6 ms·

Dead Man's Switch

154 points by AndyBaker 12y ago

Inversechi 12y ago
Looks like the certificate on this site has since expired.
Lambent_Cactus 12y ago
This is a scary thing to be the person running, no? Could be the hook for a great thriller.
Vespasian 12y ago
Hmm I don't like the idea of involving a third (untrusted party) with what could be basically the key to your whole online identity. I would love to see a system which allows your heirs to access online accounts without having to fear that a simple government request will hand them everything they need on a silver plate (including stuff not obviously related to you). Probably physical objects need to be involved (code on paper etc) but then again how to make sure the next best burglar doesn't get the prize of his lifetime. Does anyone know of such a solution?
- tbrownaw 12y ago
  Probably physical objects need to be involved (code on paper etc) but then again how to make sure the next best burglar doesn't get the prize of his lifetime. Does anyone know of such a solution? Put it in a safe deposit box at your local bank?
  - Domenic_S 12y ago
    Pretty much. All my online logins are long random passwords stored in either 1Password or my phone. I've considered writing up my password (to 1PW), and computer unlock PW, and dropping it in my safe deposit box, updating it monthly or whenever I change those passwords. Any good reason not to?
    - roywiggins 12y ago
      First thing that comes to mind- not a lawyer but: It's probably going to be harder to force you to divulge a password in a court case than to just subpoena the piece of paper with your password on it and the computer with the 1PW database.
  - Vespasian 12y ago
    But wouldn't that allow a simple subpoena to get access to everything? Certainly it's the best bet against criminals
- GavinB 12y ago
  Encrypt what you put behind the Dead Man's Switch, and then give the recipient/heir the key. If you want to get fancy, break the key up into two or more parts and split them among your heirs.
  - marcosdumay 12y ago
    Well, split the payload between them with instructions, and get done for once.
- dublinben 12y ago
  The obvious way of granting something to your heirs is to include it in your last will and testament. You could split the keys to your identity among different heirs, or give the complete key to any one of them.
- licnep 12y ago
  >Does anyone know of such a solution? I coded something like this myself a while ago. You can run it on a server or a local computer. The data is encrypted, no need to trust third parties: https://github.com/licnep/afterlife-plans https://github.com/licnep/afterlife-plans
gprasanth 12y ago
Haha. Very sensitive code over http!
- theboss 12y ago
  Not even just the code....your password and email are both over http.......
  - jimktrains2 12y ago
    The form action for login appears to be https, but not the code... I don't know why people bother not just httpsing everything if they have the cert. It avoids these types of worries and appearance.
    - Torgo 12y ago
      The cert is expired anyway.
      - jimktrains2 12y ago
        I didn't even check. It expired in Jan 2013....wow I'm betting the project isn't maintained anymore?
        logn 12y ago
        The whois record mentions a contact at http://www.digital-z.net/ http://www.digital-z.net/ which returns <html> <head> <title>One...</title> </head> <body> <center> May you live in not too interesting dreams.<br> Thank you and good night.<br> </center> </body> </html> ... which would indicate they're gone. And the deadmansswitch.org has a footer that points to http://binarymonkey.com http://binarymonkey.com which has a 2008 copyright date. In one year the app's domain will expire which could be unfortunate if anyone expected an actual dead man's switch.
        12y ago
simonswords82 12y ago
This is an idea that has been around in various forms for a number of years. A number of other sites have popped up but like a number of people have already said, I don't trust random third parties with the keys to my online life.
- noir_lord 12y ago
  Two keys, you put one on memory sticks which you give to friends/family you trust. In the event anything happens to you the other key is sent to those people allowing them to decrypt it. Service can't access your data as it only has one and same for trusted person. I'm sure something like this already exists (and tbh the level of effort required to set it up pretty much makes it unlikely to catch on) but it is theoretically workable.
  - bentcorner 12y ago
    You don't need any keys. Just say "I wrote how to log into my email on a piece of paper in the safe deposit box. You may have found it already."
    - mitochondrion 12y ago
      But that doesn't have enough points of failure!
  - jlgaddis 12y ago
    For those of us who run FreeBSD, there's gshsec(8): http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/man.cgi?gshsec http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/man.cgi?gshsec Want to set up a "2 of 3" (or similar) scheme? You could use, for example, a three-disk RAID5 using USB flash drives.
- dudus 12y ago
  Yet it's a problem to be solved.
  - GrinningFool 12y ago
rys 12y ago
I bought deadmansswit.ch a couple of years ago and started building something similar to this, at least in terms of the "do something useful when a period of time with no contact had elapsed", but none of the "do something useful"s required needing your credentials for anything. Domain is freely available again, I gave up on the project and rolled the useful code into something else.
alasdair_ 12y ago
Excellent way to make money :) Just run this service for a few years without actually encrypting the data, then charge $20/month to NOT release the information.
- EC1 12y ago
  Ah, the classic Bait and Switch SaaS.
- Corrado 12y ago
  This reminded me of the old Monty Python sketch "Blackmail"[1] where they charge people to not release information. The longer you wait the more it costs you. Very funny stuff. :) [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wZgwNutwK0Y https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wZgwNutwK0Y
john_b 12y ago
This is something I've thought about, and as I see it a lot of the problems common to crypto software are manifest in this space as well. Specifically with regard to security vs useability/ease-of-adoption issues. This particular implementation transmits sensitive data in the clear and does the encryption server-side, so it's hard to take it seriously except as a remote (and unsecure) notification service. Aside from that obvious shortcoming, a truly secure and reliable DMS system would need the following properties, possibly more: 1. All data encrypted client side and sent to system only in encrypted form 2. Anonymous 3. Distributed (no single point of failure for DDOS attacks or subpoenas) 4. Any data sent into the DMS system is split into several pieces and only reassembled after the set time without a response has elapsed and the switch is triggered A peer-to-peer application that transmits data exclusively via TOR would probably be most secure, but it's unclear what the motivation for running an instance of this kind of P2P application would be (since it's all encrypted you aren't downloading anything useful) or how many people would actively participate. Any server-based system would need to have a large number of servers in multiple countries to be robust to technical and legal challenges, and that sounds expensive. At the same time, a reliable and anonymous DMS system is something that I can see people paying a small subscription fee for. Any way you slice it, it seems like there are a lot of hard problems to solve in this area, but a reliable DMS service would be extremely useful.
- eudox 12y ago
  Obviously the solution is a DeadManSwitchCoin.
  - arielweisberg 12y ago
    I proposed this in an earlier thread and got some push back on the utility of the concept https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6509824 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6509824
    - tlrobinson 12y ago
      gwern has a great summary of "time-lock encryption" possibilities: http://www.gwern.net/Self-decrypting%20files http://www.gwern.net/Self-decrypting%20files
Ryel 12y ago
I wish there was a better way of determining whether you were alive or not. There's an endless number of possibilities as to what could happen in order for me to not be able to go online and verify with that link. Why would I put myself through the stress of potentially forgetting and now I have to worry about the secrets of my dying breathe being released to the public while I'm still around. If I wanted anything to be taken care of I'd feel much safer keeping it in offline storage with a note attached. What I think you should do is have a tiered level of notifications. For example an email every week is the first round of notifications. Then I wonder if you could pull my last login info from major services that are going to be around for awhile like Amazon, Google, Apple, Facebook(debatable), and if I havent logged into any of those services in 1 week, then go to the final round of notifications which is an in-person phone call.
- evanlivingston 12y ago
  A week seems like a short amount of time. If you're dead, we're not talking about safety here—urgency is less important. I think even a mail every month would be sufficient.
  - StavrosK 12y ago
    That's what http://www.deadmansswitch.net/ http://www.deadmansswitch.net/ (disclosure: I wrote it) does, it also has configurable intervals so you can make them as short or as long as you want. It sends you an email every interval, and, if you don't reply to any of them, it sends your messages.
    - sitkack 12y ago
      Can I have copies of all the user submitted data? Probably full of bank account details, safe combos, etc.
- whywhywhy5 12y ago
  How about a site where you enter your SSN? Then if you're ever listed as deceased in the Social Security Death Index, that will be the trigger.
zw123456 12y ago
I think an app on your phone is a better way, if the phone has not moved in the last 24 hours or whatever, then an email could be sent. Something like that.
- baby 12y ago
  so if you lose your phone? Change your phone? etc...
- buffsquid 12y ago
  I wrote a quick bash script for running a simple dead man's switch a few years ago: http://blog.mcglew.net/2012/09/dead-mans-switch-on-linux-part-1-basic.html http://blog.mcglew.net/2012/09/dead-mans-switch-on-linux-par... You can reset the switch in any way you like, I was playing around with emailing through single-use codes and port knocking and so on. One I never got around to trying is a basic phone check: You have a cron job that scans all bluetooth devices within range and checks for your phone's MAC address. If it's there, it resets the timer. If you're out of physical range (or turn off your bluetooth) for too long, it triggers the switch. Not quite what you described but it does perform some of the same function.
baby 12y ago
I've thought about that service a lot and this solution is not working because : * I have to constantly check my mails to prove I'm not dead * The other person's mail will without any doubt change if I die in 10+ years * Can this service live up to 50+ years? I'm really doubting that as well.
- bentcorner 12y ago
  > * I have to constantly check my mails to prove I'm not dead It nag mails you so you don't forget. Otherwise, add a reminder with a link to click on on the first of every month. > * The other person's mail will without any doubt change if I die in 10+ years You'll be clicking on this thing every month, I'm pretty certain if your SO's email changes you'll update it at that time. > * Can this service live up to 50+ years? I'm really doubting that as well. It only needs to be up when you die, again, you're clicking on this thing every month, if the service dies and you find utility in the concept, you'll find a different service to use.
  - baby 12y ago
    > you're clicking on this thing every month That's a huge problem. You tell me I have to click on a link at least once a month for the rest of my life. First, I don't know if I'll have the same email for the rest of my life, if I change I'll have to think about changing that notification, that will have become spam in my mind. Second, There surely will be a month in my life where I won't check my mails. I can't think further, the thing has become a "hassle" that I have to constantly check and correct if someone change its mail, or in case it would think I'm dead, and this, for the rest of my life. IMO there are better solutions for this type of problem, we just haven't found them yet.
    - bentcorner 12y ago
      > That's a huge problem. You tell me I have to click on a link at least once a month for the rest of my life. shrug from the point of view of someone who has opted in, this isn't a big deal. People don't change email addresses that often, and if you're the type who doesn't check email for longer than a month, then yeah, this isn't for you. The bigger problem is that this service is hard to test. When you really want it to work there really isn't a second chance. Which means you shouldn't be relying on this thing 100%. It's best to put something in your will and instructions in a safe place.
jlebrech 12y ago
here's another type of dead mans switch, embed 'where now() < '1st January 2016' in your SQL :)
dfcarney 12y ago
At least nobody can say the NSA isn't creative.
chrisBob 12y ago
This seems like a good option if I am ever in an action movie and I need to tell the bad guy that all of the information will be released to CNN and the NYT if anything happens to me. If I come up with something I can't tell my wife while I am alive, I will probably just put it in my will.
- jliptzin 12y ago
  What prevents the bad guy from torturing you until you disable the DMS, then kill you?
  - tormeh 12y ago
    Any good DMS of that calibre can't be disabled. The operator must take upfront payment and not care if you die or not, only fulfilling a contract you can't go back on. Sounds like something a Swiss bank could do for you, if stereotype is to be believed.
    - marcosdumay 12y ago
      Oh man, now that bad guy will torture swiss bankers... As a second thought, could lead to a slower, but much more interesting movie.
    - jliptzin 12y ago
      Well, that may be so, but try explaining that to a (probably) not so intelligent bad guy who will just continue torturing you. Maybe a good feature for a DMS system would be a fake shut off switch that appears to be convincing to an adversary.
chrisBob 12y ago
30 days seems long, but I guess if I am in a hurry I could set up 10 of them with 3 days in between so that it is always 72 hours out...
- gabriel34 12y ago
  You'd need to only answer every email 27 days after receipt, which can be easily automated (no the answer, but you could delay it being shown in your inbox, or fowarded to your main or something) but it would be a pain to keep it up and not reveal info that could be harmful to the still-living you. and when you die... spam everywhere? Is that really how you'd like to be remembered? :)
- hatu 12y ago
  We're pretty much surrounded by internet wherever we go these days but still, I could imagine taking four weeks off without any access to the internet and wouldn't want people to think I died.
jlebrech 12y ago
I thought of something similar to send tweets from the grave, you add an app to twitter and it'll start tweeting messages after you stop tweeting for 2 years.
gourneau 12y ago
One of my favorite short stories of all time is titled Death Switch, written by David Eagleman. It is about this idea extrapolated, well worth a read : http://deathswitch.com/deathswitch.pdf http://deathswitch.com/deathswitch.pdf
jonalmeida 12y ago
I too have thought about this. How am I going to pass on my account information/bitcoins and other secret detective work? My idea was to open a security box in a bank that contained hand written keys to open an encrypted password store in some publicly accessible location. If I died, that security box should go to the next family members who would be the only ones that can get access to it. I fear there are loop-holes in that idea now..
- err4nt 12y ago
  ever heard of geocaching? The idea is that you leave things hidden around the world with GPD coordinates and hints of the location and other geocachers will grab their GPD devices (or smartphones) and hunt down your cache based on the location provided and your hints. It's like a big scavenger hunt. What if you looked up caching 'best practices' for how to safely store items for in the weather, then stashed your valuable information somewhere nobody would find it. Keep track of the location the same way you would a geocache, but obviously don't publish it publicly. Then all you need to do is leave the cache-retrieving information in your legal will and the right people will have access to it at the right time, and it's as safe from prying eyes as you're ever going to get in the meantime :)
tlrobinson 12y ago
I wouldn't trust a random service like this with anything worth putting on a dead man's switch. At a minimum you should use PGP, but sadly most the people I'd want to use this with have no idea what PGP is. Maybe Keybase.io will eventually help with that.
whileonebegin 12y ago
Better solution? Google Inactive Account Manager https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/3036514 https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/3036514 And for sending emails in the future: Boomerang for Gmail https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/boomerang-for-gmail/mdanidgdpmkimeiiojknlnekblgmpdll https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/boomerang-for-gmai...
eplanit 12y ago
I like it. There should also be a "delete" feature in addition to notification. Sort of a self-destruct dropbox (in the generic sense) to contain your most private and personal data -- bits you want to "take to the grave" with you, so to speak. They only exist there for as long as you respond to the ping, otherwise they're deleted. Maybe it's already thought about by the creators, but it's not apparent in the description. My $0.02
- eurleif 12y ago
  Meh, why not just store them locally (or on Dropbox) encrypted with a key only you know?
sitkack 12y ago
Why would I send sensitive data to an unknown website? Makes no sense. And if the data is too valuable, good reason to kill me and get a treat.
Houshalter 12y ago
Please no one actually use this. There is no reason to trust this site with sensitive information, and there is even some evidence it may no longer be maintained (see logn's comment.)
allochthon 12y ago
Interesting site. Hope it is difficult to break into. Does anyone know what happened with the woman who put up a post on Facebook (I think) saying that if people didn't hear back in a certain amount of time, she had last been to visit some guy? I am having a hard time finding the HN link.
bigmario 12y ago
I don't think anyone's said it yet, but... this is what an attorney is for. This website is stupid. It's bad enough to trust any confidential information completely to a third party, let alone a website that could lose your information or go defunct in a few years. At least disclosures to attorneys are legally protected to the n-th degree, and the business is brick-and-mortar with a known location. Add to that the fact that a regular e-mail is something that could easily be forgotten about, caught by a spam e-mail, lost when you switch accounts, etc. The problems with this idea are endless
rwallace 12y ago
I'm curious, when would you actually use this? I mean obviously the imagination readily conjures up movie scenarios, 'if anything happens to me your nefarious plans for world domination will be sent to the New York Times!' but in real life the evil overlord could counter that in half a dozen ways. Is anyone here looking to use such a service, and if so, for what sort of purpose?
neotek 12y ago
For a second I thought this was a link to https://deadmanssnitch.com https://deadmanssnitch.com, which is a fantastically simple cronjob monitor.
tempodox 12y ago
It broke: <pre> Could not open file (/tmp/deadmansswitch//Apache-Session-1d3379ba5947e7943750160d5cfee2c7.lock) for writing: No space left on device at /usr/local/share/perl/5.14.2/Apache/Session/Lock/File.pm line 75. </pre>
- flym4n 12y ago
  https://web.archive.org/web/20140101055243/http://deadmansswitch.org/ https://web.archive.org/web/20140101055243/http://deadmanssw...
codesuela 12y ago
> Every effort is made to protect your information except for hosting the service in NSA country
- deleted 12y ago
  [deleted]

Dead Man's Switch

154 points by AndyBaker 12y ago

Inversechi 12y ago

Looks like the certificate on this site has since expired.

Lambent_Cactus 12y ago

This is a scary thing to be the person running, no? Could be the hook for a great thriller.

Vespasian 12y ago

Hmm I don't like the idea of involving a third (untrusted party) with what could be basically the key to your whole online identity. I would love to see a system which allows your heirs to access online accounts without having to fear that a simple government request will hand them everything they need on a silver plate (including stuff not obviously related to you). Probably physical objects need to be involved (code on paper etc) but then again how to make sure the next best burglar doesn't get the prize of his lifetime. Does anyone know of such a solution?

tbrownaw 12y ago
Probably physical objects need to be involved (code on paper etc) but then again how to make sure the next best burglar doesn't get the prize of his lifetime. Does anyone know of such a solution? Put it in a safe deposit box at your local bank?
- Domenic_S 12y ago
  Pretty much. All my online logins are long random passwords stored in either 1Password or my phone. I've considered writing up my password (to 1PW), and computer unlock PW, and dropping it in my safe deposit box, updating it monthly or whenever I change those passwords. Any good reason not to?
  - roywiggins 12y ago
    First thing that comes to mind- not a lawyer but: It's probably going to be harder to force you to divulge a password in a court case than to just subpoena the piece of paper with your password on it and the computer with the 1PW database.
- Vespasian 12y ago
  But wouldn't that allow a simple subpoena to get access to everything? Certainly it's the best bet against criminals
GavinB 12y ago
Encrypt what you put behind the Dead Man's Switch, and then give the recipient/heir the key. If you want to get fancy, break the key up into two or more parts and split them among your heirs.
- marcosdumay 12y ago
  Well, split the payload between them with instructions, and get done for once.
dublinben 12y ago
The obvious way of granting something to your heirs is to include it in your last will and testament. You could split the keys to your identity among different heirs, or give the complete key to any one of them.
licnep 12y ago
>Does anyone know of such a solution? I coded something like this myself a while ago. You can run it on a server or a local computer. The data is encrypted, no need to trust third parties: https://github.com/licnep/afterlife-plans https://github.com/licnep/afterlife-plans

gprasanth 12y ago

Haha. Very sensitive code over http!

theboss 12y ago
Not even just the code....your password and email are both over http.......
- jimktrains2 12y ago
  The form action for login appears to be https, but not the code... I don't know why people bother not just httpsing everything if they have the cert. It avoids these types of worries and appearance.
  - Torgo 12y ago
    The cert is expired anyway.
    - jimktrains2 12y ago
      I didn't even check. It expired in Jan 2013....wow I'm betting the project isn't maintained anymore?
      - logn 12y ago
        The whois record mentions a contact at http://www.digital-z.net/ http://www.digital-z.net/ which returns <html> <head> <title>One...</title> </head> <body> <center> May you live in not too interesting dreams.<br> Thank you and good night.<br> </center> </body> </html> ... which would indicate they're gone. And the deadmansswitch.org has a footer that points to http://binarymonkey.com http://binarymonkey.com which has a 2008 copyright date. In one year the app's domain will expire which could be unfortunate if anyone expected an actual dead man's switch.
        12y ago

simonswords82 12y ago

This is an idea that has been around in various forms for a number of years. A number of other sites have popped up but like a number of people have already said, I don't trust random third parties with the keys to my online life.

noir_lord 12y ago
Two keys, you put one on memory sticks which you give to friends/family you trust. In the event anything happens to you the other key is sent to those people allowing them to decrypt it. Service can't access your data as it only has one and same for trusted person. I'm sure something like this already exists (and tbh the level of effort required to set it up pretty much makes it unlikely to catch on) but it is theoretically workable.
- bentcorner 12y ago
  You don't need any keys. Just say "I wrote how to log into my email on a piece of paper in the safe deposit box. You may have found it already."
  - mitochondrion 12y ago
    But that doesn't have enough points of failure!
- jlgaddis 12y ago
  For those of us who run FreeBSD, there's gshsec(8): http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/man.cgi?gshsec http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/man.cgi?gshsec Want to set up a "2 of 3" (or similar) scheme? You could use, for example, a three-disk RAID5 using USB flash drives.
dudus 12y ago
Yet it's a problem to be solved.
- GrinningFool 12y ago

rys 12y ago

I bought deadmansswit.ch a couple of years ago and started building something similar to this, at least in terms of the "do something useful when a period of time with no contact had elapsed", but none of the "do something useful"s required needing your credentials for anything. Domain is freely available again, I gave up on the project and rolled the useful code into something else.

alasdair_ 12y ago

Excellent way to make money :) Just run this service for a few years without actually encrypting the data, then charge $20/month to NOT release the information.

EC1 12y ago
Ah, the classic Bait and Switch SaaS.
Corrado 12y ago
This reminded me of the old Monty Python sketch "Blackmail"[1] where they charge people to not release information. The longer you wait the more it costs you. Very funny stuff. :) [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wZgwNutwK0Y https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wZgwNutwK0Y

john_b 12y ago

This is something I've thought about, and as I see it a lot of the problems common to crypto software are manifest in this space as well. Specifically with regard to security vs useability/ease-of-adoption issues. This particular implementation transmits sensitive data in the clear and does the encryption server-side, so it's hard to take it seriously except as a remote (and unsecure) notification service. Aside from that obvious shortcoming, a truly secure and reliable DMS system would need the following properties, possibly more: 1. All data encrypted client side and sent to system only in encrypted form 2. Anonymous 3. Distributed (no single point of failure for DDOS attacks or subpoenas) 4. Any data sent into the DMS system is split into several pieces and only reassembled after the set time without a response has elapsed and the switch is triggered A peer-to-peer application that transmits data exclusively via TOR would probably be most secure, but it's unclear what the motivation for running an instance of this kind of P2P application would be (since it's all encrypted you aren't downloading anything useful) or how many people would actively participate. Any server-based system would need to have a large number of servers in multiple countries to be robust to technical and legal challenges, and that sounds expensive. At the same time, a reliable and anonymous DMS system is something that I can see people paying a small subscription fee for. Any way you slice it, it seems like there are a lot of hard problems to solve in this area, but a reliable DMS service would be extremely useful.

eudox 12y ago
Obviously the solution is a DeadManSwitchCoin.
- arielweisberg 12y ago
  I proposed this in an earlier thread and got some push back on the utility of the concept https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6509824 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6509824
  - tlrobinson 12y ago
    gwern has a great summary of "time-lock encryption" possibilities: http://www.gwern.net/Self-decrypting%20files http://www.gwern.net/Self-decrypting%20files

Ryel 12y ago

I wish there was a better way of determining whether you were alive or not. There's an endless number of possibilities as to what could happen in order for me to not be able to go online and verify with that link. Why would I put myself through the stress of potentially forgetting and now I have to worry about the secrets of my dying breathe being released to the public while I'm still around. If I wanted anything to be taken care of I'd feel much safer keeping it in offline storage with a note attached. What I think you should do is have a tiered level of notifications. For example an email every week is the first round of notifications. Then I wonder if you could pull my last login info from major services that are going to be around for awhile like Amazon, Google, Apple, Facebook(debatable), and if I havent logged into any of those services in 1 week, then go to the final round of notifications which is an in-person phone call.

evanlivingston 12y ago
A week seems like a short amount of time. If you're dead, we're not talking about safety here—urgency is less important. I think even a mail every month would be sufficient.
- StavrosK 12y ago
  That's what http://www.deadmansswitch.net/ http://www.deadmansswitch.net/ (disclosure: I wrote it) does, it also has configurable intervals so you can make them as short or as long as you want. It sends you an email every interval, and, if you don't reply to any of them, it sends your messages.
  - sitkack 12y ago
    Can I have copies of all the user submitted data? Probably full of bank account details, safe combos, etc.
whywhywhy5 12y ago
How about a site where you enter your SSN? Then if you're ever listed as deceased in the Social Security Death Index, that will be the trigger.

zw123456 12y ago

I think an app on your phone is a better way, if the phone has not moved in the last 24 hours or whatever, then an email could be sent. Something like that.

baby 12y ago
so if you lose your phone? Change your phone? etc...
buffsquid 12y ago
I wrote a quick bash script for running a simple dead man's switch a few years ago: http://blog.mcglew.net/2012/09/dead-mans-switch-on-linux-part-1-basic.html http://blog.mcglew.net/2012/09/dead-mans-switch-on-linux-par... You can reset the switch in any way you like, I was playing around with emailing through single-use codes and port knocking and so on. One I never got around to trying is a basic phone check: You have a cron job that scans all bluetooth devices within range and checks for your phone's MAC address. If it's there, it resets the timer. If you're out of physical range (or turn off your bluetooth) for too long, it triggers the switch. Not quite what you described but it does perform some of the same function.

baby 12y ago

I've thought about that service a lot and this solution is not working because : * I have to constantly check my mails to prove I'm not dead * The other person's mail will without any doubt change if I die in 10+ years * Can this service live up to 50+ years? I'm really doubting that as well.

bentcorner 12y ago
> * I have to constantly check my mails to prove I'm not dead It nag mails you so you don't forget. Otherwise, add a reminder with a link to click on on the first of every month. > * The other person's mail will without any doubt change if I die in 10+ years You'll be clicking on this thing every month, I'm pretty certain if your SO's email changes you'll update it at that time. > * Can this service live up to 50+ years? I'm really doubting that as well. It only needs to be up when you die, again, you're clicking on this thing every month, if the service dies and you find utility in the concept, you'll find a different service to use.
- baby 12y ago
  > you're clicking on this thing every month That's a huge problem. You tell me I have to click on a link at least once a month for the rest of my life. First, I don't know if I'll have the same email for the rest of my life, if I change I'll have to think about changing that notification, that will have become spam in my mind. Second, There surely will be a month in my life where I won't check my mails. I can't think further, the thing has become a "hassle" that I have to constantly check and correct if someone change its mail, or in case it would think I'm dead, and this, for the rest of my life. IMO there are better solutions for this type of problem, we just haven't found them yet.
  - bentcorner 12y ago
    > That's a huge problem. You tell me I have to click on a link at least once a month for the rest of my life. shrug from the point of view of someone who has opted in, this isn't a big deal. People don't change email addresses that often, and if you're the type who doesn't check email for longer than a month, then yeah, this isn't for you. The bigger problem is that this service is hard to test. When you really want it to work there really isn't a second chance. Which means you shouldn't be relying on this thing 100%. It's best to put something in your will and instructions in a safe place.

jlebrech 12y ago

here's another type of dead mans switch, embed 'where now() < '1st January 2016' in your SQL :)

dfcarney 12y ago

At least nobody can say the NSA isn't creative.

chrisBob 12y ago

This seems like a good option if I am ever in an action movie and I need to tell the bad guy that all of the information will be released to CNN and the NYT if anything happens to me. If I come up with something I can't tell my wife while I am alive, I will probably just put it in my will.

jliptzin 12y ago
What prevents the bad guy from torturing you until you disable the DMS, then kill you?
- tormeh 12y ago
  Any good DMS of that calibre can't be disabled. The operator must take upfront payment and not care if you die or not, only fulfilling a contract you can't go back on. Sounds like something a Swiss bank could do for you, if stereotype is to be believed.
  - marcosdumay 12y ago
    Oh man, now that bad guy will torture swiss bankers... As a second thought, could lead to a slower, but much more interesting movie.
  - jliptzin 12y ago
    Well, that may be so, but try explaining that to a (probably) not so intelligent bad guy who will just continue torturing you. Maybe a good feature for a DMS system would be a fake shut off switch that appears to be convincing to an adversary.

chrisBob 12y ago

30 days seems long, but I guess if I am in a hurry I could set up 10 of them with 3 days in between so that it is always 72 hours out...

gabriel34 12y ago
You'd need to only answer every email 27 days after receipt, which can be easily automated (no the answer, but you could delay it being shown in your inbox, or fowarded to your main or something) but it would be a pain to keep it up and not reveal info that could be harmful to the still-living you. and when you die... spam everywhere? Is that really how you'd like to be remembered? :)
hatu 12y ago
We're pretty much surrounded by internet wherever we go these days but still, I could imagine taking four weeks off without any access to the internet and wouldn't want people to think I died.

jlebrech 12y ago

I thought of something similar to send tweets from the grave, you add an app to twitter and it'll start tweeting messages after you stop tweeting for 2 years.

gourneau 12y ago

One of my favorite short stories of all time is titled Death Switch, written by David Eagleman. It is about this idea extrapolated, well worth a read : http://deathswitch.com/deathswitch.pdf http://deathswitch.com/deathswitch.pdf

jonalmeida 12y ago

I too have thought about this. How am I going to pass on my account information/bitcoins and other secret detective work? My idea was to open a security box in a bank that contained hand written keys to open an encrypted password store in some publicly accessible location. If I died, that security box should go to the next family members who would be the only ones that can get access to it. I fear there are loop-holes in that idea now..

err4nt 12y ago
ever heard of geocaching? The idea is that you leave things hidden around the world with GPD coordinates and hints of the location and other geocachers will grab their GPD devices (or smartphones) and hunt down your cache based on the location provided and your hints. It's like a big scavenger hunt. What if you looked up caching 'best practices' for how to safely store items for in the weather, then stashed your valuable information somewhere nobody would find it. Keep track of the location the same way you would a geocache, but obviously don't publish it publicly. Then all you need to do is leave the cache-retrieving information in your legal will and the right people will have access to it at the right time, and it's as safe from prying eyes as you're ever going to get in the meantime :)

tlrobinson 12y ago

I wouldn't trust a random service like this with anything worth putting on a dead man's switch. At a minimum you should use PGP, but sadly most the people I'd want to use this with have no idea what PGP is. Maybe Keybase.io will eventually help with that.

whileonebegin 12y ago

Better solution? Google Inactive Account Manager https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/3036514 https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/3036514 And for sending emails in the future: Boomerang for Gmail https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/boomerang-for-gmail/mdanidgdpmkimeiiojknlnekblgmpdll https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/boomerang-for-gmai...

eplanit 12y ago

I like it. There should also be a "delete" feature in addition to notification. Sort of a self-destruct dropbox (in the generic sense) to contain your most private and personal data -- bits you want to "take to the grave" with you, so to speak. They only exist there for as long as you respond to the ping, otherwise they're deleted. Maybe it's already thought about by the creators, but it's not apparent in the description. My $0.02

eurleif 12y ago
Meh, why not just store them locally (or on Dropbox) encrypted with a key only you know?

sitkack 12y ago

Why would I send sensitive data to an unknown website? Makes no sense. And if the data is too valuable, good reason to kill me and get a treat.

Houshalter 12y ago

Please no one actually use this. There is no reason to trust this site with sensitive information, and there is even some evidence it may no longer be maintained (see logn's comment.)

allochthon 12y ago

Interesting site. Hope it is difficult to break into. Does anyone know what happened with the woman who put up a post on Facebook (I think) saying that if people didn't hear back in a certain amount of time, she had last been to visit some guy? I am having a hard time finding the HN link.

bigmario 12y ago

I don't think anyone's said it yet, but... this is what an attorney is for. This website is stupid. It's bad enough to trust any confidential information completely to a third party, let alone a website that could lose your information or go defunct in a few years. At least disclosures to attorneys are legally protected to the n-th degree, and the business is brick-and-mortar with a known location. Add to that the fact that a regular e-mail is something that could easily be forgotten about, caught by a spam e-mail, lost when you switch accounts, etc. The problems with this idea are endless

rwallace 12y ago

I'm curious, when would you actually use this? I mean obviously the imagination readily conjures up movie scenarios, 'if anything happens to me your nefarious plans for world domination will be sent to the New York Times!' but in real life the evil overlord could counter that in half a dozen ways. Is anyone here looking to use such a service, and if so, for what sort of purpose?

neotek 12y ago

For a second I thought this was a link to https://deadmanssnitch.com https://deadmanssnitch.com, which is a fantastically simple cronjob monitor.

tempodox 12y ago

It broke: <pre> Could not open file (/tmp/deadmansswitch//Apache-Session-1d3379ba5947e7943750160d5cfee2c7.lock) for writing: No space left on device at /usr/local/share/perl/5.14.2/Apache/Session/Lock/File.pm line 75. </pre>

flym4n 12y ago
https://web.archive.org/web/20140101055243/http://deadmansswitch.org/ https://web.archive.org/web/20140101055243/http://deadmanssw...

codesuela 12y ago

> Every effort is made to protect your information except for hosting the service in NSA country

deleted 12y ago
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