4 ms·

Why doesn't the pay reflect the supply and demand? I consider myself a decent developer with 9 years of industry experience in several domains and my salary is

Why doesn't the pay reflect the supply and demand? I consider myself a decent developer with 9 years of industry experience in several domains and my salary is only $88k. It sounds like based on the demand, I should be pulling in a lot more.

pekk 13y ago
I think it's because (though it's always carefully framed to leave this implicit) the argument here really isn't whether there's a developer shortage. It's whether to do more stuff like H1B which increases supply and decreases wages.
paulbaumgart 13y ago
Where are you located? Geography is still a big factor in hiring decisions, so demand is not evenly distributed. In Silicon Valley, $88k is what good-but-not-great fresh college graduates get paid.
- MatthewPhillips 13y ago
  The point still stands, unless you work for the handful (or less) of companies that pay FU money to their engineers, you're still paid equivalent of what a Dentist makes, and much less than what a good salesperson makes in a much much smaller city. I think the answer is that the demand isn't actually very high. Programming is still considered a cost center for most companies, the quality of the product is determined by how much they are willing to spend on salary, not vice versa.
  - paulbaumgart 13y ago
    Judging from how much attention all the good software engineers I know get from recruiters and from conversations I've had with people actively hiring, the demand in SF/Silicon Valley is incredibly high. I have personally taken advantage of this demand through lucrative contracting gigs. Sure, crappy companies in dying industries might not be able to compete, or might not even realize that they're failing to compete, but why care about them? They don't make the market for people who are actually good at software.
  - svachalek 13y ago
    I think you may be underestimating dentist pay: http://money.usnews.com/careers/best-jobs/dentist/salary http://money.usnews.com/careers/best-jobs/dentist/salary There are a lot of cities listed with low cost of living and $250k median salaries.
MatthewPhillips 13y ago
Because the demand isn't actually high.
ctdonath 13y ago
Maybe because we're in it for the work, not the money. $75-100K is enough to provide a comfortable life suitable for supporting that work. Not enough of us hold out for bigger offers to push the line up; pay enough to support coding something interesting 8-10 hours a day and we're happy. A friend noted "as engineers, we would do this stuff for free - it's just all the ancillary BS we get paid to put up with."
potatolicious 13y ago
What part of the industry, and where are you located? The increased demand is not uniform across all sub-fields of programming. Here in NYC someone who understands modern web backends can easily be into the high $100Ks to low $200Ks.
acchow 13y ago
We have no way to gauge your skill. But I'm wondering: why do you think $88k does not reflect supply and demand. There have been a number of articles pointing out the "myth" of the tech talent shortage. Perhaps the shortage really only exists for "top talent"

pekk 13y ago

I think it's because (though it's always carefully framed to leave this implicit) the argument here really isn't whether there's a developer shortage. It's whether to do more stuff like H1B which increases supply and decreases wages.

paulbaumgart 13y ago

Where are you located? Geography is still a big factor in hiring decisions, so demand is not evenly distributed. In Silicon Valley, $88k is what good-but-not-great fresh college graduates get paid.

MatthewPhillips 13y ago
The point still stands, unless you work for the handful (or less) of companies that pay FU money to their engineers, you're still paid equivalent of what a Dentist makes, and much less than what a good salesperson makes in a much much smaller city. I think the answer is that the demand isn't actually very high. Programming is still considered a cost center for most companies, the quality of the product is determined by how much they are willing to spend on salary, not vice versa.
- paulbaumgart 13y ago
  Judging from how much attention all the good software engineers I know get from recruiters and from conversations I've had with people actively hiring, the demand in SF/Silicon Valley is incredibly high. I have personally taken advantage of this demand through lucrative contracting gigs. Sure, crappy companies in dying industries might not be able to compete, or might not even realize that they're failing to compete, but why care about them? They don't make the market for people who are actually good at software.
- svachalek 13y ago
  I think you may be underestimating dentist pay: http://money.usnews.com/careers/best-jobs/dentist/salary http://money.usnews.com/careers/best-jobs/dentist/salary There are a lot of cities listed with low cost of living and $250k median salaries.

MatthewPhillips 13y ago

Because the demand isn't actually high.

ctdonath 13y ago

Maybe because we're in it for the work, not the money. $75-100K is enough to provide a comfortable life suitable for supporting that work. Not enough of us hold out for bigger offers to push the line up; pay enough to support coding something interesting 8-10 hours a day and we're happy. A friend noted "as engineers, we would do this stuff for free - it's just all the ancillary BS we get paid to put up with."

potatolicious 13y ago

What part of the industry, and where are you located? The increased demand is not uniform across all sub-fields of programming. Here in NYC someone who understands modern web backends can easily be into the high $100Ks to low $200Ks.

acchow 13y ago

We have no way to gauge your skill. But I'm wondering: why do you think $88k does not reflect supply and demand. There have been a number of articles pointing out the "myth" of the tech talent shortage. Perhaps the shortage really only exists for "top talent"