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So that you have to keep buying Macs every few years of course. If they gave you a way to install linux easily then you could use it far past their intended lif

by alt227 10d ago

So that you have to keep buying Macs every few years of course. If they gave you a way to install linux easily then you could use it far past their intended lifespan and wouldnt keep you locked into the apple ecosystem. They have proved time and time again that Apple hardware running anything but MacOS or iOS is something they will work very hard to stop you doing.

alsetmusic 10d ago
> past their intended lifespan This bullshit needs to die. The products are designed to last.
- alt227 10d ago
  The hardware is designed to last, the software is designed to force you to buy a new device after 7 years at most.
  - dymk 10d ago
    Is it a "a few years" or 7 years?
    - wa2flq 10d ago
      My iMac Pro 2017 is an Energizer Bunny. I got almost 10 years from by MacBook Pro.
    - deleted 10d ago
      [deleted]
    - Gigachad 10d ago
      Depends on your expectations. Throwing a perfectly working laptop out after 7 years because apple cut off software support is wasteful to me. It might not be for you.
      - dymk 10d ago
        Why would you throw it out after 7 years? The software that’s already on it will continue to work just as it always has.
        Gigachad 10d ago
        My experience with iPads losing Apple support is every app just shows you an error message saying your app is out of date and can't be used, while the app store won't let you update it because the latest api version doesn't support your device. Unless you are using all FOSS software, most apps want to connect to some server, and that connection breaks rapidly without updates. If you can load Linux on it it's still usable, but Apple OSs degrade rapidly after Apple stops supporting them. Apple is better about keeping devices on the latest OS version, but much worse about support after that period.
        dymk 9d ago
        iPads are a different device so I really have no idea why you’re bringing those up. Macs work fine even when the stop receiving updates 7 years doesn’t the line.
MYEUHD 10d ago
> past their intended lifespan Thanks to the community, you can install macOS 15 (or older) on unsupported macs (as old as 18 years) https://dortania.github.io/OpenCore-Legacy-Patcher/MODELS.html https://dortania.github.io/OpenCore-Legacy-Patcher/MODELS.ht... https://github.com/dortania/OpenCore-Legacy-Patcher https://github.com/dortania/OpenCore-Legacy-Patcher
- Marsymars 10d ago
  It's a bit awkward where newer Intel models with T2 chips don't support OpenCore, so e.g. the 2019 MBA is going to run out of security updates with macOS 14, sooner than a 2008 MBA that OpenCore will update up to macOS 15.
dymk 10d ago
> every few years of course That sounds like a you thing; I've kept my macs for at least 5 years. My M1 is still going strong and I haven't felt any pressure to upgrade.
- alt227 10d ago
  2 more years and your mac will not install the latest MacOS version, which then means you will no longer be able to update any software on your own computer or install any new software either. If you could install linux or any other OS on it you would be able to use it for decades to come, but instead you will be forced to buy another new shiny Apple box. You will probably argue thats ok because you would have wanted one anyway by that time or some such point, but the fact remains that Apple will force you to upgrade your hardware not very long away by not allowing you to install anything on it.
  - dymk 10d ago
    That's not how macs work. You don't suddenly lose the ability to run new binaries just because they're not on the latest MacOS version. Using your own conservative estimate, 8 years seems like a fine lifespan for a laptop, far longer than the "few years" you initially said. And in practice, there are plenty of macbooks that have been running even longer.
    - edschofield 10d ago
      The parent commenter described exactly how Macs work. I have a beautiful 10-core iMac 27” with 72 GB of RAM from 2020 that Apple has now decided to turn into a lemon. macOS Tahoe runs as slow as molasses and no more macOS upgrades will be forthcoming. I downgraded to Sonoma (which cost me hours) and the machine runs well again for now but the App Store has already started refusing to update apps like Pages because macOS is old. Soon I won’t be able to install a single app through the App Store and Linux (T2 Linux in my case, not Asahi) will be the only option to keep using this terrific hardware.
    - Gigachad 10d ago
      Intel macs suddenly will lose the ability to run programs because Apple has dropped the requirement to ship an intel build. And from experience, as soon as Apple stops requiring devs support old hardware, nothing works anymore.
specialist 10d ago
My family continues to use my old 2009 MacBook Pro. YMMV

by alt227 10d ago

alsetmusic 10d ago

> past their intended lifespan This bullshit needs to die. The products are designed to last.

alt227 10d ago
The hardware is designed to last, the software is designed to force you to buy a new device after 7 years at most.
- dymk 10d ago
  Is it a "a few years" or 7 years?
  - wa2flq 10d ago
    My iMac Pro 2017 is an Energizer Bunny. I got almost 10 years from by MacBook Pro.
  - deleted 10d ago
    [deleted]
  - Gigachad 10d ago
    Depends on your expectations. Throwing a perfectly working laptop out after 7 years because apple cut off software support is wasteful to me. It might not be for you.
    - dymk 10d ago
      Why would you throw it out after 7 years? The software that’s already on it will continue to work just as it always has.
      - Gigachad 10d ago
        My experience with iPads losing Apple support is every app just shows you an error message saying your app is out of date and can't be used, while the app store won't let you update it because the latest api version doesn't support your device. Unless you are using all FOSS software, most apps want to connect to some server, and that connection breaks rapidly without updates. If you can load Linux on it it's still usable, but Apple OSs degrade rapidly after Apple stops supporting them. Apple is better about keeping devices on the latest OS version, but much worse about support after that period.
        dymk 9d ago
        iPads are a different device so I really have no idea why you’re bringing those up. Macs work fine even when the stop receiving updates 7 years doesn’t the line.

MYEUHD 10d ago

> past their intended lifespan Thanks to the community, you can install macOS 15 (or older) on unsupported macs (as old as 18 years) https://dortania.github.io/OpenCore-Legacy-Patcher/MODELS.html https://dortania.github.io/OpenCore-Legacy-Patcher/MODELS.ht... https://github.com/dortania/OpenCore-Legacy-Patcher https://github.com/dortania/OpenCore-Legacy-Patcher

Marsymars 10d ago
It's a bit awkward where newer Intel models with T2 chips don't support OpenCore, so e.g. the 2019 MBA is going to run out of security updates with macOS 14, sooner than a 2008 MBA that OpenCore will update up to macOS 15.

dymk 10d ago

> every few years of course That sounds like a you thing; I've kept my macs for at least 5 years. My M1 is still going strong and I haven't felt any pressure to upgrade.

alt227 10d ago
2 more years and your mac will not install the latest MacOS version, which then means you will no longer be able to update any software on your own computer or install any new software either. If you could install linux or any other OS on it you would be able to use it for decades to come, but instead you will be forced to buy another new shiny Apple box. You will probably argue thats ok because you would have wanted one anyway by that time or some such point, but the fact remains that Apple will force you to upgrade your hardware not very long away by not allowing you to install anything on it.
- dymk 10d ago
  That's not how macs work. You don't suddenly lose the ability to run new binaries just because they're not on the latest MacOS version. Using your own conservative estimate, 8 years seems like a fine lifespan for a laptop, far longer than the "few years" you initially said. And in practice, there are plenty of macbooks that have been running even longer.
  - edschofield 10d ago
    The parent commenter described exactly how Macs work. I have a beautiful 10-core iMac 27” with 72 GB of RAM from 2020 that Apple has now decided to turn into a lemon. macOS Tahoe runs as slow as molasses and no more macOS upgrades will be forthcoming. I downgraded to Sonoma (which cost me hours) and the machine runs well again for now but the App Store has already started refusing to update apps like Pages because macOS is old. Soon I won’t be able to install a single app through the App Store and Linux (T2 Linux in my case, not Asahi) will be the only option to keep using this terrific hardware.
  - Gigachad 10d ago
    Intel macs suddenly will lose the ability to run programs because Apple has dropped the requirement to ship an intel build. And from experience, as soon as Apple stops requiring devs support old hardware, nothing works anymore.

specialist 10d ago

My family continues to use my old 2009 MacBook Pro. YMMV