6 ms·

It’s perfectly fine for the “West” to influence the world though, right? Or is it only a problem because… they’re Chinese?

by riskd 2mo ago

youre-wrong3 2mo ago
Have you got examples of GPT/Claude/Grok influencing people?
- hetman 2mo ago
  I think there's no denying they each have an ideological bent (as is their right as private companies). I have had Copilot deny me access to historical information on ethical grounds, even though I don't think anyone would find it controversial (clearly it was overtuned, GPT and Claude had no problem answering the same question). What is different though is that they are each allowed to have their own perspective instead of a singular mandated one.
  - youre-wrong3 2mo ago
    That was guard rails in the harness. Not the model. We are talking about baking it into the model. Denying to do something is also very different to changing historical facts like China does.
    - damontal 2mo ago
      You are splitting hairs. End result is the same.
      - kortilla 2mo ago
        No it’s not. Saying “I won’t talk about how to make bombs” is not the same as “the holocaust didn’t happen”.
    - MSFT_Edging 2mo ago
      > very different to changing historical facts like China does. Oh but they're trying. The right-wing usage of things like "woke" and "DEI" primarily serve to hide/destroy historical realities. [1] Florida has it's "STOP WOKE" act that forces teachers to talk about how slaves learned skills/benefited from slavery[2] and that various massacres also had black perpetrators. What is this other than changing historical facts? About fucking chattel slavery for Christ's sake. [1] https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2026/jun/12/judge-national-park-trump-displays https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2026/jun/12/judge-nation... [2] https://www.nea.org/nea-today/all-news-articles/floridas-new-history-standard-blow-our-students-and-nation https://www.nea.org/nea-today/all-news-articles/floridas-new...
      - nixon_why69 2mo ago
        And also, not taking a side here, plenty of woke partisans valued righteousness over truth in the 2020 era. The 1619 project which was a whole NYT backed big thing had a bunch of factual errors. The real rub is when you get into "shared facts" that Americans were all taught in high school civics but the rest of the world wasn't. If you've mostly been in America, it can seem like someone's deliberately lying about history but they simply weren't properly educated with the Correct Interpretation.
      - kortilla 2mo ago
        > and that various massacres also had black perpetrators. the implication of your message is that this is not true
- BoorishBears 2mo ago
  https://i.imgur.com/3zWdJpz.png https://i.imgur.com/3zWdJpz.png vs https://i.imgur.com/ta6g1d2.png https://i.imgur.com/ta6g1d2.png
- rhdunn 2mo ago
  1. https://www.uea.ac.uk/about/news/article/fresh-evidence-of-chatgpts-political-bias-revealed-by-comprehensive-new-study https://www.uea.ac.uk/about/news/article/fresh-evidence-of-c... -- (2023) Fresh evidence of ChatGPTs political bias revealed by comprehensive new study 2. https://www.ox.ac.uk/news/2026-01-20-new-study-finds-chatgpt-amplifies-global-inequalities https://www.ox.ac.uk/news/2026-01-20-new-study-finds-chatgpt... -- (2026) New study finds that ChatGPT amplifies global inequalities 3. https://stevepavlina.com/blog/2026/03/chatgpts-political-bias/ https://stevepavlina.com/blog/2026/03/chatgpts-political-bia... -- (2026) ChatGPT’s Political Bias 4. https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC10623051/ https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC10623051/ -- (2023) Revisiting the political biases of ChatGPT 5. https://www.theverge.com/2024/2/21/24079371/google-ai-gemini-generative-inaccurate-historical https://www.theverge.com/2024/2/21/24079371/google-ai-gemini... -- (2024) Google apologizes for ‘missing the mark’ after Gemini generated racially diverse Nazis
- xmcp123 2mo ago
  A major thing I noticed is that trying to get ChatGPT to say something negative about Sam Altman is like pulling teeth. Pure speculation, but I would wager it has a direction somewhere to use OpenAI as authoritative about anything related to OpenAI - arguably for help docs and whatnot. But the impact does stay the same.
- phantompeace 2mo ago
  Why did you mention Grok, because it undermines your argument. https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2025/may/16/elon-musks-ai-firm-blames-unauthorised-change-for-chatbots-rant-about-white-genocide https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2025/may/16/elon-musk... https://www.trtworld.com/article/24cbdb873a6b https://www.trtworld.com/article/24cbdb873a6b
hetman 2mo ago
Why would it be a problem that they're Chinese? It's a problem because their country is ruled by an authoritarian regime. The West, by contrast, doesn't have a singular arbiter of truth, it has a plurality of perspectives (as much as certain interest groups would really rather that was not the case). It's not perfect, but those of us who have memories of living under authoritarian regimes can tell you there's no comparison.
- BoredomIsFun 2mo ago
  West has though a history of supporting regimes far more hideous than Chinese, and ready to push narrative whenever possible. It is well known idea BTW in political thought that democracies are far more reliant on propaganda for control than authoritarian,which due to their strong grip on political discourse do not need high quality propaganda anyway. TLDR: American propaganda is not any better than Chinese, neither have the best interests of my country in their minds.
- podgorniy 2mo ago
  > It's a problem because their country is ruled by an authoritarian regime Hey, have you seeing what trump does with your (presumably) country? Maybe wars? Maybe market manipulation? Mayde pedo right covering on the government level? Maybe bubbles and threats to EU? What an ignorance. You live with old stories, not the current state of the world...
  - burnerRhodov3 2mo ago
    This is absolutely nothing compared to what China did to the Uyghurs, or China cutting citizens off of the financial system (WeChat) due to posting political content... If you were in China, you would be blacklisted for posting a similiar comment on wechat. If you openly called the CCP a group of pedo's you'd regret it within 24 hours.
    - herbst 2mo ago
      If you post content like this you likely to get refused entering the US. I realize it doesn't apply to US citizens but it's also not like everyone can say what they want and get away with it.

It’s perfectly fine for the “West” to influence the world though, right? Or is it only a problem because… they’re Chinese?

by riskd 2mo ago

It’s perfectly fine for the “West” to influence the world though, right? Or is it only a problem because… they’re Chinese?

youre-wrong3 2mo ago

Have you got examples of GPT/Claude/Grok influencing people?

hetman 2mo ago
I think there's no denying they each have an ideological bent (as is their right as private companies). I have had Copilot deny me access to historical information on ethical grounds, even though I don't think anyone would find it controversial (clearly it was overtuned, GPT and Claude had no problem answering the same question). What is different though is that they are each allowed to have their own perspective instead of a singular mandated one.
- youre-wrong3 2mo ago
  That was guard rails in the harness. Not the model. We are talking about baking it into the model. Denying to do something is also very different to changing historical facts like China does.
  - damontal 2mo ago
    You are splitting hairs. End result is the same.
    - kortilla 2mo ago
      No it’s not. Saying “I won’t talk about how to make bombs” is not the same as “the holocaust didn’t happen”.
  - MSFT_Edging 2mo ago
    > very different to changing historical facts like China does. Oh but they're trying. The right-wing usage of things like "woke" and "DEI" primarily serve to hide/destroy historical realities. [1] Florida has it's "STOP WOKE" act that forces teachers to talk about how slaves learned skills/benefited from slavery[2] and that various massacres also had black perpetrators. What is this other than changing historical facts? About fucking chattel slavery for Christ's sake. [1] https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2026/jun/12/judge-national-park-trump-displays https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2026/jun/12/judge-nation... [2] https://www.nea.org/nea-today/all-news-articles/floridas-new-history-standard-blow-our-students-and-nation https://www.nea.org/nea-today/all-news-articles/floridas-new...
    - nixon_why69 2mo ago
      And also, not taking a side here, plenty of woke partisans valued righteousness over truth in the 2020 era. The 1619 project which was a whole NYT backed big thing had a bunch of factual errors. The real rub is when you get into "shared facts" that Americans were all taught in high school civics but the rest of the world wasn't. If you've mostly been in America, it can seem like someone's deliberately lying about history but they simply weren't properly educated with the Correct Interpretation.
    - kortilla 2mo ago
      > and that various massacres also had black perpetrators. the implication of your message is that this is not true
BoorishBears 2mo ago
https://i.imgur.com/3zWdJpz.png https://i.imgur.com/3zWdJpz.png vs https://i.imgur.com/ta6g1d2.png https://i.imgur.com/ta6g1d2.png
rhdunn 2mo ago
1. https://www.uea.ac.uk/about/news/article/fresh-evidence-of-chatgpts-political-bias-revealed-by-comprehensive-new-study https://www.uea.ac.uk/about/news/article/fresh-evidence-of-c... -- (2023) Fresh evidence of ChatGPTs political bias revealed by comprehensive new study 2. https://www.ox.ac.uk/news/2026-01-20-new-study-finds-chatgpt-amplifies-global-inequalities https://www.ox.ac.uk/news/2026-01-20-new-study-finds-chatgpt... -- (2026) New study finds that ChatGPT amplifies global inequalities 3. https://stevepavlina.com/blog/2026/03/chatgpts-political-bias/ https://stevepavlina.com/blog/2026/03/chatgpts-political-bia... -- (2026) ChatGPT’s Political Bias 4. https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC10623051/ https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC10623051/ -- (2023) Revisiting the political biases of ChatGPT 5. https://www.theverge.com/2024/2/21/24079371/google-ai-gemini-generative-inaccurate-historical https://www.theverge.com/2024/2/21/24079371/google-ai-gemini... -- (2024) Google apologizes for ‘missing the mark’ after Gemini generated racially diverse Nazis
xmcp123 2mo ago
A major thing I noticed is that trying to get ChatGPT to say something negative about Sam Altman is like pulling teeth. Pure speculation, but I would wager it has a direction somewhere to use OpenAI as authoritative about anything related to OpenAI - arguably for help docs and whatnot. But the impact does stay the same.
phantompeace 2mo ago
Why did you mention Grok, because it undermines your argument. https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2025/may/16/elon-musks-ai-firm-blames-unauthorised-change-for-chatbots-rant-about-white-genocide https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2025/may/16/elon-musk... https://www.trtworld.com/article/24cbdb873a6b https://www.trtworld.com/article/24cbdb873a6b

hetman 2mo ago

Why would it be a problem that they're Chinese? It's a problem because their country is ruled by an authoritarian regime. The West, by contrast, doesn't have a singular arbiter of truth, it has a plurality of perspectives (as much as certain interest groups would really rather that was not the case). It's not perfect, but those of us who have memories of living under authoritarian regimes can tell you there's no comparison.

BoredomIsFun 2mo ago
West has though a history of supporting regimes far more hideous than Chinese, and ready to push narrative whenever possible. It is well known idea BTW in political thought that democracies are far more reliant on propaganda for control than authoritarian,which due to their strong grip on political discourse do not need high quality propaganda anyway. TLDR: American propaganda is not any better than Chinese, neither have the best interests of my country in their minds.
podgorniy 2mo ago
> It's a problem because their country is ruled by an authoritarian regime Hey, have you seeing what trump does with your (presumably) country? Maybe wars? Maybe market manipulation? Mayde pedo right covering on the government level? Maybe bubbles and threats to EU? What an ignorance. You live with old stories, not the current state of the world...
- burnerRhodov3 2mo ago
  This is absolutely nothing compared to what China did to the Uyghurs, or China cutting citizens off of the financial system (WeChat) due to posting political content... If you were in China, you would be blacklisted for posting a similiar comment on wechat. If you openly called the CCP a group of pedo's you'd regret it within 24 hours.
  - herbst 2mo ago
    If you post content like this you likely to get refused entering the US. I realize it doesn't apply to US citizens but it's also not like everyone can say what they want and get away with it.