6 ms·

The point is end to end type safety. Whether that is worth the tradeoff of losing direct developer access to the db primitives is another question.

whattheheckheck 1mo ago
I agree with end to end type safety but that needs more details to sell what problem its solving. Folks dont buy it for itself
groundzeros2015 1mo ago
SQL is end to end type safe.
- bazoom42 1mo ago
  Isn’t sql weakly typed? Or does this depend on the engine?
  - groundzeros2015 1mo ago
    SQLite is the only one I know of that doesn’t enforce types by default, but I don’t know what the SQL spec requires.
  - pjmlp 29d ago
    No it is strongly typed, there is no accident that all PL extensions to the base query language have such a Ada/Pascal similarity. Additional DML has plenty of options to enforce rules that keep data consistency. While they make the life harder to delete/update/insert items in specific sequences, they can save the day on bad queries.
    - bazoom42 29d ago
      What happens if a query compares a string to a number?
      - mike_hearn 29d ago
        You get a type error from the database.
        bazoom42 29d ago
        As far as I can tell, some engines will implicitly coerce types so “7” = 7
        moljac024 28d ago
        But when do you get that type error? This is the important bit. You get it after the app is deployed, the query is ran and a result is expected. When do I get a type error from my language if it's statically typed? That's right, before I even deploy.
- sharno 1mo ago
  Which end? This moves one end to reach frontend code
- victorbjorklund 1mo ago
  Only backend to database. This is talking about typesafe from database - backend - frontend.
  - groundzeros2015 29d ago
    Yes, and that’s an architectural choice you’re making. Instead of using all the consistencies provided in the database process - including types, but also date/time, constraints, transactions, triggers etc. you are exiting the system and losing all guarantees. This system also doesn’t solve that problem.
  - rzmmm 29d ago
    You can write raw sql and use the "describe" clause in script, and then generate code with the result. This gives full db-backend-frontend type safety with raw sql queries
- fulafel 29d ago
  They might mean static typing in queries.

whattheheckheck 1mo ago

I agree with end to end type safety but that needs more details to sell what problem its solving. Folks dont buy it for itself

groundzeros2015 1mo ago

SQL is end to end type safe.

bazoom42 1mo ago
Isn’t sql weakly typed? Or does this depend on the engine?
- groundzeros2015 1mo ago
  SQLite is the only one I know of that doesn’t enforce types by default, but I don’t know what the SQL spec requires.
- pjmlp 29d ago
  No it is strongly typed, there is no accident that all PL extensions to the base query language have such a Ada/Pascal similarity. Additional DML has plenty of options to enforce rules that keep data consistency. While they make the life harder to delete/update/insert items in specific sequences, they can save the day on bad queries.
  - bazoom42 29d ago
    What happens if a query compares a string to a number?
    - mike_hearn 29d ago
      You get a type error from the database.
      - bazoom42 29d ago
        As far as I can tell, some engines will implicitly coerce types so “7” = 7
      - moljac024 28d ago
        But when do you get that type error? This is the important bit. You get it after the app is deployed, the query is ran and a result is expected. When do I get a type error from my language if it's statically typed? That's right, before I even deploy.
sharno 1mo ago
Which end? This moves one end to reach frontend code
victorbjorklund 1mo ago
Only backend to database. This is talking about typesafe from database - backend - frontend.
- groundzeros2015 29d ago
  Yes, and that’s an architectural choice you’re making. Instead of using all the consistencies provided in the database process - including types, but also date/time, constraints, transactions, triggers etc. you are exiting the system and losing all guarantees. This system also doesn’t solve that problem.
- rzmmm 29d ago
  You can write raw sql and use the "describe" clause in script, and then generate code with the result. This gives full db-backend-frontend type safety with raw sql queries
fulafel 29d ago
They might mean static typing in queries.