8 ms·

I thought about this a couple of years back and as far as I can make out, we are approaching the situation where you could just about fit a digitised general en

I thought about this a couple of years back and as far as I can make out, we are approaching the situation where you could just about fit a digitised general engineering factory and materials store into a high street shop unit. At that point you could robotically fabricate a car to order and just drive it out the front onto the street when it is finished.

return0 13y ago
But isn't China's advantage the established (and efficient?) chain of materials supply, logistics along with the availability of cheap labor when needed?
- polskibus 13y ago
  It's about having your supply chain as close to your customer as possible so you can pull (as in lean) on demand. What then happens is the customers' needs iterate faster and faster and you need to keep up. Fit the 3d printer in the shop, print whatever the consumer needs in less then it takes to drink a cup of coffee and you're the winner. Of course you need to make sure you have enough raw materials. That's something China has to import a lot. So unless China builds up domestic demand to much higher levels, western countries will gain more from 3d printing than China.
  - 2stop 13y ago
    It isn't just 'print whatever the consumer needs'. It's - Dig it out of the ground - process it - Fabricate the unprintable bits - Store all of this - Print whatever the consumer needs in less time than it takes to drink a coffee. So unless this make believe "shop" is fronted onto a processing/fabrication plant, which is itself, fronted on a magical mine that you can dig up any resource you like. Your scenario can never happen.* * Or we could invent teleportation.
    - mitochondrion 13y ago
      Yes, but no. Yes, there's a ton of raw resource extraction, processing, and transport. But no, because a Nissan Altima or Apple Macbook (or Moto X!) are not commodities in the same way that gold or lumber or silicon are. There's a reason that the Nissan Altima was the sixth best-selling car last year. I don't purport to know what that reason is, but it's not because it's comprised of raw materials any different from any other car.
      - 2stop 13y ago
        I'm not sure what you're responding to. You can't print big things in a street shop because big things require big raw materials, and complex fabrications. This has nothing to do with commodities, Nissan, Apple or Motorola, this is pointing out that the GP forgot to consider the serious amount of inventory required to have 'on-demand' production available INSIDE a consumer shop.
wlievens 13y ago
Cars have ridiculously much electronics in them and you cannot "print" those just like that in a small shop. Have you seen how big wnd expensive a wafer fab is?
- adamnemecek 13y ago
  Presumably you don't have to "print" all parts there.
- mitochondrion 13y ago
  What's preventing all of those electronics from becoming dumb terminals and abstracting everything away to the central processing unit?
  - stretchwithme 13y ago
    Distributed intelligence is more robust. And the electronics need to be fast for your airbag and ABS.
- moocowduckquack 13y ago
  I have seen what people are developing. Besides, cars do not need to have micro electronics. http://reprap.org/wiki/MetalicaRap http://reprap.org/wiki/MetalicaRap http://medtechinsider.com/archives/24967 http://medtechinsider.com/archives/24967 http://www.nthdegreetech.com/printed-semiconductors.php http://www.nthdegreetech.com/printed-semiconductors.php That said, there will always be some things for which economies of scale win out against customisation, and I suspect that many electronics components are in that bracket. Luckily we have things like FPGAs, so you don't need to keep a huge stock of specialised chips to make a wide variety of devices.
  - wlievens 13y ago
    I don't think there is a market for cars without micro electronics. Especially not with the rise of electric cars. FPGA's are several orders of magnitude more expensive than mass-produced electronics. Modern cars contain more than just controller electronics. What about image sensors, for instance, for automated parking systems? You can't 3D-print an image sensor. Not without a clean room at least.
2stop 13y ago
... So there is just a never ending supply of raw material also sitting in this high street shop?
- mikeash 13y ago
  They just get a hookup to the Feed, of course.
- moocowduckquack 13y ago
  You keep a stock of base materials and things like chips that you can't fabricate onsite. Is the same as keeping stock for a normal shop, you keep track of what is being used and order more when it gets low.

return0 13y ago

But isn't China's advantage the established (and efficient?) chain of materials supply, logistics along with the availability of cheap labor when needed?

polskibus 13y ago
It's about having your supply chain as close to your customer as possible so you can pull (as in lean) on demand. What then happens is the customers' needs iterate faster and faster and you need to keep up. Fit the 3d printer in the shop, print whatever the consumer needs in less then it takes to drink a cup of coffee and you're the winner. Of course you need to make sure you have enough raw materials. That's something China has to import a lot. So unless China builds up domestic demand to much higher levels, western countries will gain more from 3d printing than China.
- 2stop 13y ago
  It isn't just 'print whatever the consumer needs'. It's - Dig it out of the ground - process it - Fabricate the unprintable bits - Store all of this - Print whatever the consumer needs in less time than it takes to drink a coffee. So unless this make believe "shop" is fronted onto a processing/fabrication plant, which is itself, fronted on a magical mine that you can dig up any resource you like. Your scenario can never happen.* * Or we could invent teleportation.
  - mitochondrion 13y ago
    Yes, but no. Yes, there's a ton of raw resource extraction, processing, and transport. But no, because a Nissan Altima or Apple Macbook (or Moto X!) are not commodities in the same way that gold or lumber or silicon are. There's a reason that the Nissan Altima was the sixth best-selling car last year. I don't purport to know what that reason is, but it's not because it's comprised of raw materials any different from any other car.
    - 2stop 13y ago
      I'm not sure what you're responding to. You can't print big things in a street shop because big things require big raw materials, and complex fabrications. This has nothing to do with commodities, Nissan, Apple or Motorola, this is pointing out that the GP forgot to consider the serious amount of inventory required to have 'on-demand' production available INSIDE a consumer shop.

wlievens 13y ago

Cars have ridiculously much electronics in them and you cannot "print" those just like that in a small shop. Have you seen how big wnd expensive a wafer fab is?

adamnemecek 13y ago
Presumably you don't have to "print" all parts there.
mitochondrion 13y ago
What's preventing all of those electronics from becoming dumb terminals and abstracting everything away to the central processing unit?
- stretchwithme 13y ago
  Distributed intelligence is more robust. And the electronics need to be fast for your airbag and ABS.
moocowduckquack 13y ago
I have seen what people are developing. Besides, cars do not need to have micro electronics. http://reprap.org/wiki/MetalicaRap http://reprap.org/wiki/MetalicaRap http://medtechinsider.com/archives/24967 http://medtechinsider.com/archives/24967 http://www.nthdegreetech.com/printed-semiconductors.php http://www.nthdegreetech.com/printed-semiconductors.php That said, there will always be some things for which economies of scale win out against customisation, and I suspect that many electronics components are in that bracket. Luckily we have things like FPGAs, so you don't need to keep a huge stock of specialised chips to make a wide variety of devices.
- wlievens 13y ago
  I don't think there is a market for cars without micro electronics. Especially not with the rise of electric cars. FPGA's are several orders of magnitude more expensive than mass-produced electronics. Modern cars contain more than just controller electronics. What about image sensors, for instance, for automated parking systems? You can't 3D-print an image sensor. Not without a clean room at least.

2stop 13y ago

... So there is just a never ending supply of raw material also sitting in this high street shop?

mikeash 13y ago
They just get a hookup to the Feed, of course.
moocowduckquack 13y ago
You keep a stock of base materials and things like chips that you can't fabricate onsite. Is the same as keeping stock for a normal shop, you keep track of what is being used and order more when it gets low.