7 ms·

Counterpoint, industry cyber security is so generally weak, if there were actually a secret "huge cold cyber war" on-going, we'd see real world impact. Since w

by cco 1mo ago

Counterpoint, industry cyber security is so generally weak, if there were actually a secret "huge cold cyber war" on-going, we'd see real world impact. Since we don't, it probably isn't happening.

nullpoint420 1mo ago
I mean, isn't that all counter-intelligence? They wouldn't want to be seen?
- deadbabe 1mo ago
  The entire US powergrid is so vulnerable right now, if there really was a cyber cold war the entire thing could be shut off overnight probably. Given that it's not happening, then it's probably just not a thing.
  - CircuitSeuss 1mo ago
    It’s definitely happening. https://www.cisa.gov/news-events/cybersecurity-advisories?f%5B0%5D=advisory_type%3A94 https://www.cisa.gov/news-events/cybersecurity-advisories?f%... Don’t mistake prepositioning for “not happening.” As you said: “cyber cold war” means there are a lot of incentives not to reveal capabilities or trigger escalation from your adversaries. https://www.cisa.gov/news-events/cybersecurity-advisories/aa26-097a https://www.cisa.gov/news-events/cybersecurity-advisories/aa... Although, that is changing as we continue to escalate. https://www.cisa.gov/news-events/news/cisa-fbi-epa-and-us-government-partners-update-warning-iran-affiliated-threat-actors-targeting https://www.cisa.gov/news-events/news/cisa-fbi-epa-and-us-go... If you’re not convinced the threat is real and the cyber warfare is happening, I highly recommend checking out Nocole Perleoth’s To Catch a Thief. S1E7 is especially relevent: Everything Everywhere All at Once. https://www.rubrik.com/lp/to-catch-a-thief-podcast https://www.rubrik.com/lp/to-catch-a-thief-podcast
    - deadbabe 1mo ago
      Where?
      - singingtoday 1mo ago
        Here. There. Over there too.
  - deleted 1mo ago
    [deleted]
impossiblefork 1mo ago
I like the argument and it seems valid, but I have heard the opposite from people working in commercial cybersecurity.
- 0xdeadbeefbabe 1mo ago
  People who work in commercial cybersecurity might have a vested interest in looking like warriors at least.
  - impossiblefork 1mo ago
    I don't think these did. They'd also quit because they felt it was too much work, now that the cybersecurity situation had gone mad.
    - impossiblefork 1mo ago
      Correction: One person had quit cybersecurity due to exploding workload due to a changing threat situation.
DaiPlusPlus 1mo ago
> Counterpoint, industry cyber security is so generally weak, if there were actually a secret "huge cold cyber war" on-going, we'd see real world impact. But we do: ransomware stories are in the news all the time; while they likely aren’t being directly executed by the Russian or Chinese governments they are being allowed to happen because they aid state interests: for example, https://www.cisa.gov/news-events/cybersecurity-advisories/aa22-110a https://www.cisa.gov/news-events/cybersecurity-advisories/aa... …or more insidiously: political influence campaigns, which are very much a cyber concern, and even easier to deny.
skitsofrandom 1mo ago
There are a lot of documented small scale hacks on American infrastructure by state actors. The prevailing theory I have heard was that the point is to find as many vulnerabilities in our internet-connected critical infrastructure, then sit on it until it’s needed. It doesn’t make news when a few water tanks overflow in a random tiny Texas city, but the principle is that these kinds of exploits may generalize to the infra of major cities. Example: https://texasstandard.org/stories/russian-hackers-muleshoe-texas-water-system-hale-center-rural/ https://texasstandard.org/stories/russian-hackers-muleshoe-t... So there is no need for a highly visible active cyber war. We have tons of cyber professionals working on this stuff day in and day out to help keep up prepared.

by cco 1mo ago

Counterpoint, industry cyber security is so generally weak, if there were actually a secret "huge cold cyber war" on-going, we'd see real world impact. Since we don't, it probably isn't happening.

nullpoint420 1mo ago

I mean, isn't that all counter-intelligence? They wouldn't want to be seen?

deadbabe 1mo ago
The entire US powergrid is so vulnerable right now, if there really was a cyber cold war the entire thing could be shut off overnight probably. Given that it's not happening, then it's probably just not a thing.
- CircuitSeuss 1mo ago
  It’s definitely happening. https://www.cisa.gov/news-events/cybersecurity-advisories?f%5B0%5D=advisory_type%3A94 https://www.cisa.gov/news-events/cybersecurity-advisories?f%... Don’t mistake prepositioning for “not happening.” As you said: “cyber cold war” means there are a lot of incentives not to reveal capabilities or trigger escalation from your adversaries. https://www.cisa.gov/news-events/cybersecurity-advisories/aa26-097a https://www.cisa.gov/news-events/cybersecurity-advisories/aa... Although, that is changing as we continue to escalate. https://www.cisa.gov/news-events/news/cisa-fbi-epa-and-us-government-partners-update-warning-iran-affiliated-threat-actors-targeting https://www.cisa.gov/news-events/news/cisa-fbi-epa-and-us-go... If you’re not convinced the threat is real and the cyber warfare is happening, I highly recommend checking out Nocole Perleoth’s To Catch a Thief. S1E7 is especially relevent: Everything Everywhere All at Once. https://www.rubrik.com/lp/to-catch-a-thief-podcast https://www.rubrik.com/lp/to-catch-a-thief-podcast
  - deadbabe 1mo ago
    Where?
    - singingtoday 1mo ago
      Here. There. Over there too.
- deleted 1mo ago
  [deleted]

impossiblefork 1mo ago

I like the argument and it seems valid, but I have heard the opposite from people working in commercial cybersecurity.

0xdeadbeefbabe 1mo ago
People who work in commercial cybersecurity might have a vested interest in looking like warriors at least.
- impossiblefork 1mo ago
  I don't think these did. They'd also quit because they felt it was too much work, now that the cybersecurity situation had gone mad.
  - impossiblefork 1mo ago
    Correction: One person had quit cybersecurity due to exploding workload due to a changing threat situation.

DaiPlusPlus 1mo ago

> Counterpoint, industry cyber security is so generally weak, if there were actually a secret "huge cold cyber war" on-going, we'd see real world impact. But we do: ransomware stories are in the news all the time; while they likely aren’t being directly executed by the Russian or Chinese governments they are being allowed to happen because they aid state interests: for example, https://www.cisa.gov/news-events/cybersecurity-advisories/aa22-110a https://www.cisa.gov/news-events/cybersecurity-advisories/aa... …or more insidiously: political influence campaigns, which are very much a cyber concern, and even easier to deny.

skitsofrandom 1mo ago

There are a lot of documented small scale hacks on American infrastructure by state actors. The prevailing theory I have heard was that the point is to find as many vulnerabilities in our internet-connected critical infrastructure, then sit on it until it’s needed. It doesn’t make news when a few water tanks overflow in a random tiny Texas city, but the principle is that these kinds of exploits may generalize to the infra of major cities. Example: https://texasstandard.org/stories/russian-hackers-muleshoe-texas-water-system-hale-center-rural/ https://texasstandard.org/stories/russian-hackers-muleshoe-t... So there is no need for a highly visible active cyber war. We have tons of cyber professionals working on this stuff day in and day out to help keep up prepared.