9 ms·

Man Charged with 3 Felonies for Breaking 3D-Printed 'Decoy' Flock Camera

43 points by monksy 22d ago

monksy 22d ago
Weird that the police are so motivated to resolve this. It's almost like they don't serve the community.
- toomuchtodo 22d ago
  They are motivated to have control. They are also lazy and would prefer an easy job with less privacy than a harder job with more privacy. Therefore, police want ALPRs, and Flock wants contracts paid for by taxpayers for their enterprise value. “Show me the incentives, and I'll show you the outcome.” Next step would be for citizens to build profiles on their local police departments and law enforcement in general if the adversarial relationship continues, as law enforcement officers appear to be disproportionally predisposed to committing crimes. I have a thesis on why those attracted to these jobs are more likely to be criminals, but will save that for another thread. “Show me the man and I’ll show you the crime." Put them under the microscope, like they wish to do to the public. The panopticon works both ways. Fundamentally, you have to build systems to make law enforcement allergic to treating their local citizens like this. They have forgotten who they are supposed to protect and serve. Remind them, while remaining firmly within the legal framework. Or, just take the ALPRs down. That is a choice. Eventually, supporters of ALPRs will be voted out, but it might take a while (election cycles). The IJ Database of ALPR Abuse - https://ij.org/the-ij-database-of-alpr-abuse/ https://ij.org/the-ij-database-of-alpr-abuse/ (173 incidents documented, as of this comment) Resource spotlight: Data projects tracking police misconduct, use of force, and employment histories - https://www.prisonpolicy.org/blog/2026/01/26/police_misconduct/ https://www.prisonpolicy.org/blog/2026/01/26/police_miscondu... - January 26th, 2026 Study finds police officers arrested 1,100 times per year, or 3 per day, nationwide - https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/true-crime/wp/2016/06/22/study-finds-1100-police-officers-per-year-or-3-per-day-are-arrested-nationwide/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/true-crime/wp/2016/06/22... | https://archive.today/uS3yR https://archive.today/uS3yR - June 23rd, 2016 Police Integrity Lost: A Study of Law Enforcement Officers Arrested - https://web.archive.org/web/20260610154033/https://www.ojp.gov/pdffiles1/nij/grants/249850.pdf https://web.archive.org/web/20260610154033/https://www.ojp.g... (and lets not forget our forum favorite on the topic of police misconduct, the Marion County Record, with damages exceeding $4M for the police misconduct that occurred) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49281087 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49281087 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45915211 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45915211
metalman 22d ago
there is a legal concept of what is called an "atractive nuisance" ie: something privatly owned but placed unatended in a public or highly visible place, which has long been known to contribute to bad behavior that otherwise would not occur, and also a much more serious crime of entrapment, which seems to be applicable in this case. That the police would engage in these activities would normaly be inconcievable.
- voxic11 22d ago
  Attractive nuisance laws only apply to things likely to attract children, not grown adults.
  - deleted 22d ago
    [deleted]
  - metalman 22d ago
    good to know, good to know
- 20after4 22d ago
  You must not know much about the history of policing.
yboris 22d ago
Counterpoint: Grand Jury Declines to Indict Man Caught on Camera Destroying Flock Pole Basically jury nullification https://futurism.com/future-society/grand-jury-ohio-flock-alpr-surveillance-felony-legal https://futurism.com/future-society/grand-jury-ohio-flock-al...
- mikestew 22d ago
  Not jury nullification, that's how grand juries work: do we move forward (go to trial) with this or not? And the grand jury said "not". Whereas what you're thinking of is "we the jury think the defendant did, indeed, break the law. But we think the law sucks, so 'not guilty'." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jury_nullification https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jury_nullification
yboris 22d ago
I'm curious about the memespace HN people inhabit. I've been hearing about Halloween is National DeFlock Day for a while -- anyone else come across this rapidly-spreading meme?
- x______________ 22d ago
  I came across a single version of it. My first thought was that if this goes ahead, it will likely start the process for ruining Halloween..
  - soraminazuki 22d ago
    So your argument for accepting omnipresent surveillance systems is that opposing it "ruins" Halloween. Welp, we'll all have to hope that your once a year cosplay party is worth the number of lives ruined by Flock. Which, may I remind you, is used by law enforcement to stalk their romantic interests and also put innocent people behind bars.
    - x______________ 19d ago
      > So your argument for accepting omnipresent surveillance systems is that opposing it "ruins" Halloween No, if you abuse a day where everyone dresses up for fun to commit crimes, the fun dress-up part will no longer be tolerated. If you still think that it's a good idea to have a purge night, foresight doesn't seem to be your strong point regardless as to whom or why they are oppressing you. Keep in mind that Flock is just another flavor of the day. Also the stalking argument is old and stale: it's the same talking points presented with Facebook admins stalking loved one, and then again in the Snowden leaks... and then it becomes normalized after a while. First time?
      - soraminazuki 15d ago
        What you said "ruins Halloween" is this: > I've been hearing about Halloween is National DeFlock Day for a while According to you, that's "committing crimes." I know that times are different now, but thoughtcrimes and de facto criminalization without legal codification are supposed to be unjust and unconstitutional. It's even more ironic when someone so obsessed with law and order goes so far as to invent crimes while ignoring the actual crimes that prompted the protests in the first place. So hypocritical. Mass surveillance, stalking, and putting people behind bars without evidence is supposed to be illegal, you know. Also, stalking is okay as long as it's normalized? Wow, that's literally the logic of predators. No wonder your reply is what it is. Our guiding ethics are incompatible on a fundamental level.
deleted 22d ago
[deleted]
1970-01-01 22d ago
3 felonies? Here's what that changes for vandals: Why should I bother with the saw at this point? I'll just use my gun.
bko 22d ago
This is an incredibly effective way to catch criminals. I wish police used more of these sting operations. I've seen videos where YouTubers set up a decoy to tempt all sorts of criminals, from package thieves to people stealing cars.If a YouTuber can lure someone that easily, no reason police can't do the same and arrest the handful of individuals that are terrorizing neighborhoods.
- Terr_ 22d ago
  > This is an incredibly effective way That seems at-odds with the article's aside that: > The operation is reminiscent of Amazon “package sting” operations that several police departments attempted several years ago, in which empty Amazon boxes were placed on people’s porches while police officers watched. Those sting operations resulted in zero known arrests.
- monksy 22d ago
  Are these criminals? This is a device that tracks, stalks, and investigates individuals without their consent. Additionally, these are contracts that were entered into and that are forced upon people. People's resistance to these have been punished aggressively. (From the video of the public council meetings I've seen). In addition these devices are setup to enforce state laws outside of where the law is relivant at. (I.e. a woman has been tracked outside of the state to evaluate compliance with abortion law in texas). To me this shows it's a breakdown of the agreement of law between the citizens and the government.
  - bko 22d ago
    Yes, destroying property is criminal. You can't go around destroying property because they're used in policies you don't agree with. If I think abortion is murder, can I go bomb abortion clinics? Resistance to legal police work should be punished severely.
    - bigtex88 22d ago
      Mmmm I love fascist surveillance states!
amazingamazing 22d ago
The amount of highly upvoted incorrect statements here is hilarious
Terr_ 22d ago
> Despite the decoy camera being worth, at most, several dollars worth of plastic filament, Evan Meyer was charged with three felonies: attempted larceny/grand theft, criminal mischief of property damage worth more than $1,000, and property crimes against computer equipment supplies, according to an arrest report obtained by 404 Media. It sounds like the police and district attorney [0] are playing fast and loose with the charges, blending issues of intent (to harm an expensive camera) versus fact (not actually causing much damage.) [0] AFAICT this is Oviedo, Florida, part of Seminole County, so part of the 18th judicial circuit and therefore the prosecutor who approved these charges is William Scheiner.
- donavanm 22d ago
  The damage estimate they use will be hypothetical total replacement cost, including multiple employees time, truck use, permits etc. its very trivial for any sort of repair to have a nominal cost in the thousands.
  - Terr_ 22d ago
    Hypothetical damages only make sense if he was charged with a lesser crime of "attempted" X... however I don't see that modifier in the news reporting. My concern is that the prosecution is trying to mix-and-match the severity of factual crimes with theoretical outcomes in a way which is illogical and unjust. IANAL, but for example the article says they're charging him with real (not attempted) criminal mischief over $1,000. Looking it up [0] that reads as requiring a threshold of actual damage in dollars. It's as if someone was charged with real (not attempted) first-degree murder despite the "murdered" person walking around totally unharmed. That'd be nonsense, right? We'd at least be asking what kind of brain-damage caused the prosecutor to do that instead of lowering it to "attempted murder". There's different section [1] about attempts in a very general sense, but even then it's not clear how the math works when it was a setup and real assets were never in danger. [0] https://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&URL=0800-0899/0806/Sections/0806.13.html https://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Disp... [1] https://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&Search_String=&URL=0700-0799/0777/Sections/0777.04.html https://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Disp...
tancop 22d ago
This is the same kind of case as someone arrested for cocaine possession when the drug is made of powder milk and caffeine with zero controlled substances. Prosecution has to prove the suspect was going to sell it as real drugs, it can't be illegal to have something on you just because it's possible to confuse for something else. In this case they might need to prove that the man did not know the camera was a decoy, otherwise it's just misdemeanor vandalism or less. Proving a negative in a criminal case is hard and when it's about a person's mental state it might be literally impossible. We'll see.

43 points by monksy 22d ago

monksy 22d ago

Weird that the police are so motivated to resolve this. It's almost like they don't serve the community.

toomuchtodo 22d ago
They are motivated to have control. They are also lazy and would prefer an easy job with less privacy than a harder job with more privacy. Therefore, police want ALPRs, and Flock wants contracts paid for by taxpayers for their enterprise value. “Show me the incentives, and I'll show you the outcome.” Next step would be for citizens to build profiles on their local police departments and law enforcement in general if the adversarial relationship continues, as law enforcement officers appear to be disproportionally predisposed to committing crimes. I have a thesis on why those attracted to these jobs are more likely to be criminals, but will save that for another thread. “Show me the man and I’ll show you the crime." Put them under the microscope, like they wish to do to the public. The panopticon works both ways. Fundamentally, you have to build systems to make law enforcement allergic to treating their local citizens like this. They have forgotten who they are supposed to protect and serve. Remind them, while remaining firmly within the legal framework. Or, just take the ALPRs down. That is a choice. Eventually, supporters of ALPRs will be voted out, but it might take a while (election cycles). The IJ Database of ALPR Abuse - https://ij.org/the-ij-database-of-alpr-abuse/ https://ij.org/the-ij-database-of-alpr-abuse/ (173 incidents documented, as of this comment) Resource spotlight: Data projects tracking police misconduct, use of force, and employment histories - https://www.prisonpolicy.org/blog/2026/01/26/police_misconduct/ https://www.prisonpolicy.org/blog/2026/01/26/police_miscondu... - January 26th, 2026 Study finds police officers arrested 1,100 times per year, or 3 per day, nationwide - https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/true-crime/wp/2016/06/22/study-finds-1100-police-officers-per-year-or-3-per-day-are-arrested-nationwide/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/true-crime/wp/2016/06/22... | https://archive.today/uS3yR https://archive.today/uS3yR - June 23rd, 2016 Police Integrity Lost: A Study of Law Enforcement Officers Arrested - https://web.archive.org/web/20260610154033/https://www.ojp.gov/pdffiles1/nij/grants/249850.pdf https://web.archive.org/web/20260610154033/https://www.ojp.g... (and lets not forget our forum favorite on the topic of police misconduct, the Marion County Record, with damages exceeding $4M for the police misconduct that occurred) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49281087 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49281087 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45915211 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45915211

metalman 22d ago

there is a legal concept of what is called an "atractive nuisance" ie: something privatly owned but placed unatended in a public or highly visible place, which has long been known to contribute to bad behavior that otherwise would not occur, and also a much more serious crime of entrapment, which seems to be applicable in this case. That the police would engage in these activities would normaly be inconcievable.

voxic11 22d ago
Attractive nuisance laws only apply to things likely to attract children, not grown adults.
- deleted 22d ago
  [deleted]
- metalman 22d ago
  good to know, good to know
20after4 22d ago
You must not know much about the history of policing.

yboris 22d ago

Counterpoint: Grand Jury Declines to Indict Man Caught on Camera Destroying Flock Pole Basically jury nullification https://futurism.com/future-society/grand-jury-ohio-flock-alpr-surveillance-felony-legal https://futurism.com/future-society/grand-jury-ohio-flock-al...

mikestew 22d ago
Not jury nullification, that's how grand juries work: do we move forward (go to trial) with this or not? And the grand jury said "not". Whereas what you're thinking of is "we the jury think the defendant did, indeed, break the law. But we think the law sucks, so 'not guilty'." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jury_nullification https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jury_nullification

yboris 22d ago

I'm curious about the memespace HN people inhabit. I've been hearing about Halloween is National DeFlock Day for a while -- anyone else come across this rapidly-spreading meme?

x______________ 22d ago
I came across a single version of it. My first thought was that if this goes ahead, it will likely start the process for ruining Halloween..
- soraminazuki 22d ago
  So your argument for accepting omnipresent surveillance systems is that opposing it "ruins" Halloween. Welp, we'll all have to hope that your once a year cosplay party is worth the number of lives ruined by Flock. Which, may I remind you, is used by law enforcement to stalk their romantic interests and also put innocent people behind bars.
  - x______________ 19d ago
    > So your argument for accepting omnipresent surveillance systems is that opposing it "ruins" Halloween No, if you abuse a day where everyone dresses up for fun to commit crimes, the fun dress-up part will no longer be tolerated. If you still think that it's a good idea to have a purge night, foresight doesn't seem to be your strong point regardless as to whom or why they are oppressing you. Keep in mind that Flock is just another flavor of the day. Also the stalking argument is old and stale: it's the same talking points presented with Facebook admins stalking loved one, and then again in the Snowden leaks... and then it becomes normalized after a while. First time?
    - soraminazuki 15d ago
      What you said "ruins Halloween" is this: > I've been hearing about Halloween is National DeFlock Day for a while According to you, that's "committing crimes." I know that times are different now, but thoughtcrimes and de facto criminalization without legal codification are supposed to be unjust and unconstitutional. It's even more ironic when someone so obsessed with law and order goes so far as to invent crimes while ignoring the actual crimes that prompted the protests in the first place. So hypocritical. Mass surveillance, stalking, and putting people behind bars without evidence is supposed to be illegal, you know. Also, stalking is okay as long as it's normalized? Wow, that's literally the logic of predators. No wonder your reply is what it is. Our guiding ethics are incompatible on a fundamental level.

deleted 22d ago

[deleted]

1970-01-01 22d ago

3 felonies? Here's what that changes for vandals: Why should I bother with the saw at this point? I'll just use my gun.

bko 22d ago

This is an incredibly effective way to catch criminals. I wish police used more of these sting operations. I've seen videos where YouTubers set up a decoy to tempt all sorts of criminals, from package thieves to people stealing cars.If a YouTuber can lure someone that easily, no reason police can't do the same and arrest the handful of individuals that are terrorizing neighborhoods.

Terr_ 22d ago
> This is an incredibly effective way That seems at-odds with the article's aside that: > The operation is reminiscent of Amazon “package sting” operations that several police departments attempted several years ago, in which empty Amazon boxes were placed on people’s porches while police officers watched. Those sting operations resulted in zero known arrests.
monksy 22d ago
Are these criminals? This is a device that tracks, stalks, and investigates individuals without their consent. Additionally, these are contracts that were entered into and that are forced upon people. People's resistance to these have been punished aggressively. (From the video of the public council meetings I've seen). In addition these devices are setup to enforce state laws outside of where the law is relivant at. (I.e. a woman has been tracked outside of the state to evaluate compliance with abortion law in texas). To me this shows it's a breakdown of the agreement of law between the citizens and the government.
- bko 22d ago
  Yes, destroying property is criminal. You can't go around destroying property because they're used in policies you don't agree with. If I think abortion is murder, can I go bomb abortion clinics? Resistance to legal police work should be punished severely.
  - bigtex88 22d ago
    Mmmm I love fascist surveillance states!

amazingamazing 22d ago

The amount of highly upvoted incorrect statements here is hilarious

Terr_ 22d ago

> Despite the decoy camera being worth, at most, several dollars worth of plastic filament, Evan Meyer was charged with three felonies: attempted larceny/grand theft, criminal mischief of property damage worth more than $1,000, and property crimes against computer equipment supplies, according to an arrest report obtained by 404 Media. It sounds like the police and district attorney [0] are playing fast and loose with the charges, blending issues of intent (to harm an expensive camera) versus fact (not actually causing much damage.) [0] AFAICT this is Oviedo, Florida, part of Seminole County, so part of the 18th judicial circuit and therefore the prosecutor who approved these charges is William Scheiner.

donavanm 22d ago
The damage estimate they use will be hypothetical total replacement cost, including multiple employees time, truck use, permits etc. its very trivial for any sort of repair to have a nominal cost in the thousands.
- Terr_ 22d ago
  Hypothetical damages only make sense if he was charged with a lesser crime of "attempted" X... however I don't see that modifier in the news reporting. My concern is that the prosecution is trying to mix-and-match the severity of factual crimes with theoretical outcomes in a way which is illogical and unjust. IANAL, but for example the article says they're charging him with real (not attempted) criminal mischief over $1,000. Looking it up [0] that reads as requiring a threshold of actual damage in dollars. It's as if someone was charged with real (not attempted) first-degree murder despite the "murdered" person walking around totally unharmed. That'd be nonsense, right? We'd at least be asking what kind of brain-damage caused the prosecutor to do that instead of lowering it to "attempted murder". There's different section [1] about attempts in a very general sense, but even then it's not clear how the math works when it was a setup and real assets were never in danger. [0] https://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&URL=0800-0899/0806/Sections/0806.13.html https://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Disp... [1] https://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&Search_String=&URL=0700-0799/0777/Sections/0777.04.html https://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Disp...

tancop 22d ago

This is the same kind of case as someone arrested for cocaine possession when the drug is made of powder milk and caffeine with zero controlled substances. Prosecution has to prove the suspect was going to sell it as real drugs, it can't be illegal to have something on you just because it's possible to confuse for something else. In this case they might need to prove that the man did not know the camera was a decoy, otherwise it's just misdemeanor vandalism or less. Proving a negative in a criminal case is hard and when it's about a person's mental state it might be literally impossible. We'll see.