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I think people shouldn't just jump to distros which are getting heavily hyped in media/Youtube, cachyOS had similar wave, and now Omarchy does. (example: Netwo

I think people shouldn't just jump to distros which are getting heavily hyped in media/Youtube, cachyOS had similar wave, and now Omarchy does. (example: NetworkChuck, Primeagen? and a few others) also, archlinux is much easier to install nowadays with archinstall [1], so i'm not sure you really need another opinionated layer on top of it [1] - https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/Archinstall https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/Archinstall

trap0xcc 14d ago
OP here, I couldn't agree more.
quadrifoliate 17d ago
[flagged]
- bigyabai 17d ago
  > In a different way you can see this in this thread where instead of discussing why Omarchy has the bug There's nothing interesting to discuss. Rootless OCI-compliant containers exist, and Omarchy ignored them. The "convenience" of the solution they chose simultaneously opens an enormous attack surface that the maintainers didn't consider. This is why I don't believe the "give me a macOS distro" people - even Apple wouldn't do this. If you want a preconfigured Mac-like distro, then you should use GNOME and not a pre-riced desktop with hundreds of dotfiles. You don't have to use Arch either, you can go with a graphical install of Fedora or CachyOS if you want. This will give you a system that you can understand, maintained by people with a minimum standard of quality, that actually resembles the workflow of macOS. There is no Niri or Sway rice that will magically make your system make sense, and this is why I think a lot of the Mac and Windows expats should just use a normal desktop.
  - quadrifoliate 17d ago
    > There's nothing interesting to discuss. Rootless OCI-compliant containers exist, and Omarchy ignored them. Why Omarchy chose to ignore all the rootless OCI-compliant containers; and also why docker itself isn't rootless yet is a pretty interesting thing to discuss. I'm not aware of the specifics being a Mac user myself, but others in the thread (e.g. here https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49500186 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49500186) say that podman still doesn't work 1:1 with docker exactly. If you disagree, that's a reasonable thing to discuss; but otherwise just saying "ha ha just use the rootless thing" is missing the point.
    - bigyabai 17d ago
      If you're not going to use rootless containers, then you simply cannot ship the rootful solution as default in a desktop operating system. There's absolutely meat on the bones regarding root/rootlessness, but that's not the problem at-hand. The problem is shipping vulnerable defaults, and the case is closed.
- fny 17d ago
  Why doesn't Ubuntu fit the bill? You can even install hombrew on it. Everything works like a mac with no fuss. Also the only reason I left Linux was due to hardware. Ubuntu was convenient enough.
  - lrvick 17d ago
    Homebrew is like giving a bunch of wikipedia randos remote shell access to your computer. There is no enforced code review policy. Any maintainer can make a commit under a pseudonym and merge their own code to main without review. Homebrew should not be allowed near any machine you need to be able to trust.
    - quadrifoliate 17d ago
      > Homebrew is like giving a bunch of wikipedia randos... And I'm guessing you go to https://www.britannica.com/ https://www.britannica.com/ when you want to learn something about a new topic, right?
      - lrvick 17d ago
        I love wikipedia for research. It is great that anon randos can help keep a common encyclopedia maintained with high accountability. If a mistake happens it is quickly corrected. But that trust model does not work with software. It is negligent that MacOS users, even those with prod access, all let any anon randos that sign up to be Homebrew maintainers execute any code they want on their computers with no accountability. By the time someone figures that out and corrects it, the damage is done. What is worse, is almost zero MacOS users I talk to are aware of this risk. Even security engineers. Many say "no worse than NPM" as if that is a defense.
    - pram 17d ago
      This isn't true at all lol, if you make a PR to the formulas it is certainly reviewed. By a real human no less. wtf are you talking about
      - 17d ago
- troupo 17d ago
  > if you encounter a problem with Arch and ask about it It's probably already documented on Arch wiki or it's a generic Linux issue that has already been solved by someone (that has been my experience with Cachy).
- supriyo-biswas 17d ago
  > As a developer who mostly wants a Mac-like Linux distro without the associated noise I'm required to use Ubuntu at work. Coming from Mac, apart from the menu bar at the top, on Gnome, I've been able to customize the keyboard shortcuts, remap the keyboard so that Ctrl works like Cmd, and use extensions like Dash to Dock[1] and themes like Whitesur[2] to replicate something that almost works like a Mac. The keyboard remapping and customizing keyboard shortcuts were all done within default the default settings app. The only things missing are some keyboard shortcuts like Ctrl+A/V to move to the beginning and end, and the Ctrl+Shift+C/V behavior on the terminal instead of Cmd+C, which I've just worked around by using VSCode's terminal and configuring it to copy when I press Ctrl+C with some text selected. [1] https://extensions.gnome.org/extension/307/dash-to-dock/ https://extensions.gnome.org/extension/307/dash-to-dock/ [2] https://github.com/vinceliuice/WhiteSur-icon-theme https://github.com/vinceliuice/WhiteSur-icon-theme
  - weaksauce 17d ago
    if you reset the keyboard shortcuts to their defaults and install toshy you can get the ctrl-a/e stuff and copy and paste in the command line with cmd-c/v and a lot of the other mac like keyboard shortcuts. it's really plug and play and works well... can't recommend it enough. (though there are some edge cases that may require some tweaks but overall it's great) https://github.com/RedBearAK/toshy https://github.com/RedBearAK/toshy
  - quadrifoliate 17d ago
    > The only things missing are some keyboard shortcuts like Ctrl+A/V to move to the beginning and end, and the Ctrl+Shift+C/V behavior on the terminal instead of Cmd+C, which I've just worked around by using VSCode's terminal and configuring it to copy when I press Ctrl+C with some text selected. The fact that you think this is acceptable shows that you don't appreciate the difference. Again, I haven't used Omarchy but the docs claim that Super + C and Super + V work everywhere, not with all the different exceptions you mention.
bundie 17d ago
Just use Fedora. It just werks (most times).
- kennywinker 17d ago
  I like the very non-windows very non-mac ui of omarchy.
  - tomrod 17d ago
    UI is desktop environment and (usually) ports to large-use distros cleanly. - JaKooLit’s Fedora-Hyprland Repository: https://github.com/JaKooLit/Fedora-Hyprland https://github.com/JaKooLit/Fedora-Hyprland. The most popular automated setup guide and installer for Fedora, bundling Hyprland alongside pre-configured bars, launchers, and - Official Hyprland Wiki: wiki.hypr.land/Getting-Started/Installation/. The main reference guide for core configuration options, environment variables, and Wayland portal requirements. - Solopasha Fedora COPR copr.fedorainfracloud.org/coprs/solopasha/hyprland. The primary community repository hosting cutting-edge builds of Hyprland and its ecosystem packages for - Fedora Discussion Tutorials: discussion.fedoraproject.org. Community walkthroughs covering minimal netinstall setups and distro-specific Wayland troubleshooting.
  - christophilus 17d ago
    I run Niri and Dank Material Sell on Fedora. It’s perfect, and better than Omarchy from what I’ve seen. I much prefer scrolling window managers to tilers.
    - porkloin 17d ago
      Yup. I've been on zirconium (https://github.com/zirconium-dev/zirconium https://github.com/zirconium-dev/zirconium) for a while, and it's great. Fedora atomic/bootc under the hood with Niri+DMS. Basically bombproof.
  - prmoustache 17d ago
    Fedora (or debian, or archlinux or whatever distro you choose) doesn't force you into an UI. All of them have minimal, server and/or "flavored" versions and you can always uninstall and install whatever you want.
sva_ 17d ago
I think this is more about the UI, rather than the install. I haven't tried it myself though. I think nowadays using quickshell anyone who is so inclined can vibecode their own UI though. I recently made the switch to Wayland/hyprland and rebuilt my polybar on quickshell, even adding widgets that allow getting system info/fine grained system control (interactive Bluetooth, WiFi, Volume, Brightness etc).
- kennywinker 17d ago
  Ah yes, the solution to software with massive security holes is for everyone to vibe code their own software with massive security holes. But in all seriousness, I am running omarchy now, and I will almost definitely be switching to arch at some point in the future.
  - sva_ 17d ago
    Even if you introduce bugs in your UI (which I think is not very likely if you have a basic understanding of your system), the chance that someone would exploit software that literally only runs on your own machine seems extremely unlikely to me. I've been using arch for over 10 years btw.
    - inigyou 17d ago
      Isn't the other half of AI that we can afford to look for exploits in one-off software?
      - bdcravens 17d ago
        The old human nature tendency of "Just ship it!" and the desire to move on to the next shiny thing on our wishlist doesn't go away with AI. If it anything, it makes it worse.
      - sva_ 17d ago
        I am not sure how someone would run an LLM on my computer to look for exploits as the source code is only available on my machine?
esskay 17d ago
Add that annoying theo guy to that list. Cant stand these people, they confidently push out videos like they're experts, a week later it turns out whatever they were talking about was total crap and they've already abandoned it - case in point OpenClaw. Look at the mess of videos those named above put out about it, not a single one uses it anymore.
- pibaker 17d ago
  There is only so much a human can master in his lifetime. And if you choose to master the art of video production, then you are probably not spending that much time on mastering the thing you yap about on camera…
  - lstodd 17d ago
    which is why you have to hire people who master the art of yap whatever on camera, so the video production guy can have something to work on. or did you think onlyfans?
  - KaiserPro 17d ago
    > if you choose to master the art of video production, then you are probably not spending that much time on mastering the thing What? Its perfectly possible to master two things. Video production isnt _that_ hard. Especially as lighting, shooting adding graphics and editing film is much much easier than 10 years ago.
    - skydhash 17d ago
      I was watching one guy explaining the xv6 code and it was pretty much one shot with a single camera pointing at the listing on paper. Not sure if you need professional video if you want to really expound on something.
      - KaiserPro 15d ago
        That is also a strong point. fancy visuals are nice, but if you can't explain, then there is little point mind you it also feeds into LLM output. Confident bullshit is better than "I dunno"
rramon 17d ago
Omarchy imo is best for agent maxxing Mac power users who aren't locked into Apples proprietary apps like Final Cut, audio production software or Adobe and Affinity, so maybe not so great for designers and photographers as the main system.
izacus 17d ago
Omarchy seems to be pentested by a bunch of angry haters. Who's pentesting your arch install? :P
- tomrod 17d ago
  Basic docker users are the same as angry haters I guess.
  - izacus 17d ago
    That's not what I claimed or said, do read my posts please and project less :)
    - tomrod 17d ago
      No harm, no foul izacus. I am laughing inside because I'm included in the "angry" group by default (I hate all Linux distros, less than Windows or MacOS) and I'm often a basic docker user but got over major DE customization like Omarchy when I needed to get thing done at a higher rate (back then the coolness was crunchbang).
starky 17d ago
I had just enough issues with archinstall the last time I tried it that I went back to EndeavourOS which essentially gets you a GUI installer and some pre-installed utilities on the stock Arch install. The only significant change I'm aware of is that they use dracut instead of mkinitcpio.
mentalgear 17d ago
Everything hyped is usually a counter quality signal
- hwyadenlaw 15d ago
  I disagree. I think it's more that most things aren't high quality, and hype doesn't reliably select for things that are.
syabro 17d ago
I think you are probably missing critical point that for someone omarchy is not about “bare arch” UI is crucial. If people want something easy to use out of the box without spending days to configuring it
- WuxiFingerHold 17d ago
  I think I get your point as omarchy represents a different kind of UI, but if it was just about getting a rock solid stable working environment, Fedora or Ubuntu with either Gnome and KDE work perfectly fine. I don't even use a third party terminal (just konsole). Keyboard driven terminal workflows works fine on KDE for me.
0xbadcafebee 17d ago
It's fine if they want to jump on fad distros. After all, Linux is a hobby OS, it's not for serious work.
- westpfelia 17d ago
  yea... Not like most of the worlds compute runs on linux.
WuxiFingerHold 17d ago
The problem is not the hype, the problem is that it's a vibe coded distro. AI lowers the bar substantially in terms of needed competence and diligence to create something like this. Of course bugs and issues are present in human created software as well, but now that everyone can vibe code a distro the chances of low quality software are much greater.
- deleted 16d ago
  [deleted]
zeratax 16d ago
i think cachyos actually does interesting things, but i still would never recommend an arch based distro to anyone

trap0xcc 14d ago

OP here, I couldn't agree more.

quadrifoliate 17d ago

[flagged]

bigyabai 17d ago
> In a different way you can see this in this thread where instead of discussing why Omarchy has the bug There's nothing interesting to discuss. Rootless OCI-compliant containers exist, and Omarchy ignored them. The "convenience" of the solution they chose simultaneously opens an enormous attack surface that the maintainers didn't consider. This is why I don't believe the "give me a macOS distro" people - even Apple wouldn't do this. If you want a preconfigured Mac-like distro, then you should use GNOME and not a pre-riced desktop with hundreds of dotfiles. You don't have to use Arch either, you can go with a graphical install of Fedora or CachyOS if you want. This will give you a system that you can understand, maintained by people with a minimum standard of quality, that actually resembles the workflow of macOS. There is no Niri or Sway rice that will magically make your system make sense, and this is why I think a lot of the Mac and Windows expats should just use a normal desktop.
- quadrifoliate 17d ago
  > There's nothing interesting to discuss. Rootless OCI-compliant containers exist, and Omarchy ignored them. Why Omarchy chose to ignore all the rootless OCI-compliant containers; and also why docker itself isn't rootless yet is a pretty interesting thing to discuss. I'm not aware of the specifics being a Mac user myself, but others in the thread (e.g. here https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49500186 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49500186) say that podman still doesn't work 1:1 with docker exactly. If you disagree, that's a reasonable thing to discuss; but otherwise just saying "ha ha just use the rootless thing" is missing the point.
  - bigyabai 17d ago
    If you're not going to use rootless containers, then you simply cannot ship the rootful solution as default in a desktop operating system. There's absolutely meat on the bones regarding root/rootlessness, but that's not the problem at-hand. The problem is shipping vulnerable defaults, and the case is closed.
fny 17d ago
Why doesn't Ubuntu fit the bill? You can even install hombrew on it. Everything works like a mac with no fuss. Also the only reason I left Linux was due to hardware. Ubuntu was convenient enough.
- lrvick 17d ago
  Homebrew is like giving a bunch of wikipedia randos remote shell access to your computer. There is no enforced code review policy. Any maintainer can make a commit under a pseudonym and merge their own code to main without review. Homebrew should not be allowed near any machine you need to be able to trust.
  - quadrifoliate 17d ago
    > Homebrew is like giving a bunch of wikipedia randos... And I'm guessing you go to https://www.britannica.com/ https://www.britannica.com/ when you want to learn something about a new topic, right?
    - lrvick 17d ago
      I love wikipedia for research. It is great that anon randos can help keep a common encyclopedia maintained with high accountability. If a mistake happens it is quickly corrected. But that trust model does not work with software. It is negligent that MacOS users, even those with prod access, all let any anon randos that sign up to be Homebrew maintainers execute any code they want on their computers with no accountability. By the time someone figures that out and corrects it, the damage is done. What is worse, is almost zero MacOS users I talk to are aware of this risk. Even security engineers. Many say "no worse than NPM" as if that is a defense.
  - pram 17d ago
    This isn't true at all lol, if you make a PR to the formulas it is certainly reviewed. By a real human no less. wtf are you talking about
    - 17d ago
troupo 17d ago
> if you encounter a problem with Arch and ask about it It's probably already documented on Arch wiki or it's a generic Linux issue that has already been solved by someone (that has been my experience with Cachy).
supriyo-biswas 17d ago
> As a developer who mostly wants a Mac-like Linux distro without the associated noise I'm required to use Ubuntu at work. Coming from Mac, apart from the menu bar at the top, on Gnome, I've been able to customize the keyboard shortcuts, remap the keyboard so that Ctrl works like Cmd, and use extensions like Dash to Dock[1] and themes like Whitesur[2] to replicate something that almost works like a Mac. The keyboard remapping and customizing keyboard shortcuts were all done within default the default settings app. The only things missing are some keyboard shortcuts like Ctrl+A/V to move to the beginning and end, and the Ctrl+Shift+C/V behavior on the terminal instead of Cmd+C, which I've just worked around by using VSCode's terminal and configuring it to copy when I press Ctrl+C with some text selected. [1] https://extensions.gnome.org/extension/307/dash-to-dock/ https://extensions.gnome.org/extension/307/dash-to-dock/ [2] https://github.com/vinceliuice/WhiteSur-icon-theme https://github.com/vinceliuice/WhiteSur-icon-theme
- weaksauce 17d ago
  if you reset the keyboard shortcuts to their defaults and install toshy you can get the ctrl-a/e stuff and copy and paste in the command line with cmd-c/v and a lot of the other mac like keyboard shortcuts. it's really plug and play and works well... can't recommend it enough. (though there are some edge cases that may require some tweaks but overall it's great) https://github.com/RedBearAK/toshy https://github.com/RedBearAK/toshy
- quadrifoliate 17d ago
  > The only things missing are some keyboard shortcuts like Ctrl+A/V to move to the beginning and end, and the Ctrl+Shift+C/V behavior on the terminal instead of Cmd+C, which I've just worked around by using VSCode's terminal and configuring it to copy when I press Ctrl+C with some text selected. The fact that you think this is acceptable shows that you don't appreciate the difference. Again, I haven't used Omarchy but the docs claim that Super + C and Super + V work everywhere, not with all the different exceptions you mention.

bundie 17d ago

Just use Fedora. It just werks (most times).

kennywinker 17d ago
I like the very non-windows very non-mac ui of omarchy.
- tomrod 17d ago
  UI is desktop environment and (usually) ports to large-use distros cleanly. - JaKooLit’s Fedora-Hyprland Repository: https://github.com/JaKooLit/Fedora-Hyprland https://github.com/JaKooLit/Fedora-Hyprland. The most popular automated setup guide and installer for Fedora, bundling Hyprland alongside pre-configured bars, launchers, and - Official Hyprland Wiki: wiki.hypr.land/Getting-Started/Installation/. The main reference guide for core configuration options, environment variables, and Wayland portal requirements. - Solopasha Fedora COPR copr.fedorainfracloud.org/coprs/solopasha/hyprland. The primary community repository hosting cutting-edge builds of Hyprland and its ecosystem packages for - Fedora Discussion Tutorials: discussion.fedoraproject.org. Community walkthroughs covering minimal netinstall setups and distro-specific Wayland troubleshooting.
- christophilus 17d ago
  I run Niri and Dank Material Sell on Fedora. It’s perfect, and better than Omarchy from what I’ve seen. I much prefer scrolling window managers to tilers.
  - porkloin 17d ago
    Yup. I've been on zirconium (https://github.com/zirconium-dev/zirconium https://github.com/zirconium-dev/zirconium) for a while, and it's great. Fedora atomic/bootc under the hood with Niri+DMS. Basically bombproof.
- prmoustache 17d ago
  Fedora (or debian, or archlinux or whatever distro you choose) doesn't force you into an UI. All of them have minimal, server and/or "flavored" versions and you can always uninstall and install whatever you want.

sva_ 17d ago

I think this is more about the UI, rather than the install. I haven't tried it myself though. I think nowadays using quickshell anyone who is so inclined can vibecode their own UI though. I recently made the switch to Wayland/hyprland and rebuilt my polybar on quickshell, even adding widgets that allow getting system info/fine grained system control (interactive Bluetooth, WiFi, Volume, Brightness etc).

kennywinker 17d ago
Ah yes, the solution to software with massive security holes is for everyone to vibe code their own software with massive security holes. But in all seriousness, I am running omarchy now, and I will almost definitely be switching to arch at some point in the future.
- sva_ 17d ago
  Even if you introduce bugs in your UI (which I think is not very likely if you have a basic understanding of your system), the chance that someone would exploit software that literally only runs on your own machine seems extremely unlikely to me. I've been using arch for over 10 years btw.
  - inigyou 17d ago
    Isn't the other half of AI that we can afford to look for exploits in one-off software?
    - bdcravens 17d ago
      The old human nature tendency of "Just ship it!" and the desire to move on to the next shiny thing on our wishlist doesn't go away with AI. If it anything, it makes it worse.
    - sva_ 17d ago
      I am not sure how someone would run an LLM on my computer to look for exploits as the source code is only available on my machine?

esskay 17d ago

Add that annoying theo guy to that list. Cant stand these people, they confidently push out videos like they're experts, a week later it turns out whatever they were talking about was total crap and they've already abandoned it - case in point OpenClaw. Look at the mess of videos those named above put out about it, not a single one uses it anymore.

pibaker 17d ago
There is only so much a human can master in his lifetime. And if you choose to master the art of video production, then you are probably not spending that much time on mastering the thing you yap about on camera…
- lstodd 17d ago
  which is why you have to hire people who master the art of yap whatever on camera, so the video production guy can have something to work on. or did you think onlyfans?
- KaiserPro 17d ago
  > if you choose to master the art of video production, then you are probably not spending that much time on mastering the thing What? Its perfectly possible to master two things. Video production isnt _that_ hard. Especially as lighting, shooting adding graphics and editing film is much much easier than 10 years ago.
  - skydhash 17d ago
    I was watching one guy explaining the xv6 code and it was pretty much one shot with a single camera pointing at the listing on paper. Not sure if you need professional video if you want to really expound on something.
    - KaiserPro 15d ago
      That is also a strong point. fancy visuals are nice, but if you can't explain, then there is little point mind you it also feeds into LLM output. Confident bullshit is better than "I dunno"

rramon 17d ago

Omarchy imo is best for agent maxxing Mac power users who aren't locked into Apples proprietary apps like Final Cut, audio production software or Adobe and Affinity, so maybe not so great for designers and photographers as the main system.

izacus 17d ago

Omarchy seems to be pentested by a bunch of angry haters. Who's pentesting your arch install? :P

tomrod 17d ago
Basic docker users are the same as angry haters I guess.
- izacus 17d ago
  That's not what I claimed or said, do read my posts please and project less :)
  - tomrod 17d ago
    No harm, no foul izacus. I am laughing inside because I'm included in the "angry" group by default (I hate all Linux distros, less than Windows or MacOS) and I'm often a basic docker user but got over major DE customization like Omarchy when I needed to get thing done at a higher rate (back then the coolness was crunchbang).

starky 17d ago

I had just enough issues with archinstall the last time I tried it that I went back to EndeavourOS which essentially gets you a GUI installer and some pre-installed utilities on the stock Arch install. The only significant change I'm aware of is that they use dracut instead of mkinitcpio.

mentalgear 17d ago

Everything hyped is usually a counter quality signal

hwyadenlaw 15d ago
I disagree. I think it's more that most things aren't high quality, and hype doesn't reliably select for things that are.

syabro 17d ago

I think you are probably missing critical point that for someone omarchy is not about “bare arch” UI is crucial. If people want something easy to use out of the box without spending days to configuring it

WuxiFingerHold 17d ago
I think I get your point as omarchy represents a different kind of UI, but if it was just about getting a rock solid stable working environment, Fedora or Ubuntu with either Gnome and KDE work perfectly fine. I don't even use a third party terminal (just konsole). Keyboard driven terminal workflows works fine on KDE for me.

0xbadcafebee 17d ago

It's fine if they want to jump on fad distros. After all, Linux is a hobby OS, it's not for serious work.

westpfelia 17d ago
yea... Not like most of the worlds compute runs on linux.

WuxiFingerHold 17d ago

The problem is not the hype, the problem is that it's a vibe coded distro. AI lowers the bar substantially in terms of needed competence and diligence to create something like this. Of course bugs and issues are present in human created software as well, but now that everyone can vibe code a distro the chances of low quality software are much greater.

deleted 16d ago
[deleted]

zeratax 16d ago

i think cachyos actually does interesting things, but i still would never recommend an arch based distro to anyone