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So Germany is a net exporter of energy and is somehow causing checks notes ALL of Europe's high energy prices? Weird

throwaway473825 6d ago
Germany became a net electricity importer after shutting down its final nuclear power plants in 2023. On top of that, heating still runs mostly on gas, which won't be fun this winter. Due to the inefficiency of gas heating, there will be less gas available for Germany's gas power plants. Now imagine if Germany's dream of hydrogen vehicles, where most hydrogen comes from gas, also became a reality...
- kuerbel 6d ago
  By the first quarter of 2026, Germany recorded net exports of 2.6 TWh. In the middle of winter. We are out of the lump.
  - tormeh 6d ago
    In absolutely no way is that true. The EU price varies by renewables production. When it's dark and still that's when electricity costs the most, and that's when Germany imports energy. It exports when there's sun and wind, but then the energy is cheap. So Germany sells low and buys high. Doesn't matter if Germany is a net exporter because it exports at the wrong time.
    - ZeroGravitas 6d ago
      Germany has excess coal and gas capacity which they can turn on when needed. They, like most people import when it's cheaper than the local alternative. Interconnected nations all importing when cheap electricity is available lowers costs for everyone. Looking up the numbers Germany sells high and buys low when it's net importing https://www.stromdaten.info/ANALYSE/importexport/index.php https://www.stromdaten.info/ANALYSE/importexport/index.php
      - mhast 6d ago
        In the long term interconnected nations might make electricity cheap everywhere. Currently it's mostly making it more expensive everywhere else. (As someone living in south of Sweden.) Edit: But to be fair... The biggest reason it's expensive is likely that companies like to make money.
    - the_why_of_y 5d ago
      > The EU price varies by renewables production. This may be technically true at the moment, but the underlying reason for the high prices is fossil fuels: when renewable generation is low, natural gas peaker plants are generating, and these have the highest cost of any generation source, and by the merit order rules under which commodity markets such as electricity operate, the highest source price sets the price of the commodity. The obvious and affordable mitigation for high prices is to build out massive battery storage capacities so that natural gas plants are needed far less often.
      - tormeh 5d ago
        Yes, I agree, but first you need to get planning and connection permission for those battery storage locations. I wouldn't hold my breath.
        zidel 5d ago
        92 units (1 MW or larger) were connected in the first half of 2026 adding 842 MW/1.8 GWh, which is more than all of 2025 so this is both happening and accelerating. In addition small scale storage also seems to be adding a significant amount of capacity. https://modoenergy.com/research/en/germany-battery-buildout-report-germany-adds-888-mw-in-1h-2026-more-than-all-of-2025 https://modoenergy.com/research/en/germany-battery-buildout-...
  - opo 6d ago
    When you look at the first half of the year, Germany was a net importer of electricity: >Net imports amounted to only 1.3 TWh, compared with 9.6 TWh during the first half of 2025. Though 1.3 TWH is a huge improvement over 9.6 by any standard. https://energy-charts.info/?l=en&c=DE https://energy-charts.info/?l=en&c=DE
jonp888 6d ago
For some reason the HN commentariat is very pro-nuclear, and it drives them INSANE that the shutdown had minimal consequences(as only a small proportion of power production was nuclear and it was entirely replaced by new renewable capacity).
- opo 6d ago
  I think no one outside of Germany particularly cares about their internal politics, energy prices, or what role the Energiewende placed in the long-term industrial slowdown. The criticism that Germany gets for the Energiewende is that they decided to shut down nuclear power plants while THEY WERE STILL BURNING COAL! I don't think this legally qualifies as a crime against humanity, but it was horribly negligent. Coal is such a dirty fuel, that burning it should be a last resort. A properly running coal plant with all safety equipment working will kill people through pollution. Every year in Germany and all downwind countries people die due to the effects of burning coal. (See https://wwfeu.awsassets.panda.org/downloads/dark_cloud_report.pdf https://wwfeu.awsassets.panda.org/downloads/dark_cloud_repor.... ) Long term, it is hard to know the loss of life that will come from this foolish policy. The Energiewende was implemented around 2010 - they knew about the role of CO2 as a greenhouse gas and they. did. it. anyway. So now 15 years later, how much dependent is Germany on coal? Last I looked it was about 20% of the electrical power generated. They estimate that sometime between 2030 - 2038 they will stop all burning of coal.
- sien 5d ago
  People outside Germany are just sad about it. German electricity production was at 339 gC02eq/kwH for the past year. That's ten times the level of France.

Germany became a net electricity importer after shutting down its final nuclear power plants in 2023. On top of that, heating still runs mostly on gas, which won't be fun this winter. Due to the inefficiency of gas heating, there will be less gas available for Germany's gas power plants. Now imagine if Germany's dream of hydrogen vehicles, where most hydrogen comes from gas, also became a reality...

kuerbel 6d ago
By the first quarter of 2026, Germany recorded net exports of 2.6 TWh. In the middle of winter. We are out of the lump.
- tormeh 6d ago
  In absolutely no way is that true. The EU price varies by renewables production. When it's dark and still that's when electricity costs the most, and that's when Germany imports energy. It exports when there's sun and wind, but then the energy is cheap. So Germany sells low and buys high. Doesn't matter if Germany is a net exporter because it exports at the wrong time.
  - ZeroGravitas 6d ago
    Germany has excess coal and gas capacity which they can turn on when needed. They, like most people import when it's cheaper than the local alternative. Interconnected nations all importing when cheap electricity is available lowers costs for everyone. Looking up the numbers Germany sells high and buys low when it's net importing https://www.stromdaten.info/ANALYSE/importexport/index.php https://www.stromdaten.info/ANALYSE/importexport/index.php
    - mhast 6d ago
      In the long term interconnected nations might make electricity cheap everywhere. Currently it's mostly making it more expensive everywhere else. (As someone living in south of Sweden.) Edit: But to be fair... The biggest reason it's expensive is likely that companies like to make money.
  - the_why_of_y 5d ago
    > The EU price varies by renewables production. This may be technically true at the moment, but the underlying reason for the high prices is fossil fuels: when renewable generation is low, natural gas peaker plants are generating, and these have the highest cost of any generation source, and by the merit order rules under which commodity markets such as electricity operate, the highest source price sets the price of the commodity. The obvious and affordable mitigation for high prices is to build out massive battery storage capacities so that natural gas plants are needed far less often.
    - tormeh 5d ago
      Yes, I agree, but first you need to get planning and connection permission for those battery storage locations. I wouldn't hold my breath.
      - zidel 5d ago
        92 units (1 MW or larger) were connected in the first half of 2026 adding 842 MW/1.8 GWh, which is more than all of 2025 so this is both happening and accelerating. In addition small scale storage also seems to be adding a significant amount of capacity. https://modoenergy.com/research/en/germany-battery-buildout-report-germany-adds-888-mw-in-1h-2026-more-than-all-of-2025 https://modoenergy.com/research/en/germany-battery-buildout-...
- opo 6d ago
  When you look at the first half of the year, Germany was a net importer of electricity: >Net imports amounted to only 1.3 TWh, compared with 9.6 TWh during the first half of 2025. Though 1.3 TWH is a huge improvement over 9.6 by any standard. https://energy-charts.info/?l=en&c=DE https://energy-charts.info/?l=en&c=DE

jonp888 6d ago

For some reason the HN commentariat is very pro-nuclear, and it drives them INSANE that the shutdown had minimal consequences(as only a small proportion of power production was nuclear and it was entirely replaced by new renewable capacity).

opo 6d ago
I think no one outside of Germany particularly cares about their internal politics, energy prices, or what role the Energiewende placed in the long-term industrial slowdown. The criticism that Germany gets for the Energiewende is that they decided to shut down nuclear power plants while THEY WERE STILL BURNING COAL! I don't think this legally qualifies as a crime against humanity, but it was horribly negligent. Coal is such a dirty fuel, that burning it should be a last resort. A properly running coal plant with all safety equipment working will kill people through pollution. Every year in Germany and all downwind countries people die due to the effects of burning coal. (See https://wwfeu.awsassets.panda.org/downloads/dark_cloud_report.pdf https://wwfeu.awsassets.panda.org/downloads/dark_cloud_repor.... ) Long term, it is hard to know the loss of life that will come from this foolish policy. The Energiewende was implemented around 2010 - they knew about the role of CO2 as a greenhouse gas and they. did. it. anyway. So now 15 years later, how much dependent is Germany on coal? Last I looked it was about 20% of the electrical power generated. They estimate that sometime between 2030 - 2038 they will stop all burning of coal.
sien 5d ago
People outside Germany are just sad about it. German electricity production was at 339 gC02eq/kwH for the past year. That's ten times the level of France.