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> A timely reminder that, damn, China is olllldddd. China proper starts about 1000 BC, so China is quite a bit younger than Europe. (Whatever "Europe" is.)

drabbiticus 24d ago
> quite a bit younger than You have introduced a comparison, which thus begs the following questions: 1. What is the event that defines "China proper"? 2. What is the event that defines "Europe [proper]" to you?
- otabdeveloper4 24d ago
  1. Whatever was happening in Zhou. (Not sure it was really a "dynasty" pe se.) 2. Proto-Indo-European and Ancient Egyptian cultural norms and patterns are still very much alive in "Europe" today, so probably the invention of the wheel in the early Bronze Age is a good start.
irdc 24d ago
If you define Europe as Sumer or Egypt, then yes. If you define Europe as Rome, then no. The earliest deciphered Greek writing dates from 1450 BC (Linear B) but that civilisation fell in the Bronze Age collapse and there is no (written) continuity with Europe as it stands today. As far as I'm concerned we're all equally ancient descendants from LUCA.
- yencabulator 24d ago
  It all comes down to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recent_African_origin_of_modern_humans https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recent_African_origin_of_moder... but most racists don't want to think of their African origins.
jmclnx 24d ago
We need to define "older". All areas are old, but it is history that can make one area seem old. Of course I am ignoring Africa, the oldest of all in Human History. I think this thread is referring to record keeping. In Europe and especially in the mid-east, when an area was conquered, seems the trend was to destroy written records. I think when that happened in China, a lot written records survived, so it has the appearance of being older.
- otabdeveloper4 24d ago
  Egyptian and Sumerian writing predates oracle bone script by about 2000 years.
EdwardDiego 22d ago
So you're comparing China "proper" to Europe "whatever that is" ...? Not exactly apples and apples mate.

drabbiticus 24d ago

> quite a bit younger than You have introduced a comparison, which thus begs the following questions: 1. What is the event that defines "China proper"? 2. What is the event that defines "Europe [proper]" to you?

otabdeveloper4 24d ago
1. Whatever was happening in Zhou. (Not sure it was really a "dynasty" pe se.) 2. Proto-Indo-European and Ancient Egyptian cultural norms and patterns are still very much alive in "Europe" today, so probably the invention of the wheel in the early Bronze Age is a good start.

irdc 24d ago

If you define Europe as Sumer or Egypt, then yes. If you define Europe as Rome, then no. The earliest deciphered Greek writing dates from 1450 BC (Linear B) but that civilisation fell in the Bronze Age collapse and there is no (written) continuity with Europe as it stands today. As far as I'm concerned we're all equally ancient descendants from LUCA.

yencabulator 24d ago
It all comes down to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recent_African_origin_of_modern_humans https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recent_African_origin_of_moder... but most racists don't want to think of their African origins.

jmclnx 24d ago

We need to define "older". All areas are old, but it is history that can make one area seem old. Of course I am ignoring Africa, the oldest of all in Human History. I think this thread is referring to record keeping. In Europe and especially in the mid-east, when an area was conquered, seems the trend was to destroy written records. I think when that happened in China, a lot written records survived, so it has the appearance of being older.

otabdeveloper4 24d ago
Egyptian and Sumerian writing predates oracle bone script by about 2000 years.

EdwardDiego 22d ago

So you're comparing China "proper" to Europe "whatever that is" ...? Not exactly apples and apples mate.