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No, bringing the price of 50" 4k TVs down to $300 does not make up for lost jobs. That's an easy choice, which is why it was never presented to the American wor

No, bringing the price of 50" 4k TVs down to $300 does not make up for lost jobs. That's an easy choice, which is why it was never presented to the American worker but rather foisted upon us by shareholders in pursuit of profit and a government content to look the other way.

Hammershaft 21d ago
Advanced manufacturing requires cheap global inputs. Before tariffs, unemployments was ~3.5% and real wages were rising, and part of why wages have been rising is because the cost of goods like TVs have been falling.
- smallmancontrov 21d ago
  Just because the dumbest president in American History can't do industrial policy doesn't mean that industrial policy can't or shouldn't be done.
epolanski 21d ago
1. For the n-th time: manufacturing jobs are being lost to automation. Globally, not just in America. This is true in Asia as well. Manufacturing is facing the same fate of agriculture: machines and robots will keep displacing people. Nothing is going to stop it. 2. There is no such world where we'll choose to do things less efficiently to artificially save few jobs. And it's not about your TV being 100$ more expensive, it is about everything you touch and see being considerably more expensive, with a cascade effect on the businesses that need the equipment. 3. Average Joe in US is as much a shareholder as some imaginary person you have in mind. And a company's duty is towards shareholders first, workers second.
- triceratops 21d ago
  Everything you said is objectively true, except for one thing. > a company's duty is towards shareholders first, workers second. This is just like, an opinion, man. There's no reason a company has to be like that. It just benefits company management to act like it's an objective truth because their pay is stock-based.
  - epolanski 21d ago
    > There's no reason a company has to be like that. Law. Board and CEO have fiduciary duty towards shareholders.
    - Larrikin 21d ago
      If you search fiduciary duty on just this site you'll find hundreds of replies dating back years refuting your point.
    - triceratops 21d ago
      That doesn't mean what you think it means. Management has to act in shareholders' best interests especially when those conflict with their own. That's not the same thing as shareholders above workers (or anyone else for that matter).
- anjel 21d ago
  Good thing the birth rate is depressed then
- smallmancontrov 21d ago
  No, Average Joe (Median Joe) is not a shareholder, asset appreciation is not a meaningful fraction of his income so policies which dump labor to pump capital hurt Average Joe on net by a wide margin. Shareholders are 30/30/30 top 0.1%/1%/10%. You and I may be in those categories, but Average Joe is not.
  - otterley 21d ago
    Where are you getting these numbers? 54.3% of US households held a retirement account in 2022. https://www.federalreserve.gov/publications/files/scf23.pdf https://www.federalreserve.gov/publications/files/scf23.pdf
otterley 21d ago
If it’s such an easy choice, why wasn’t that the outcome?

Hammershaft 21d ago

Advanced manufacturing requires cheap global inputs. Before tariffs, unemployments was ~3.5% and real wages were rising, and part of why wages have been rising is because the cost of goods like TVs have been falling.

smallmancontrov 21d ago
Just because the dumbest president in American History can't do industrial policy doesn't mean that industrial policy can't or shouldn't be done.

epolanski 21d ago

1. For the n-th time: manufacturing jobs are being lost to automation. Globally, not just in America. This is true in Asia as well. Manufacturing is facing the same fate of agriculture: machines and robots will keep displacing people. Nothing is going to stop it. 2. There is no such world where we'll choose to do things less efficiently to artificially save few jobs. And it's not about your TV being 100$ more expensive, it is about everything you touch and see being considerably more expensive, with a cascade effect on the businesses that need the equipment. 3. Average Joe in US is as much a shareholder as some imaginary person you have in mind. And a company's duty is towards shareholders first, workers second.

triceratops 21d ago
Everything you said is objectively true, except for one thing. > a company's duty is towards shareholders first, workers second. This is just like, an opinion, man. There's no reason a company has to be like that. It just benefits company management to act like it's an objective truth because their pay is stock-based.
- epolanski 21d ago
  > There's no reason a company has to be like that. Law. Board and CEO have fiduciary duty towards shareholders.
  - Larrikin 21d ago
    If you search fiduciary duty on just this site you'll find hundreds of replies dating back years refuting your point.
  - triceratops 21d ago
    That doesn't mean what you think it means. Management has to act in shareholders' best interests especially when those conflict with their own. That's not the same thing as shareholders above workers (or anyone else for that matter).
anjel 21d ago
Good thing the birth rate is depressed then
smallmancontrov 21d ago
No, Average Joe (Median Joe) is not a shareholder, asset appreciation is not a meaningful fraction of his income so policies which dump labor to pump capital hurt Average Joe on net by a wide margin. Shareholders are 30/30/30 top 0.1%/1%/10%. You and I may be in those categories, but Average Joe is not.
- otterley 21d ago
  Where are you getting these numbers? 54.3% of US households held a retirement account in 2022. https://www.federalreserve.gov/publications/files/scf23.pdf https://www.federalreserve.gov/publications/files/scf23.pdf

otterley 21d ago

If it’s such an easy choice, why wasn’t that the outcome?