6 ms·

It's worse than the article describes. Those laid off are terrified to say anything publicly. From what I can gather, the total may be double the quoted number.

by wilhelm 14y ago

It's worse than the article describes. Those laid off are terrified to say anything publicly. From what I can gather, the total may be double the quoted number. In addition, morale is at rock bottom, with a number of people leaving on their own. Opera as we knew it is gone. I worked for Opera for seven years, three of them managing the core testing team. I left a year ago. It breaks my heart to see how the current management treats some of the best engineers I've ever met, loyal to the company for a decade, like disposable rubbish. Here's your ten-year watch, now fuck off. In the 2010 downsizing (described by the HR VP as "rightsizing"), they at least tried to make the decisions look good internally, blaming the economic downturn. The last two rounds they didn't even bother. No explainations, just individual talks - and a wave of fear. The only good news is that there's plenty of fantastically skilled engineers available. I've hired one myself. If you need anyone, drop me a line, and I'd be happy to recommend someone for your open position. My loyalty is to my old team and the technology - not the current mismanagement. /c:

tatsuke95 14y ago
>"Those laid off are terrified to say anything publicly." I'm curious as to why? Norway doesn't seem like a place where people would fear their ex-employers.
- kmfrk 14y ago
  It might not be the worst idea to secure a job, before you go ahead and dish on your former employer.
  - mariusmg 14y ago
    Come on.....saying publicly that you've been "laid off" doesn't mean you're dishing on the former employer.
  - prumek 14y ago
    So it is not actually out of fear for the current management, then? It's just a general fear of speaking of one's former employer if one was let go? If so, why even mention Opera specifically then?
- wilhelm 14y ago
  I can only speculate, and I don't think that's particularly helpful. The 2010 downsizing was quite transparent. This time no ordinary employees seem to have the full picture of what exactly is going in.
  - deleted 14y ago
    [deleted]
    - wilhelm 14y ago
      Haavard, is that you? (c:
  - prumek 14y ago
    Who says employees don't have the full picture? The reasons are even stated in public. Why would they be terrified of speaking in public -- and if they are, why are several people doing it? You say that speculating is not particularly useful, and you still speculate that people are terrified of Opera Software, and that the company is lying to its investors about the number of employees?
    - dstorey 14y ago
      I’m not sure there are many former employees that are speaking out in public. The ones I’ve seen are my own (obviously), Chaals, and Wilhelm’s comment here. All of us left of our own free will, (long) before these latest layoffs happened. I‘m not sure I’ve seen anything from anyone directly effected (not that this doesn't mean people have and I missed it). I‘m not saying there is any fear involved, or a conspiracy theory, just that I haven't seen this as the case, bar private posts, and tweets from some that they left the company. When Google laid a large number off at Motorola (of which I was included), there was some sort of agreement in the package about not speaking bad of the company or products. This could be the case here, I don't know.
- 0x0 14y ago
  It also seems like a place where you could quickly end up meeting ex-employers in new settings.
prumek 14y ago
Your conspiracy theory kind of falls flat on its face, since former employees have in fact spoken publicly on this. What you can gather doesn't seem to be very useful either since the quoted number is correct. It's the number of employees reported by Opera to the authorities. But maybe in your conspiracy, Opera manipulates those numbers to lie to the authorities for some unknown, sinister reason? How is the current management different from the previous management? Didn't the previous management fire anyone? Oh, they did? And they made up some BS reason to justify it? Do you know what the reason is stated to be this time around, or did you just assume that they are firing random people to strike fear in people's hearts? My Gawd. Edit: Regarding people living in fear, here's one of the former employees speaking out: "The process, from Opera’s side, was done, IMO, very professionally and the severance package we were offered was voluntary as well as substantial."
- wilhelm 14y ago
  Who are you? I'll respond to this if I know who I'm talking to.
- ferongr 14y ago
  That's assuming that what they said was said truthfully and not under the threat of a loaded gun. Opera the company shows signs of being on track be acquired (with the founder reportedly selling part of his shares to not have a majority stake anymore [1]) and management would probably like to minimize dissent and bad press. [1] http://gigaom.com/2013/02/12/opera-founder-sells-shares-potentially-clearing-way-for-acquisition/ http://gigaom.com/2013/02/12/opera-founder-sells-shares-pote...
  - prumek 14y ago
    What are you talking about? Loaded gun? Are you seriously suggesting that the company is using threats of physical violence to shut former employees up? Who cares about the founder? He previously said he wouldn't necessarily block an acquisition. And if Opera wanted to be acquired, why are they doing business like usual, and even buying up other companies?
pjmlp 14y ago
I learned long time ago to always be loyal to the team members, not to management. For management each employee is just an expense number in a spreadsheet.
ams6110 14y ago
It breaks my heart to see how the current management treats some of the best engineers I've ever met, loyal to the company for a decade, like disposable rubbish. Well now, were those engineers not paid every month for a decade? What more does Opera owe them?
- Evbn 14y ago
  If they declined more lucrative offers out of a team spirit, they deserve similar in return. There is a human side to business.
  - former-opera 14y ago
    They got a job for many years. It isn't the employer's fault if the employee declined other offers because he was having too much fun where he was. The employer can't keep track of how much everyone is having and pay them accordingly.
- wilhelm 14y ago
  Oh, they were paid. About 20-30% less than they could have made elsewhere. Money matters less when you love what you do, and you know the company is struggling. And when the company yields record profits, they are kicked out. A little human decency would be nice.
  - former-opera 14y ago
    Opera hasn't been struggling for years. It's had record profits for a long time by now. People weren't kicked out until Opera needed cash to buy Skyfire. Human decency sounds strange coming from you when you're bashing the work of your former colleagues. These people had a job they loved for x years. Not the employer's fault if people decided to stick around instead of getting another job.
  - former-opera 14y ago
    Adding to the comment about being paid less: You are leaving out employee benefits. Free, hot lunch every day. Generous pension savings. Free insurance of various kinds covering not just the employee, but also the family. Free phone + subscription. Subsidized gym memberships. Massage. The list goes on. If you factor in all the employee benefits the result is a much higher "salary."
opvard 14y ago
Hello there, Wilhelm. I hear you've been bringing up my name quite a lot lately. I'm happy to oblige, of course. > Those laid off are terrified to say anything publicly. Could you, for the sake of clarity, explain why you think that is? What are they afraid of? I'm also wondering how you reconcile this with not only the comments from previous employees on sites like Twitter, but also to the press: http://techcrunch.com/2013/02/18/opera-shrinks-in-house-developer-team-as-it-prepares-shift-to-webkit/ http://techcrunch.com/2013/02/18/opera-shrinks-in-house-deve... > From what I can gather, the total may be double the quoted number. You don't have to guess. You can find the actual number in the 4th quarter report on page 12: http://media.opera.com/media/finance/2012/4Q12.pdf http://media.opera.com/media/finance/2012/4Q12.pdf The 90 or so people who decided to leave (some couldn't accept the technology change) or were laid off included not only engineers (QA and development), but also marketing, sales, and other departments. I read somewhere that about half of the people leaving were engineers. Since engineers make up the majority of the company, it actually seems like the development teams weren't hit as hard as non-development teams. > In addition, morale is at rock bottom, with a number of people leaving on their own. Opera as we knew it is gone. I think some people were offered voluntary severance packages. I'm guessing that some were disappointed by the move to WebKit, and this was a golden opportunity for them to move on to something else. Those who remain, then, should be committed to the new engine (and those who remain are the vast majority, as far a I can tell). I don't know about morale being at rock bottom. It's pretty liberating to not have to deal with those site compatibility problems (to such an extent) anymore. Morale usually increases when people get to do cool things instead of grinding on the same old compatibility problems forever. Of course, downsizings are never fun, but I've been through probably 5 or 6 of them in my years at Opera. People get over it eventually. Is the Opera you knew gone? That depends on what the Opera you knew was. The company has been under constant change for as long as I've been here at least. With the growth of the company and the changes in the market in general, that is quite inevitable. > In the 2010 downsizing (described by the HR VP as "rightsizing"), they at least tried to make the decisions look good internally, blaming the economic downturn. The last two rounds they didn't even bother. No explainations, just individual talks - and a wave of fear. We had a department meeting, and to their credit, they actually told the affected people right away. They didn't have to wait for days or weeks to hear the judgment, which is what happened under the previous management. As for reasons, the change in technology is obvious. Then there's the acquisition of Skyfire which seems to be the biggest one in Opera's history. It's going to cost a lot of money, so it seems logical that the company wishes to save money where they can. > My loyalty is to my old team and the technology - not the current mismanagement. In a comment elsewhere you started that the switch to WebKit was the inevitable result of Opera's past missteps. Does that not mean that you are actually arguing that the change done by the current management is caused by the mistakes of the former management which you now praise? That the former "good management" actually forced the hands of the current "bad management" with its mistakes? Just an observation.

by wilhelm 14y ago

tatsuke95 14y ago

>"Those laid off are terrified to say anything publicly." I'm curious as to why? Norway doesn't seem like a place where people would fear their ex-employers.

kmfrk 14y ago
It might not be the worst idea to secure a job, before you go ahead and dish on your former employer.
- mariusmg 14y ago
  Come on.....saying publicly that you've been "laid off" doesn't mean you're dishing on the former employer.
- prumek 14y ago
  So it is not actually out of fear for the current management, then? It's just a general fear of speaking of one's former employer if one was let go? If so, why even mention Opera specifically then?
wilhelm 14y ago
I can only speculate, and I don't think that's particularly helpful. The 2010 downsizing was quite transparent. This time no ordinary employees seem to have the full picture of what exactly is going in.
- deleted 14y ago
  [deleted]
  - wilhelm 14y ago
    Haavard, is that you? (c:
- prumek 14y ago
  Who says employees don't have the full picture? The reasons are even stated in public. Why would they be terrified of speaking in public -- and if they are, why are several people doing it? You say that speculating is not particularly useful, and you still speculate that people are terrified of Opera Software, and that the company is lying to its investors about the number of employees?
  - dstorey 14y ago
    I’m not sure there are many former employees that are speaking out in public. The ones I’ve seen are my own (obviously), Chaals, and Wilhelm’s comment here. All of us left of our own free will, (long) before these latest layoffs happened. I‘m not sure I’ve seen anything from anyone directly effected (not that this doesn't mean people have and I missed it). I‘m not saying there is any fear involved, or a conspiracy theory, just that I haven't seen this as the case, bar private posts, and tweets from some that they left the company. When Google laid a large number off at Motorola (of which I was included), there was some sort of agreement in the package about not speaking bad of the company or products. This could be the case here, I don't know.
0x0 14y ago
It also seems like a place where you could quickly end up meeting ex-employers in new settings.

prumek 14y ago

Your conspiracy theory kind of falls flat on its face, since former employees have in fact spoken publicly on this. What you can gather doesn't seem to be very useful either since the quoted number is correct. It's the number of employees reported by Opera to the authorities. But maybe in your conspiracy, Opera manipulates those numbers to lie to the authorities for some unknown, sinister reason? How is the current management different from the previous management? Didn't the previous management fire anyone? Oh, they did? And they made up some BS reason to justify it? Do you know what the reason is stated to be this time around, or did you just assume that they are firing random people to strike fear in people's hearts? My Gawd. Edit: Regarding people living in fear, here's one of the former employees speaking out: "The process, from Opera’s side, was done, IMO, very professionally and the severance package we were offered was voluntary as well as substantial."

wilhelm 14y ago
Who are you? I'll respond to this if I know who I'm talking to.
ferongr 14y ago
That's assuming that what they said was said truthfully and not under the threat of a loaded gun. Opera the company shows signs of being on track be acquired (with the founder reportedly selling part of his shares to not have a majority stake anymore [1]) and management would probably like to minimize dissent and bad press. [1] http://gigaom.com/2013/02/12/opera-founder-sells-shares-potentially-clearing-way-for-acquisition/ http://gigaom.com/2013/02/12/opera-founder-sells-shares-pote...
- prumek 14y ago
  What are you talking about? Loaded gun? Are you seriously suggesting that the company is using threats of physical violence to shut former employees up? Who cares about the founder? He previously said he wouldn't necessarily block an acquisition. And if Opera wanted to be acquired, why are they doing business like usual, and even buying up other companies?

pjmlp 14y ago

I learned long time ago to always be loyal to the team members, not to management. For management each employee is just an expense number in a spreadsheet.

ams6110 14y ago

It breaks my heart to see how the current management treats some of the best engineers I've ever met, loyal to the company for a decade, like disposable rubbish. Well now, were those engineers not paid every month for a decade? What more does Opera owe them?

Evbn 14y ago
If they declined more lucrative offers out of a team spirit, they deserve similar in return. There is a human side to business.
- former-opera 14y ago
  They got a job for many years. It isn't the employer's fault if the employee declined other offers because he was having too much fun where he was. The employer can't keep track of how much everyone is having and pay them accordingly.
wilhelm 14y ago
Oh, they were paid. About 20-30% less than they could have made elsewhere. Money matters less when you love what you do, and you know the company is struggling. And when the company yields record profits, they are kicked out. A little human decency would be nice.
- former-opera 14y ago
  Opera hasn't been struggling for years. It's had record profits for a long time by now. People weren't kicked out until Opera needed cash to buy Skyfire. Human decency sounds strange coming from you when you're bashing the work of your former colleagues. These people had a job they loved for x years. Not the employer's fault if people decided to stick around instead of getting another job.
- former-opera 14y ago
  Adding to the comment about being paid less: You are leaving out employee benefits. Free, hot lunch every day. Generous pension savings. Free insurance of various kinds covering not just the employee, but also the family. Free phone + subscription. Subsidized gym memberships. Massage. The list goes on. If you factor in all the employee benefits the result is a much higher "salary."

opvard 14y ago

Hello there, Wilhelm. I hear you've been bringing up my name quite a lot lately. I'm happy to oblige, of course. > Those laid off are terrified to say anything publicly. Could you, for the sake of clarity, explain why you think that is? What are they afraid of? I'm also wondering how you reconcile this with not only the comments from previous employees on sites like Twitter, but also to the press: http://techcrunch.com/2013/02/18/opera-shrinks-in-house-developer-team-as-it-prepares-shift-to-webkit/ http://techcrunch.com/2013/02/18/opera-shrinks-in-house-deve... > From what I can gather, the total may be double the quoted number. You don't have to guess. You can find the actual number in the 4th quarter report on page 12: http://media.opera.com/media/finance/2012/4Q12.pdf http://media.opera.com/media/finance/2012/4Q12.pdf The 90 or so people who decided to leave (some couldn't accept the technology change) or were laid off included not only engineers (QA and development), but also marketing, sales, and other departments. I read somewhere that about half of the people leaving were engineers. Since engineers make up the majority of the company, it actually seems like the development teams weren't hit as hard as non-development teams. > In addition, morale is at rock bottom, with a number of people leaving on their own. Opera as we knew it is gone. I think some people were offered voluntary severance packages. I'm guessing that some were disappointed by the move to WebKit, and this was a golden opportunity for them to move on to something else. Those who remain, then, should be committed to the new engine (and those who remain are the vast majority, as far a I can tell). I don't know about morale being at rock bottom. It's pretty liberating to not have to deal with those site compatibility problems (to such an extent) anymore. Morale usually increases when people get to do cool things instead of grinding on the same old compatibility problems forever. Of course, downsizings are never fun, but I've been through probably 5 or 6 of them in my years at Opera. People get over it eventually. Is the Opera you knew gone? That depends on what the Opera you knew was. The company has been under constant change for as long as I've been here at least. With the growth of the company and the changes in the market in general, that is quite inevitable. > In the 2010 downsizing (described by the HR VP as "rightsizing"), they at least tried to make the decisions look good internally, blaming the economic downturn. The last two rounds they didn't even bother. No explainations, just individual talks - and a wave of fear. We had a department meeting, and to their credit, they actually told the affected people right away. They didn't have to wait for days or weeks to hear the judgment, which is what happened under the previous management. As for reasons, the change in technology is obvious. Then there's the acquisition of Skyfire which seems to be the biggest one in Opera's history. It's going to cost a lot of money, so it seems logical that the company wishes to save money where they can. > My loyalty is to my old team and the technology - not the current mismanagement. In a comment elsewhere you started that the switch to WebKit was the inevitable result of Opera's past missteps. Does that not mean that you are actually arguing that the change done by the current management is caused by the mistakes of the former management which you now praise? That the former "good management" actually forced the hands of the current "bad management" with its mistakes? Just an observation.