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The problem is that there's not just one "user". Tons of people have used GIMP for decades and are use to how it works - so changes to be less "user-hostile" ca

The problem is that there's not just one "user". Tons of people have used GIMP for decades and are use to how it works - so changes to be less "user-hostile" can make it hostile to existing users. For instance, we were repeatedly told that copy+paste creating a floating selection instead of a new layer was confusing and aggravating for users. So we changed it in 3.0 to make a new layer like other software. While we got praise from some people, we started getting new complaints that we'd broken people's workflow (see https://www.reddit.com/r/GIMP/comments/1vmrza2/it_is_not_straightforward_process/ https://www.reddit.com/r/GIMP/comments/1vmrza2/it_is_not_str... for a wide range of user feedback as one example) That doesn't mean we don't try to improve things (obligatory link to our user design feedback site: https://gitlab.gnome.org/Teams/GIMP/Design/gimp-ux/-/work_items https://gitlab.gnome.org/Teams/GIMP/Design/gimp-ux/-/work_it...), but making big changes is difficult when you have an existing user base who are using your software successfully as-is.

gamblor956 1mo ago
Consider that the overwhelming majority of this thread on a tech-focused forum have issues with the UI. That should tell you something about how ridiculously illogical the UI is compared to every other program in the space. GIMP has been catering to the extremely tiny niche of people who "successfully" use its software since at least the Slashdot days. And it's remained a niche product while all of its competitors in the opensource space have grown.
- cmyk_student 1mo ago
  It may not be quite as niche as people think: https://fosstodon.org/@GIMP@floss.social/116674728764606215 https://fosstodon.org/@GIMP@floss.social/116674728764606215 To your first point, it's difficult to know people's frame of reference online. I've listened to many complaints on forums, only to find out the person was thinking of older versions of GIMP and it no longer applied (like multi-window mode being default, outlining text being an ordeal, etc). We also see plenty of feedback like https://lemmy.world/post/50729195/25325527 https://lemmy.world/post/50729195/25325527, so it's not always easy to figure what's universally illogical. I'm not deflecting or saying that GIMP's UI is perfect the way it is - there's a lot of improvements I want to make to the non-destructive filter UI alone. But we can see that real people use the software for real work, so we try to keep existing users in mind when making UI improvements since it impacts them and what they do. There's been some well intentioned UI/UX requests I've implemented that ended up breaking a lot of people's workflows, and those still weigh on my soul. :) (Obligatory plug for our UX tracker if you feel like providing specifics on UI problems you've encountered: https://gitlab.gnome.org/Teams/GIMP/Design/gimp-ux/-/work_items https://gitlab.gnome.org/Teams/GIMP/Design/gimp-ux/-/work_it...)

gamblor956 1mo ago

Consider that the overwhelming majority of this thread on a tech-focused forum have issues with the UI. That should tell you something about how ridiculously illogical the UI is compared to every other program in the space. GIMP has been catering to the extremely tiny niche of people who "successfully" use its software since at least the Slashdot days. And it's remained a niche product while all of its competitors in the opensource space have grown.

cmyk_student 1mo ago
It may not be quite as niche as people think: https://fosstodon.org/@GIMP@floss.social/116674728764606215 https://fosstodon.org/@GIMP@floss.social/116674728764606215 To your first point, it's difficult to know people's frame of reference online. I've listened to many complaints on forums, only to find out the person was thinking of older versions of GIMP and it no longer applied (like multi-window mode being default, outlining text being an ordeal, etc). We also see plenty of feedback like https://lemmy.world/post/50729195/25325527 https://lemmy.world/post/50729195/25325527, so it's not always easy to figure what's universally illogical. I'm not deflecting or saying that GIMP's UI is perfect the way it is - there's a lot of improvements I want to make to the non-destructive filter UI alone. But we can see that real people use the software for real work, so we try to keep existing users in mind when making UI improvements since it impacts them and what they do. There's been some well intentioned UI/UX requests I've implemented that ended up breaking a lot of people's workflows, and those still weigh on my soul. :) (Obligatory plug for our UX tracker if you feel like providing specifics on UI problems you've encountered: https://gitlab.gnome.org/Teams/GIMP/Design/gimp-ux/-/work_items https://gitlab.gnome.org/Teams/GIMP/Design/gimp-ux/-/work_it...)