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If any of the two pilots feel uncomfortable about the approach, they are actually drilled to just order a go-around, not politely ask and hint that they would p

by rob74 5d ago

If any of the two pilots feel uncomfortable about the approach, they are actually drilled to just order a go-around, not politely ask and hint that they would prefer to do it like this FO did (wastes time). Ideally the pilot flying should then do it, but if they don't, the pilot monitoring can also take control (while clearly stating "my controls, going around") and do it. One major issue that I bet the NTSB will note in the final report is that both pilots were relatively new to the aircraft and to the airline, usually it's preferable to pair an inexperienced FO with more experienced captains. (not an aviation expert, just summarizing various bits and pieces I gathered from various YouTubers over the last days)

netsharc 5d ago
Also not an expert, I wonder if there's some rule where a "Go around!" order has precedence over any other activity anyone in the cockpit wishes to perform. As a passenger I had my first go around a few days ago, but we were 5km away from the runway.
- MadnessASAP 5d ago
  (I fix airplanes, have been in aviation for 15 years) Yes, it does. I can't speak universally but I would generally expect it to be a written rule, if not then at least it's the expectation.
- bityard 5d ago
  It totally does. Every approach briefing includes instructions on what they will do in the event of a missed or unstable approach. The procedure is generally full throttle, nose up, gear up, retract flaps, head in the direction briefed, and notify ATC. All automatic from memory. When either pilot calls for a go-around, both are supposed to drop literally everything else, execute the go-around without delay or hesitation, and then pause to analyze the situation once ATC gives them a heading and altitude or holding pattern to regroup. The only thing lost in a go-around is fuel and time. Any sane airline will never punish a call to go-around if done so in good faith.
- ssl-3 5d ago
  I experienced my first go-around a few months ago, in an A321 that was landing in Tampa. The clouds had been very thick for awhile. The plane was making those weird low-and-slow vibes that it makes on final approach. We popped out of the clouds and there was a highway with cars! A huge parking lot! (An airport, too? Certainly, but I didn't really see a runway or any runway-adjacent stuff.) To my inexpert eyes, we just looked to be impossibly low for our location. The folks in the cockpit apparently didn't like what they saw with their eyes, either. In an instant, the engines roared as they simultaneously pointed the thing upwards. My little pea brain was very impressed by the immediacy of the forces on my body as we disappeared back into the clouds after what was at most just several seconds of visibility. Anyway, it was very clear that there was no hesitation to the go-around. However that decision was reached, it was then simply executed. The next attempt went very smoothly about ten minutes later. (The go-around can be seen here, if anyone wants to have a look at some pretty lines and maps from ADS-B: https://planefinder.net/data/flight/NK630/history/5-48596475 https://planefinder.net/data/flight/NK630/history/5-48596475 )

by rob74 5d ago

netsharc 5d ago

Also not an expert, I wonder if there's some rule where a "Go around!" order has precedence over any other activity anyone in the cockpit wishes to perform. As a passenger I had my first go around a few days ago, but we were 5km away from the runway.

MadnessASAP 5d ago
(I fix airplanes, have been in aviation for 15 years) Yes, it does. I can't speak universally but I would generally expect it to be a written rule, if not then at least it's the expectation.
bityard 5d ago
It totally does. Every approach briefing includes instructions on what they will do in the event of a missed or unstable approach. The procedure is generally full throttle, nose up, gear up, retract flaps, head in the direction briefed, and notify ATC. All automatic from memory. When either pilot calls for a go-around, both are supposed to drop literally everything else, execute the go-around without delay or hesitation, and then pause to analyze the situation once ATC gives them a heading and altitude or holding pattern to regroup. The only thing lost in a go-around is fuel and time. Any sane airline will never punish a call to go-around if done so in good faith.
ssl-3 5d ago
I experienced my first go-around a few months ago, in an A321 that was landing in Tampa. The clouds had been very thick for awhile. The plane was making those weird low-and-slow vibes that it makes on final approach. We popped out of the clouds and there was a highway with cars! A huge parking lot! (An airport, too? Certainly, but I didn't really see a runway or any runway-adjacent stuff.) To my inexpert eyes, we just looked to be impossibly low for our location. The folks in the cockpit apparently didn't like what they saw with their eyes, either. In an instant, the engines roared as they simultaneously pointed the thing upwards. My little pea brain was very impressed by the immediacy of the forces on my body as we disappeared back into the clouds after what was at most just several seconds of visibility. Anyway, it was very clear that there was no hesitation to the go-around. However that decision was reached, it was then simply executed. The next attempt went very smoothly about ten minutes later. (The go-around can be seen here, if anyone wants to have a look at some pretty lines and maps from ADS-B: https://planefinder.net/data/flight/NK630/history/5-48596475 https://planefinder.net/data/flight/NK630/history/5-48596475 )