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Is it cynical, or simply realistic, to recognize that AI CEO's won't ask for this kind of policy, and governments won't force anything upon the AI sector until

by beloch 21d ago

Is it cynical, or simply realistic, to recognize that AI CEO's won't ask for this kind of policy, and governments won't force anything upon the AI sector until things get very bad? That, in my view, is a much bigger problem. We know what's coming but we won't do anything about it until after a lot of suffering occurs. Why can't we be more proactive?

marcus_holmes 21d ago
This is Gates' point, isn't it? We need to be more proactive, and he has suggestions for what to do now, before the bad times.
- selfhoster1312 21d ago
  The solutions Gates proposes aren't even close to being adequate, they are detrimental to actual solutions. Gates claims AI regulation will make sure AI solves the climate crisis for all. AI is in fact a major contributor to the climate crisis, and AI industries are now the biggest fossil fuel lobbyists across the world. (not suggesting that CO2 is the biggest environmental problem we face) So the man who profited off the Microsoft monster now is proposing anti-solutions to a real problem he helped develop, and we're supposed to actually give him credit? Listen to the real specialists with credible analysis: people like James Mickens on the AI side, and people like Aurore Stéphant on the tech sustainability side.
bryan0 21d ago
Yes, I think we all agree AI companies should not be responsible or expected to come up with the best AI policies for society. Gates addresses this directly: > It is great that some AI companies are proposing solutions to challenges raised by their own technology, but we should not expect them to lead the charge. Some of the issues are outside their area of expertise, and in a democratic society it’s not their role to decide these things. Instead, solutions should be developed through a public democratic process that includes elected officials, policymakers, educators, health workers, local officials, and community leaders.
Erem 21d ago
> and governments won't force anything upon the AI sector until things get very bad? I think Mamdani and AOC would do it yesterday if they were in charge, and they're incredibly popular politicians to their constituents. More like them are waiting in the wings. So I think it's cynical rather than realistic.
- idiotsecant 20d ago
  'if they were in charge' is the mechanism by which this will not be fixed. AOC has been so thoroughly vilified in the eyes of the majority of the country that she has no chance of, for example, a presidential run. The same is true of pretty much every progressive candidate. There is an enormously well funded (by both political parties) machine designed to grind progressives into dust and it is extremely effective.
  - JohnnyMarcone 20d ago
    The same was said about our current president, there was no chance he could win, and look where we are. I can just about guarantee there will be several progressives running in '28, potentially AOC as one of them. Even if a progressive doesn't win the nomination, whoever does could be pushed toward the progressive direction. Also don't forget two years is a long time and things can change fast.
    - idiotsecant 20d ago
      You're not wrong, I would have said the same about trump. I think Trump benefitted somewhat from being a political 'dark horse' without any preexisting baggage but who knows!
oblio 21d ago
Because people don't work like that. The Titanic was put to sea with life rafts for half its passengers and most people were ok with that kind of logic. It took a massive media campaign around the disaster and the many deaths for change to happen. Slavery is still legal in some places despite toddlers instinctively knowing that freedom is important since the dawn of humans around the world.

by beloch 21d ago

marcus_holmes 21d ago

This is Gates' point, isn't it? We need to be more proactive, and he has suggestions for what to do now, before the bad times.

selfhoster1312 21d ago
The solutions Gates proposes aren't even close to being adequate, they are detrimental to actual solutions. Gates claims AI regulation will make sure AI solves the climate crisis for all. AI is in fact a major contributor to the climate crisis, and AI industries are now the biggest fossil fuel lobbyists across the world. (not suggesting that CO2 is the biggest environmental problem we face) So the man who profited off the Microsoft monster now is proposing anti-solutions to a real problem he helped develop, and we're supposed to actually give him credit? Listen to the real specialists with credible analysis: people like James Mickens on the AI side, and people like Aurore Stéphant on the tech sustainability side.

bryan0 21d ago

Yes, I think we all agree AI companies should not be responsible or expected to come up with the best AI policies for society. Gates addresses this directly: > It is great that some AI companies are proposing solutions to challenges raised by their own technology, but we should not expect them to lead the charge. Some of the issues are outside their area of expertise, and in a democratic society it’s not their role to decide these things. Instead, solutions should be developed through a public democratic process that includes elected officials, policymakers, educators, health workers, local officials, and community leaders.

Erem 21d ago

> and governments won't force anything upon the AI sector until things get very bad? I think Mamdani and AOC would do it yesterday if they were in charge, and they're incredibly popular politicians to their constituents. More like them are waiting in the wings. So I think it's cynical rather than realistic.

idiotsecant 20d ago
'if they were in charge' is the mechanism by which this will not be fixed. AOC has been so thoroughly vilified in the eyes of the majority of the country that she has no chance of, for example, a presidential run. The same is true of pretty much every progressive candidate. There is an enormously well funded (by both political parties) machine designed to grind progressives into dust and it is extremely effective.
- JohnnyMarcone 20d ago
  The same was said about our current president, there was no chance he could win, and look where we are. I can just about guarantee there will be several progressives running in '28, potentially AOC as one of them. Even if a progressive doesn't win the nomination, whoever does could be pushed toward the progressive direction. Also don't forget two years is a long time and things can change fast.
  - idiotsecant 20d ago
    You're not wrong, I would have said the same about trump. I think Trump benefitted somewhat from being a political 'dark horse' without any preexisting baggage but who knows!

oblio 21d ago

Because people don't work like that. The Titanic was put to sea with life rafts for half its passengers and most people were ok with that kind of logic. It took a massive media campaign around the disaster and the many deaths for change to happen. Slavery is still legal in some places despite toddlers instinctively knowing that freedom is important since the dawn of humans around the world.