7 ms·

It tells me the way they measure 'livable' is wrong. Given the choice, most people would choose to be in any one of those over where ever they are now, and the

It tells me the way they measure 'livable' is wrong. Given the choice, most people would choose to be in any one of those over where ever they are now, and the cities on 'most livable' lists.

seanmcdirmid 1mo ago
Those top 20 livable lists are always pretty narrowly defined though. They’ll mention some pricey cities in Switzerland for sure, and for forget the poor slouches that have to commute into Bern from Freiburg.
- holgerschurig 1mo ago
  > They’ll mention some pricey cities in Switzerland The thing is that these cities aren't pricy for swiss people, with a swiss pay-cheque (err, direct bank-to-bank money transmit). It's all a result of decades long higher inflation there, that now has this extreme price difference. And with prices did their wages increase ... but not yours, visiting Switzerland. At least the country is so small you can just drive through. You don't need to go into one of their supermarket and see that all the stuff is 2x as costly as north, east, west or south of it ... But yeah, prices play probably a huge role in this "livability" index. Zürich (Zurich) is at place 3, while Wien (Vienna) is at 2. And I guess this has something to do with the spectacular low flat rents in Wien. They have lots of non-profit cooperatives that own the houses and take rent so that they can refurbish the houses and build new ones (1/4 of all flats in Austria is build by such cooperatives). All over Austria, 16% of all flats/houses are owned by them. But I guess in Wien it's even higher. There are comparison sites that say that in München (Munich) you pay in average 1249 € for rent, while in Wien it is 872 €. Okay, I select the most expensive german town, so maybe this is rigged. But even with capital vs. capital Wien is cheaper. https://stadtkosten.de/vergleich/munchen-vs-wien https://stadtkosten.de/vergleich/munchen-vs-wien https://stadtkosten.de/vergleich/berlin-vs-wien https://stadtkosten.de/vergleich/berlin-vs-wien The nicest town isn't "livable" if people can't live there because it's only for DINKS.
  - seanmcdirmid 1mo ago
    Those deals are only for locals though. If you move to Switzerland you need to pay. Actually, the same is true of any place with any kind of public housing or rent control, it’s a sticky advantage. Having been subjected to the Swiss rental market before, it is stressful for outsiders. I wonder if the USA will go down the same route eventually.
ahartmetz 1mo ago
How'd you measure 'livable'? 1. income, 2-n crickets?
foco_tubi 1mo ago
That isn’t anywhere close to the definition of livable though

It tells me the way they measure 'livable' is wrong. Given the choice, most people would choose to be in any one of those over where ever they are now, and the cities on 'most livable' lists.

seanmcdirmid 1mo ago

Those top 20 livable lists are always pretty narrowly defined though. They’ll mention some pricey cities in Switzerland for sure, and for forget the poor slouches that have to commute into Bern from Freiburg.

holgerschurig 1mo ago
> They’ll mention some pricey cities in Switzerland The thing is that these cities aren't pricy for swiss people, with a swiss pay-cheque (err, direct bank-to-bank money transmit). It's all a result of decades long higher inflation there, that now has this extreme price difference. And with prices did their wages increase ... but not yours, visiting Switzerland. At least the country is so small you can just drive through. You don't need to go into one of their supermarket and see that all the stuff is 2x as costly as north, east, west or south of it ... But yeah, prices play probably a huge role in this "livability" index. Zürich (Zurich) is at place 3, while Wien (Vienna) is at 2. And I guess this has something to do with the spectacular low flat rents in Wien. They have lots of non-profit cooperatives that own the houses and take rent so that they can refurbish the houses and build new ones (1/4 of all flats in Austria is build by such cooperatives). All over Austria, 16% of all flats/houses are owned by them. But I guess in Wien it's even higher. There are comparison sites that say that in München (Munich) you pay in average 1249 € for rent, while in Wien it is 872 €. Okay, I select the most expensive german town, so maybe this is rigged. But even with capital vs. capital Wien is cheaper. https://stadtkosten.de/vergleich/munchen-vs-wien https://stadtkosten.de/vergleich/munchen-vs-wien https://stadtkosten.de/vergleich/berlin-vs-wien https://stadtkosten.de/vergleich/berlin-vs-wien The nicest town isn't "livable" if people can't live there because it's only for DINKS.
- seanmcdirmid 1mo ago
  Those deals are only for locals though. If you move to Switzerland you need to pay. Actually, the same is true of any place with any kind of public housing or rent control, it’s a sticky advantage. Having been subjected to the Swiss rental market before, it is stressful for outsiders. I wonder if the USA will go down the same route eventually.

ahartmetz 1mo ago

How'd you measure 'livable'? 1. income, 2-n crickets?

foco_tubi 1mo ago

That isn’t anywhere close to the definition of livable though