6 ms·

The problem is that once you draw "the line", then what? Warehouse a bunch of helpless people in overcrowded prisons? Bus them to some other less-draconian muni

The problem is that once you draw "the line", then what? Warehouse a bunch of helpless people in overcrowded prisons? Bus them to some other less-draconian municipality? Forcibly drug them into quasi-submission and then turn them loose again until the depot injection wears off? Or perhaps we should "just kill 'em", as Fox & Friends cohost Brian Kilmeade once suggested?

kraken_cult 23d ago
Forced rehab if needed and then somewhere they can work to pay their way, learn the skills to help themselves. There's a ton of manual labor that needs doing, potholes to be fixed.
- csullivannet 23d ago
  Oh, so forced labour then?
  - qwerpy 23d ago
    If someone’s forcing society to pay for their living expenses, it only seems fair for society to force them to labor to cover the expenses. I’m sure the next objection will be “what, so you’re going to concentrate them in some kind of camp?” Yes because that’s the smart thing to do with a large scale problem. Use scalable solutions.
    - mrguyorama 22d ago
      >If someone’s forcing society to pay for their living expenses, But the mentally unwell person didn't force society to pay for their living expenses. Society decided it couldn't stand them living their life the way they were and locked them up. Society pays for locking people up because it is done for the benefit of society. The point is that a functioning society is more productive than an unorganized one, and so can afford to do that kind of thing.
Dylan16807 23d ago
If they're doing lots of vandalism then yes put them in prisons. Get rid of 90% of drug charges to make room. You get a much better score if the imprisonment is trying to rehab them, of course.
alex43578 23d ago
If they are committing crimes, they should be imprisoned for an appropriate period of time as a deterrent to crime, a punishment for their actions, and to facilitate rehabilitation (even though evidence shows this doesn't really happen). If they are mentally ill and unable to care for themselves or pose a threat to the community because of their mental illness, they should be institutionalized and treated. If they are able to be released into the community after a period of time, checks should be performed to ensure compliance with treatment/medication.
- 47635274172635 23d ago
  I think you need to fix the cause not treat the symptom. I mean you should treat the symptoms as well, while fixing the cause of the issue. Atm it seems everyone is trying to figure out how to treat the symptom, and they don't even know why, and they keep completely quiet about the cause of it all. Completely and utter mystery, or framed vague and unfixable enough that they do not have to really address it. What the Swiss did back in the 80's with the heroin program...that's misinterpreted by US and they're specifically trying to mess it up in application. The Swiss didn't just give lab grade heroin to junkies, they ran a serious mental care and social reintegration program and used the heroin as basically bait. You had access to it but you had to go to their facilities where specialized people could start working with you. What the US is doing is a mockery of that, they want it to fail so they can say it's not working and they shouldn't even try it in the future. And I think it's quite clear to basically anyone with two neurons what the cause of it is, but authorities there are going to pretend they do not understand it. That it's some mystical unexplainable cause.
  - alex43578 23d ago
    Right now, many places in the US aren’t even “treating the symptoms”. We can start there, then move to address the more structural, long-term problems that contribute to these issues. An action that reduces drug use by 5% a decade from now is fine, but taking a criminal off the street today yields far greater present value.
- remarkEon 23d ago

kraken_cult 23d ago

Forced rehab if needed and then somewhere they can work to pay their way, learn the skills to help themselves. There's a ton of manual labor that needs doing, potholes to be fixed.

csullivannet 23d ago
Oh, so forced labour then?
- qwerpy 23d ago
  If someone’s forcing society to pay for their living expenses, it only seems fair for society to force them to labor to cover the expenses. I’m sure the next objection will be “what, so you’re going to concentrate them in some kind of camp?” Yes because that’s the smart thing to do with a large scale problem. Use scalable solutions.
  - mrguyorama 22d ago
    >If someone’s forcing society to pay for their living expenses, But the mentally unwell person didn't force society to pay for their living expenses. Society decided it couldn't stand them living their life the way they were and locked them up. Society pays for locking people up because it is done for the benefit of society. The point is that a functioning society is more productive than an unorganized one, and so can afford to do that kind of thing.

Dylan16807 23d ago

If they're doing lots of vandalism then yes put them in prisons. Get rid of 90% of drug charges to make room. You get a much better score if the imprisonment is trying to rehab them, of course.

alex43578 23d ago

If they are committing crimes, they should be imprisoned for an appropriate period of time as a deterrent to crime, a punishment for their actions, and to facilitate rehabilitation (even though evidence shows this doesn't really happen). If they are mentally ill and unable to care for themselves or pose a threat to the community because of their mental illness, they should be institutionalized and treated. If they are able to be released into the community after a period of time, checks should be performed to ensure compliance with treatment/medication.

47635274172635 23d ago
I think you need to fix the cause not treat the symptom. I mean you should treat the symptoms as well, while fixing the cause of the issue. Atm it seems everyone is trying to figure out how to treat the symptom, and they don't even know why, and they keep completely quiet about the cause of it all. Completely and utter mystery, or framed vague and unfixable enough that they do not have to really address it. What the Swiss did back in the 80's with the heroin program...that's misinterpreted by US and they're specifically trying to mess it up in application. The Swiss didn't just give lab grade heroin to junkies, they ran a serious mental care and social reintegration program and used the heroin as basically bait. You had access to it but you had to go to their facilities where specialized people could start working with you. What the US is doing is a mockery of that, they want it to fail so they can say it's not working and they shouldn't even try it in the future. And I think it's quite clear to basically anyone with two neurons what the cause of it is, but authorities there are going to pretend they do not understand it. That it's some mystical unexplainable cause.
- alex43578 23d ago
  Right now, many places in the US aren’t even “treating the symptoms”. We can start there, then move to address the more structural, long-term problems that contribute to these issues. An action that reduces drug use by 5% a decade from now is fine, but taking a criminal off the street today yields far greater present value.
remarkEon 23d ago