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Did EFF complain about Ukraine government outlawing access to any Russian language news a few days ago?
Correction: Above sentence is not correct. Not all Russ
Did EFF complain about Ukraine government outlawing access to any Russian language news a few days ago?
Correction: Above sentence is not correct. Not all Russian language news were outlawed. Instead, only Russian TV channels were banned in Ukraine a few days ago. This has caused OSCE to express concern. See the link below.
Almost a half of Ukrainians speak Russian language. New Kiev government has banned national broadcasts in this language, effectively denying its people access to information.
When we hear the arguments that banning Russian-language press/TV in Ukraine is OK, since those are necessarily 'Putin propaganda', but banning radical sites[1] in Russia is wrong, because they are 'independent news', we can only admire the ability to maintain double standards without as much at batting an eye.
(http://www.osce.org/fom/116312 http://www.osce.org/fom/116312)
[1] I don't necessarily agree with Russian government definition of 'extremist/radical', but their point is that above Russian sites have given their pages to neo-Nazis to call to armed struggle against the state.
Did EFF complain about Ukraine government outlawing access
to any Russian language news a few days ago?
Did it really happen?
> Ukraine government outlawing access to any Russian language news a few days ago
Filter content by Content-language header? :)
> New Kiev government has banned national broadcasts in this language
This statement is also wrong. There is a lot of channels in Russian language in Ukraine.
What a great textbook example of whataboutism.
In Ukraine only 5 foreign TV channels were banned -- Vesti, Russia 24, ORT (First Channel World Network), RTR Planet, and NTV World. All of them were state-sponsored mouthpieces of Russian Goebbels-style propaganda, and it's in a country invaded by Russia. No wonder that these propaganda channels of foreign aggressors were banned.
In Russia Kremlin attacks its own legitimate independent from state press and opposition leaders. Russian independent TV channels were already destroyed long before (with exception of Dozhd that was attacked only recently), but yesterday Kremlin started to broadly use one more method in its fight against freedom of press -- Internet filters. And that what EFF article is about.
These situations have very little in common, and they very bundled together only to be used in the standard "but you are lynching negroes" argument.
> I don't necessarily agree with Russian government definition of 'extremist/radical', but their point is that above Russian sites have given their pages to neo-Nazis to call to armed struggle against the state.
Eh, neo-Nazis to call to armed struggle against the state? That's just bullshit. Good example, why Russian Goebbels-style propaganda is a problem.
I think your 'Goebbels this' and 'Goebbels that' arguments are amusing.
Thanks for confirming that 5 TV channels carrying alternative views are banned in Ukraine. That's no problem for you because you call them propaganda.
Some people disagree. A lot of Ukrainians Russian-speakers feel that their point of view is not represented in Ukrainian official media, and that Russian news provide some valuable alternative. After all, one of the first laws of new Kiev govt was an anti-Russian language law.
And then in a single breath you deny neo-Nazi issue as a bullshit. You obviously know that lenta.ru editor was fired allegedly for publishing a link to Ukrainian "Right Sector" content.
Next you of may want to deny that Svoboda and their paramilitary wing Right Sector are neo-nazis... I could refer to to European Union officials expressing concern about Svoboda's position in Kiev government, but I think my arguments will be lost on you.
> I think your 'Goebbels this' and 'Goebbels that' arguments are amusing.
Of course. Because you are completely under influence of that propaganda.
> You obviously know that lenta.ru editor was fired allegedly for publishing a link to Ukrainian "Right Sector" content.
She was fired, because Lenta became too popular and Kremlin decided to take over it.
> Thanks for confirming that 5 TV channels carrying alternative views are banned in Ukraine.
They don't hold any alternative views, or any views at all. They are just propaganda mouthpieces, their purpose is influence people in some direction -- and that's all. If they need, they straight up fabricate "news" out of thin air [1][2][3][4][5]. If they need they'll change their political "views" in day, because in fact they don't hold any. That's the difference between legitimate media, even very biased one, and just pure propaganda.
> Next you of may want to deny that Svoboda and their paramilitary wing Right Sector are neo-nazis...
Yes, they are not neo-Nazis, that's your Goebbels propaganda again, I commented about it there: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7400870 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7400870 However, beloved by Kremlin propaganda "people's governor" Gubarev from Donetsk was one of the neo-Nazis from RNE: http://imgur.com/a/QeuZp http://imgur.com/a/QeuZp
[1] http://fakecontrol.org/blog/2014/03/08/tass-upolnomochien-zaiavit/ http://fakecontrol.org/blog/2014/03/08/tass-upolnomochien-za...
[2] http://fakecontrol.org/blog/2014/03/06/cyrillic-cancellation/ http://fakecontrol.org/blog/2014/03/06/cyrillic-cancellation...
[3] http://fakecontrol.org/blog/2014/03/03/2-girls-1-fake/ http://fakecontrol.org/blog/2014/03/03/2-girls-1-fake/
[4] http://fakecontrol.org/blog/2014/03/03/vtoroi-pasport/ http://fakecontrol.org/blog/2014/03/03/vtoroi-pasport/
[5] http://fakecontrol.org/blog/2014/03/02/first_channel_geography/ http://fakecontrol.org/blog/2014/03/02/first_channel_geograp...
> I admit I did not know about the letter from the Ukrainian Jews to Putin. I
Sure, you didn't, because you get your information from garbage sources by useful leftist idiots from Huffington Post and like.
> I do not know what motivated them to write such a letter. It could be Bandera followers standing over them, or something else
That's just so pathetic that is not even funny. You ignore opinion of the most authoritative Jewish organizations in Ukraine, two chief rabbis of Ukraine and opinion of the Congress of national minorities of Ukraine for the sole reason that they don't agree with your agenda formed on poor quality sources.
> Tel-Aviv Jews, ... from Lund University in Sweden
Yeah, apparently guys from Tel-Aviv and from Sweden see the situation better than people who actually live in Kiev and closely observe folks from Svoboda for decades. Sorry, no, Svoboda is not neo-Nazi, not even nearly. It's a legit party that got 10.5% on elections in 2012 that gets more and more moderate over time.
> the Russian neo-Nazis, who are encouraged by your security services.
> Incidentally, this is anti-Russian propaganda.
They are probably talking about Russian nazis in Ukraine. People like this one: http://imgur.com/a/QeuZp http://imgur.com/a/QeuZp, who is directly supported by Kremlin propaganda. Or like these thugs who attacked peaceful pro-Ukrainian demonstration in Donetsk and killed 2 yesterday. Or like those thugs who killed 2 in Kharkov today.
I obviously won't change your opinions, but here are some facts that may be relevant.
Ukrainian Jews seek urgent help from Israel Director-general of European
Jewish Association urges Prime Minister Netanyahu and Defense
Minister Moshe Ya'alon to send security forces to Jewish communities
in Ukraine due to 'growing wave of anti-Semitic attacks.'
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4492710,00.html http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4492710,00.html
http://www.totpi.com/2014/02/25/ukraines-jews-to-israel-help-us/ http://www.totpi.com/2014/02/25/ukraines-jews-to-israel-help...
Plenty of Jewish activists hate Putin enough to complain that such appeals 'help Russian propaganda'.
But there is another way to look at it, and it is that Russian views are correct from the outset:
The Ukrainian coup that deposed a legitimately elected president has been spearheaded by neo-nazi paramilitaries.
They now control key positions in the government, intimidate their political opponents, including what has remained of the Ukrainian parliament.
> I obviously won't change your opinions, but here are some facts that may be relevant.
No, they are not relevant, that's one more piece of disinformation. Your quote:
> Ukrainian Jews seek urgent help from Israel Director-general of European Jewish Association urges Prime Minister Netanyahu and Defense...
inside the article
> Rabbi Menahem Margolin, has asked Prime Minister Binyamin Netanyahu and Defense Minister Moshe Yaalon...
Biography of Rabbi Menahem Margolin:
> Rabbi Menachem Margolin was born in Israel. After graduating from elementary studied he studied in Yeshivot in Bnei Brak and Kiryat Gat, and then in New York. From the U.S.A he left for a mission of a year to the Jewish community in Hungary and helped the local Rabbis to fulfill their rules. From Budapest he left for a mission of several months to Bangkok, Thailand. During these years he received his rabbinical ordination. In 2004 he was appointed as Program Director of the Rabbinical Centre of Europe (RCE) A year later he was appointed as the Secretary General of the organization and two years later was appointed as the General Director.
Yes, that guy has exactly zero to do with Ukraine. Funny that all this hysteria about neo-Nazies taking over the country is being spread from non-Ukrainian sources, while Ukrainian sources don't see a problem.
> But there is another way to look at it, and it is that Russian views are correct from the outset: The Ukrainian coup that deposed a legitimately elected president has been spearheaded by neo-nazi paramilitaries.
Enemy invaders deposed legitimately elected leader spearheaded by antisemitic communist forces. That's one more way to look at WWII. The problem of course that this view has nothing common with reality. Jews, Russians, Georgians, and plenty other minorities actively participated on Maidan -- something that absolutely impossible in a neo-nazi coup. And sorry, your views are not Russian views, those are views promoted by Putin propaganda.
> They now control key positions in the government, intimidate their political opponents, including what has remained of the Ukrainian parliament.
And that's again a load of bullshit.
> And that's again a load of bullshit.
Is this true or not, in your opinion:
Andriy Parubiy, the new secretary of Ukraine's security council, was a co-founder of the Neo-Nazi Social-National Party of Ukraine (SNPU), otherwise known as Svoboda.
Haaretz verifiable provable lied, but it doesn't matter for you, because it's the oldest Israel newspaper. 3 chief Rabbis of Ukraine and the Association of Jewish Communities of Ukraine say there is no neo-Nazi threat from Ukrainians while it exists from Russians, but it doesn't matter for you, because you found few photographs of neo-Nazis in 1 million crowd. OK. I don't know, at this point the discussion as constructive as discussion with 9/11 truther, quite frankly.
Really, your photoset is hilarious. [1], [2], [3], [4] are photographs from 2013. [4] is especially funny -- Tyagnibok uses his _left_ hand to point to something, but you are trying misrepresent it like he is making a Nazi salute. If you want to find a fake Nazi salute photograph, at least find one where the target uses their _right_ hand. Like Merkel on this photo: http://westsidetoastmasters.com/resources/book_of_body_language/images/036-palm_down.jpg http://westsidetoastmasters.com/resources/book_of_body_langu... On [5], [6] there is one guy with old Svoboda symbol it dropped 10 years ago and one guy with 14/88 on his shield. Not much, considering the fact there were 1 million of persons with very different background on Maidan. Look, of course there were neo-Nazis on Maidan -- there were 1 million with plenty of radicals. But it was an extreme minority, and it wasn't supported even by the leaders of notable nationalistic forces like Svoboda and Pravyj Sektor. There were very few antisemitic incidents recorded on Maidan -- most notable one was when one poetess recited antisemitic poem from the Maidan tribune (btw she was banned from tribune for that). And it was the most notable one. Compare it with Gubarev, the _leader_ of pro-Kremlin forces in Donetsk, guy completely supported by Russian propaganda, who was real neo-Nazi from RNE: http://imgur.com/a/QeuZp http://imgur.com/a/QeuZp Compare it with Crimean Russians, who attack women for wearing Ukrainian flags [1] and old ladies [2], who kidnap journalists and shot in peaceful Ukrainian activists.
[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UrgizvwCywQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UrgizvwCywQ
[2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Obuy2QEQBE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Obuy2QEQBE