5 ms·

It is quite funny an EU company patenting a software feature that is basically unpatentable in EU in the US. Clearly this is an attempt to prevent similar pate

by Roark66 1mo ago

It is quite funny an EU company patenting a software feature that is basically unpatentable in EU in the US. Clearly this is an attempt to prevent similar patents from being weaponised against them in the US. No one cares about such stuff in Europe.

david_draco 1mo ago
Unfortunately patent offices are using loopholes that reintroduce software patents. Patent law says that a pure software patent is not possible, it has to be combined with a specific hardware application to make it an invention. So they fill in a patent for "XX implemented on a hardware operating on land, in the air, in space, on, or under water.". That's essentially a software patent.
- Balooga 1mo ago
  > operating on land, in the air, in space, on, or under water Thunderbirds are Go! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D_mBUaPsX6o https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D_mBUaPsX6o
- speedgoose 1mo ago
  That sounds like patent trolls shenanigans.
- TeMPOraL 1mo ago
  > So they fill in a patent for "XX implemented on a hardware operating on land, in the air, in space, on, or under water.". I'm glad my servers are operating in a deep undersea cave.
st_goliath 1mo ago
You may have heard about a little thing called MP3? Basically, Fraunhofer in Germany filed for (software) patents in the US. They made sure to wait some time for MP3 to become a thing before they started going after people and collect royalties. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MP3#Licensing,_ownership,_and_legislation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MP3#Licensing,_ownership,_and_...
- ffsm8 1mo ago
  Ha, you're misremembering, but it's been a long time so I don't begrudge you. Fraunhofer is a research institution. They didn't really do licencing, that's why they never went after anyone. Then Thomson joined the venture (wouldn't you know it, French!) and the fun with litigation got started Not trying to protect Frauenhofer there at all, if they didn't smell opportunity they wouldn't have teamed up with Thomson after all... But I think the trend is very clear. Germans are generally a lot worse at the litigation game then the french. Historically that makes sense, but it's definitely surprising that it still holds true in modern times
  - _fizz_buzz_ 1mo ago
    Fraunhofer absolutely does licensing. That is one of their main sources of income. Also,your retelling of the story is off: https://www.4ipcouncil.com/features/mp3-digital-audio-coding https://www.4ipcouncil.com/features/mp3-digital-audio-coding
    - ffsm8 1mo ago
      I think you didn't understand what I was trying to say. Fraunhofer didn't do licencing before joining up with Thomson. That's why - back in the 90s - there were no litigation anywhere even though everyone ignored their patents. Then Frauenhofer joined up with Thomson and that's where your understanding joins up with reality: now the Frauenhofer does licencing and sues anyone that's not paying them. My whole comment was a technical tidbit - maybe meaningless from today's perspective... But the previous view interpreted a forward thinking strategy with the monetization of mp3 that just wasn't there
      - _fizz_buzz_ 1mo ago
        I feel your argument is shifting. Also, it was Fraunhofer that was threatening developers at the end of the 90s not Thomson. Fraunhofer will very aggressively defend their patents/licenses.
jjice 1mo ago
> Clearly this is an attempt to prevent similar patents from being weaponised against them in the US. Why do we assume that Mistral is a "good guy" protecting themselves? I'm not sure they necessarily are. Could just be trying to grab any ground they can. I mean, maybe they are the "good guy", but I don't think we know either way.
- tmgldn 1mo ago
  I mean they have a healthy dollop of US VC private investment, so good guys is off the cards - but in relative terms, they seem to follow the law, which in Silicon Valley is certainly not a given.
- oefrha 1mo ago
  Even if it’s good now, three to five years down the line there’s a 50% chance it’s sold for scraps and this may end up in the hands of a patent troll.

by Roark66 1mo ago

david_draco 1mo ago

Unfortunately patent offices are using loopholes that reintroduce software patents. Patent law says that a pure software patent is not possible, it has to be combined with a specific hardware application to make it an invention. So they fill in a patent for "XX implemented on a hardware operating on land, in the air, in space, on, or under water.". That's essentially a software patent.

Balooga 1mo ago
> operating on land, in the air, in space, on, or under water Thunderbirds are Go! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D_mBUaPsX6o https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D_mBUaPsX6o
speedgoose 1mo ago
That sounds like patent trolls shenanigans.
TeMPOraL 1mo ago
> So they fill in a patent for "XX implemented on a hardware operating on land, in the air, in space, on, or under water.". I'm glad my servers are operating in a deep undersea cave.

st_goliath 1mo ago

You may have heard about a little thing called MP3? Basically, Fraunhofer in Germany filed for (software) patents in the US. They made sure to wait some time for MP3 to become a thing before they started going after people and collect royalties. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MP3#Licensing,_ownership,_and_legislation https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MP3#Licensing,_ownership,_and_...

ffsm8 1mo ago
Ha, you're misremembering, but it's been a long time so I don't begrudge you. Fraunhofer is a research institution. They didn't really do licencing, that's why they never went after anyone. Then Thomson joined the venture (wouldn't you know it, French!) and the fun with litigation got started Not trying to protect Frauenhofer there at all, if they didn't smell opportunity they wouldn't have teamed up with Thomson after all... But I think the trend is very clear. Germans are generally a lot worse at the litigation game then the french. Historically that makes sense, but it's definitely surprising that it still holds true in modern times
- _fizz_buzz_ 1mo ago
  Fraunhofer absolutely does licensing. That is one of their main sources of income. Also,your retelling of the story is off: https://www.4ipcouncil.com/features/mp3-digital-audio-coding https://www.4ipcouncil.com/features/mp3-digital-audio-coding
  - ffsm8 1mo ago
    I think you didn't understand what I was trying to say. Fraunhofer didn't do licencing before joining up with Thomson. That's why - back in the 90s - there were no litigation anywhere even though everyone ignored their patents. Then Frauenhofer joined up with Thomson and that's where your understanding joins up with reality: now the Frauenhofer does licencing and sues anyone that's not paying them. My whole comment was a technical tidbit - maybe meaningless from today's perspective... But the previous view interpreted a forward thinking strategy with the monetization of mp3 that just wasn't there
    - _fizz_buzz_ 1mo ago
      I feel your argument is shifting. Also, it was Fraunhofer that was threatening developers at the end of the 90s not Thomson. Fraunhofer will very aggressively defend their patents/licenses.

jjice 1mo ago

> Clearly this is an attempt to prevent similar patents from being weaponised against them in the US. Why do we assume that Mistral is a "good guy" protecting themselves? I'm not sure they necessarily are. Could just be trying to grab any ground they can. I mean, maybe they are the "good guy", but I don't think we know either way.

tmgldn 1mo ago
I mean they have a healthy dollop of US VC private investment, so good guys is off the cards - but in relative terms, they seem to follow the law, which in Silicon Valley is certainly not a given.
oefrha 1mo ago
Even if it’s good now, three to five years down the line there’s a 50% chance it’s sold for scraps and this may end up in the hands of a patent troll.