7 ms·

Gould has been exposed as a fraud.

by Kudzu_Bob 13y ago

deleted 13y ago
[deleted]
lutusp 13y ago
Citation needed.
- Kudzu_Bob 13y ago
  Simply Google "gould" and "fraud" and you will have hours of fascinating reading.
  - lutusp 13y ago
    Yep. That works for "Einstein" and "fraud" also. In fact, it works for any well-known name in any field. Gould missed things that happened after the writing of Mismeasure, and ignored some later developments that challenged aspects of his original work, but he made a number of important and legitimate points about IQ testing and its abuses, points that have stood the test of time.
    - Kudzu_Bob 13y ago
      Gould's ideas have not stood the test of time, and it is now understood that he committed the fraud and abuse of which he accused others. This is why he has been disowned by his own colleagues, something that never happened to Einstein.
- clarkm 13y ago
  Interesting how you never bothered to ask that while reading the fraudulent book itself. It's like skimming a poorly-researched paper on vaccines, taking it as gospel, proceeding to claim that they cause autism, and yet reflexively responding with "citation needed" to anyone that dare call into question your insane ideas.
  - lutusp 13y ago
    > Interesting how you never bothered to ask that while reading the fraudulent book itself. This is your evidence that Gould is a fraud? Nice dodge, but scientists and educated people will notice you avoided your responsibility to back up your words with evidence.
- gwern 13y ago
  And you dare to pontificate on this topic on HN while not even knowing the basics. Here, since you apparently are completely inept and mind-killed: in Google, punch in 'Gould fraud'. The very first link is to a Nature.com page: http://blogs.nature.com/news/2011/06/did_stephen_jay_gould_fudge_hi.html http://blogs.nature.com/news/2011/06/did_stephen_jay_gould_f...
  - lutusp 13y ago
    > And you dare to pontificate on this topic on HN while not even knowing the basics. The basics of IQ testing and its many misuses? Gould didn't invent this topic, and he doesn't define it. You remarks about Gould and IQ testing remind me of the creationists who think evolution was Darwin's private fantasy. If you take away Gould entirely, you still have any number of terrible examples of misuse of IQ testing for racist and other deplorable objectives. Obviously psychologists are defensive about IQ testing (they should be), and Gould made himself an easy target. But this substitutes substance with ad hominem, a mode of argument you appear to prefer.
    - gwern 13y ago
      That's pretty big talk from a dude who couldn't find the first link in Google, and tried to wave off any discussion of Gould's fraud as equivalent to all the crackpots talking about Einstein.

Gould has been exposed as a fraud.

deleted 13y ago

[deleted]

lutusp 13y ago

Citation needed.

Kudzu_Bob 13y ago
Simply Google "gould" and "fraud" and you will have hours of fascinating reading.
- lutusp 13y ago
  Yep. That works for "Einstein" and "fraud" also. In fact, it works for any well-known name in any field. Gould missed things that happened after the writing of Mismeasure, and ignored some later developments that challenged aspects of his original work, but he made a number of important and legitimate points about IQ testing and its abuses, points that have stood the test of time.
  - Kudzu_Bob 13y ago
    Gould's ideas have not stood the test of time, and it is now understood that he committed the fraud and abuse of which he accused others. This is why he has been disowned by his own colleagues, something that never happened to Einstein.
clarkm 13y ago
Interesting how you never bothered to ask that while reading the fraudulent book itself. It's like skimming a poorly-researched paper on vaccines, taking it as gospel, proceeding to claim that they cause autism, and yet reflexively responding with "citation needed" to anyone that dare call into question your insane ideas.
- lutusp 13y ago
  > Interesting how you never bothered to ask that while reading the fraudulent book itself. This is your evidence that Gould is a fraud? Nice dodge, but scientists and educated people will notice you avoided your responsibility to back up your words with evidence.
gwern 13y ago
And you dare to pontificate on this topic on HN while not even knowing the basics. Here, since you apparently are completely inept and mind-killed: in Google, punch in 'Gould fraud'. The very first link is to a Nature.com page: http://blogs.nature.com/news/2011/06/did_stephen_jay_gould_fudge_hi.html http://blogs.nature.com/news/2011/06/did_stephen_jay_gould_f...
- lutusp 13y ago
  > And you dare to pontificate on this topic on HN while not even knowing the basics. The basics of IQ testing and its many misuses? Gould didn't invent this topic, and he doesn't define it. You remarks about Gould and IQ testing remind me of the creationists who think evolution was Darwin's private fantasy. If you take away Gould entirely, you still have any number of terrible examples of misuse of IQ testing for racist and other deplorable objectives. Obviously psychologists are defensive about IQ testing (they should be), and Gould made himself an easy target. But this substitutes substance with ad hominem, a mode of argument you appear to prefer.
  - gwern 13y ago
    That's pretty big talk from a dude who couldn't find the first link in Google, and tried to wave off any discussion of Gould's fraud as equivalent to all the crackpots talking about Einstein.