipal broadband network. You may or may not actually use the service, and you pay for it either way. You likely don't have any other choice of ISP. And it's not-for-profit, and the general public and lawmakers constantly clamor and legislate for better service at lower prices.
- jdhzzz 12y ago
  Although not true, I always liked to think that taxes on my vehicle, fuel, and tolls paid for the infrastructure upon which I drive. I have no idea whether those are sufficient, but I'll bet in my state they state of high taxes and crappy infrastructure they are more than enough.
  - tomkarlo 12y ago
    Generally, the taxes and tolls levied on drivers only pay for ~50% of US road spending - the balance comes out of the general tax pool on both drivers and non-drivers, so it's (arguably) heavily subsidized. (But one could argue that non-drivers benefit from the road system in terms of things delivered to them by truck, etc.)
    - antsar 12y ago
      > non-drivers benefit from the road system in terms of things delivered to them by truck Perhaps, but they pay a delivery company for that, which pays taxes for its trucks to use those roads.
      - vajrabum 12y ago
        Yes, once again, at about 50% of the cost of maintaining the provided road.

roc 12y ago

Sure, but they're only using the bridge to drive to McDonalds. It's McDonalds generating all that traffic -- they should pay the bridge operator too! /sarcasm.

smsm42 12y ago
If we had usage-paid highways (which we couldn't have earlier due to missing technology but now such things start to pop up), I can imagine some remotely-located mega-store could advertise as "come to us and we'll pay your road toll - both directions!".
- Argorak 12y ago
  Usage-paid highways have been standard in some countries for ages - they just use toll bridges at every entrance and exit and deduce your price from entrance and exit position.
- astrodust 12y ago
  Subsidized parking is a similar sort of thing.
rodedwards 12y ago
They do. Property taxes.
- jjoonathan 12y ago
  Seeing as ISPs also receive money from the government and Netflix pays taxes, you could make the same pointless observation about Netflix and Verizon. But you shouldn't. This discussion is about a direct company-to-company attempted shakedown, not inefficient procurement.
- wpietri 12y ago
  I'm not sure you mean to argue for a publicly funded Internet, but that's basically what this implies.

SeoxyS 12y ago

I'd say it's like blaming Toyota for the traffic jams when you close lanes on the bay bridge. Or alternatively like planing the SF Giants or AT&T Park for the traffic jams when you close lanes on the bay bridge.