7 ms·

I heard a wonderful quote the other day: > Politics is just another word for how we treat our neighbors. So yes, as I accept this definition - I may choose a

by tmpz22 13d ago

I heard a wonderful quote the other day: > Politics is just another word for how we treat our neighbors. So yes, as I accept this definition - I may choose a "less efficient" tool if it treated my neighbor better.

backlava12 13d ago
You would willingly and intentionally chose a less secure password manager and put your company at risk? Is your management chain aware of this? Which company do you work for? They have the right to know.
- celsoazevedo 13d ago
  This doesn't concern me, but how do you go from "inferior product" to "less secure" and "let me contact your employer"? There are other secure password managers out there, including open-source alternatives, which can be considered to be inferior due to having fewer features or a worse UI. On a side note, while I'm sure some people only make decisions based on technical reasons, most don't. Not saying if it's right/wrong or better/worse, but that's how most humans work.
  - backlava12 13d ago
    No no no, you are dodging the question. My question could not have been more clear but you are trying to side step it: "You would willingly and intentionally chose a less secure password manager and put your company at risk?"? Yes or no? What company do you work for that is okay with that? To let your own personal politics compromise their security posture?
    - celsoazevedo 13d ago
      Slow down mate, you're not replying to the same user :-) You asked them the following: > Would you chose a product inferior to 1password if it better aligned with your politics? Nowhere in your question you mentioned security, but your conclusion was that they would pick a less secure option and that their employer should be made aware. Maybe not intentionally, but looks like you're trying to win the argument with some word twisting and a 'gotcha'? But maybe that's just my limited English. Anyway, I'm just pointing out that "inferior" doesn't mean "less secure" and that most people don't only choose things based on technical merits alone (I'd be surprised if you did). With this clarified... I will now leave the thread. Have a nice day!
      - backlava12 13d ago
        That wasn't my "conclusion", that was my question to them. There was no "gotcha" here, only asking OP to clarify their position on if they would let politics influence their decision making to the point of undermining their company's security posture.
        celsoazevedo 12d ago
        That "You would willingly and intentionally chose a less secure [...]" did sound like you assuming they would do it, but I guess I misunderstood what you were saying. My bad. By the way, if you don't consider politics when making these decisions, then I'm not sure if you're doing a very good job either. Your employer may lose customers as result, you may end up without access to the tools or having to move again due to new laws, etc. Politics are always there.
        backlava12 12d ago
        Trump won the popular vote while running a platform of mass deportations. It's just as likely to cut the other way, which goes back to my original point that this type of "woke outrage" is played out and no longer effective.
        celsoazevedo 11d ago
        That will depend a lot on the user/customer base you have. I doubt your business will continue as normal if you support those same ideas publicly and many of your clients are likely to be targeted, for example. The same would happen if you support complete opposite ideas and most of your clients think anyone that doesn't look like them should be deported. If there's a mix, well, you know you're going to piss off some of them. You always need to be aware of who you're dealing with. This was true 100 years ago, still is today, and I doubt it will ever change.
dismalaf 13d ago
I've got a neighbour that throws garbage onto my balcony, how should I treat them?
- Timon3 13d ago
  To stick with your analogy, why should that allow you to throw out every tenant who shares the ethnicity of your troublesome neighbor?
  - backlava12 13d ago
    Continuing the analogy: the new landlord started evicting tenants who are dumping their trash and there are other tenants protesting against those evictions and are defending the trash dumpers and will call you a Nazi for not wanting trash dumped on you.
    - Timon3 12d ago
      Nope, you don't get to dismiss the detail that DHH wants to deport people regardless of whether they've committed crimes. Let's fix that in your analogy: "The new landlord started evicting tenants of the same ethnicity as those who are dumping their trash and there are other tenants protesting against those evictions and are defending the trash dumpers and will call you a Nazi for wanting the entire ethnic group to get evicted." Funny that you happened to miss that small detail!
      - backlava12 12d ago
        Very weaselly comment. I didn't miss anything and I fully support DHH's position and even more his freedom to express that position.
        Timon3 12d ago
        Why, because I pointed out that your "continued" analogy fundamentally misrepresents the situation? IMO it is much more weaselly to push your agenda through deliberately manipulative comments that mislead the reader into viewing entire ethnic groups as guilty of crimes against them. But what other choice do you have, given that the average person considers collective punishments of entire ethnic groups to be abhorrent?

by tmpz22 13d ago

backlava12 13d ago

You would willingly and intentionally chose a less secure password manager and put your company at risk? Is your management chain aware of this? Which company do you work for? They have the right to know.

celsoazevedo 13d ago
This doesn't concern me, but how do you go from "inferior product" to "less secure" and "let me contact your employer"? There are other secure password managers out there, including open-source alternatives, which can be considered to be inferior due to having fewer features or a worse UI. On a side note, while I'm sure some people only make decisions based on technical reasons, most don't. Not saying if it's right/wrong or better/worse, but that's how most humans work.
- backlava12 13d ago
  No no no, you are dodging the question. My question could not have been more clear but you are trying to side step it: "You would willingly and intentionally chose a less secure password manager and put your company at risk?"? Yes or no? What company do you work for that is okay with that? To let your own personal politics compromise their security posture?
  - celsoazevedo 13d ago
    Slow down mate, you're not replying to the same user :-) You asked them the following: > Would you chose a product inferior to 1password if it better aligned with your politics? Nowhere in your question you mentioned security, but your conclusion was that they would pick a less secure option and that their employer should be made aware. Maybe not intentionally, but looks like you're trying to win the argument with some word twisting and a 'gotcha'? But maybe that's just my limited English. Anyway, I'm just pointing out that "inferior" doesn't mean "less secure" and that most people don't only choose things based on technical merits alone (I'd be surprised if you did). With this clarified... I will now leave the thread. Have a nice day!
    - backlava12 13d ago
      That wasn't my "conclusion", that was my question to them. There was no "gotcha" here, only asking OP to clarify their position on if they would let politics influence their decision making to the point of undermining their company's security posture.
      - celsoazevedo 12d ago
        That "You would willingly and intentionally chose a less secure [...]" did sound like you assuming they would do it, but I guess I misunderstood what you were saying. My bad. By the way, if you don't consider politics when making these decisions, then I'm not sure if you're doing a very good job either. Your employer may lose customers as result, you may end up without access to the tools or having to move again due to new laws, etc. Politics are always there.
        backlava12 12d ago
        Trump won the popular vote while running a platform of mass deportations. It's just as likely to cut the other way, which goes back to my original point that this type of "woke outrage" is played out and no longer effective.
        celsoazevedo 11d ago
        That will depend a lot on the user/customer base you have. I doubt your business will continue as normal if you support those same ideas publicly and many of your clients are likely to be targeted, for example. The same would happen if you support complete opposite ideas and most of your clients think anyone that doesn't look like them should be deported. If there's a mix, well, you know you're going to piss off some of them. You always need to be aware of who you're dealing with. This was true 100 years ago, still is today, and I doubt it will ever change.

dismalaf 13d ago

I've got a neighbour that throws garbage onto my balcony, how should I treat them?

Timon3 13d ago
To stick with your analogy, why should that allow you to throw out every tenant who shares the ethnicity of your troublesome neighbor?
- backlava12 13d ago
  Continuing the analogy: the new landlord started evicting tenants who are dumping their trash and there are other tenants protesting against those evictions and are defending the trash dumpers and will call you a Nazi for not wanting trash dumped on you.
  - Timon3 12d ago
    Nope, you don't get to dismiss the detail that DHH wants to deport people regardless of whether they've committed crimes. Let's fix that in your analogy: "The new landlord started evicting tenants of the same ethnicity as those who are dumping their trash and there are other tenants protesting against those evictions and are defending the trash dumpers and will call you a Nazi for wanting the entire ethnic group to get evicted." Funny that you happened to miss that small detail!
    - backlava12 12d ago
      Very weaselly comment. I didn't miss anything and I fully support DHH's position and even more his freedom to express that position.
      - Timon3 12d ago
        Why, because I pointed out that your "continued" analogy fundamentally misrepresents the situation? IMO it is much more weaselly to push your agenda through deliberately manipulative comments that mislead the reader into viewing entire ethnic groups as guilty of crimes against them. But what other choice do you have, given that the average person considers collective punishments of entire ethnic groups to be abhorrent?