6 ms·

This, and other similar legislation, serve as a constant reminder of why the American founding fathers had to revolt against tyranny, and why constitution amend

by tasn 2mo ago

This, and other similar legislation, serve as a constant reminder of why the American founding fathers had to revolt against tyranny, and why constitution amendments like the 1st and 4th exist. The 4th in particular was written as a response to a British law similar to Chat Control (writs of assistance).

globular-toast 2mo ago
Sadly doesn't seem to make much difference, though. If anything the UK is less authoritarian than the US now.
- deleted 2mo ago
  [deleted]
- aliasxneo 2mo ago
  At least I have still have a 2nd amendment - and, at least for now, still post on social media without getting a knock on my door.
  - mrguyorama 2mo ago
    Tens of millions of Americans, usually supporters of the 2nd, have openly declared that having a firearm on you while at a protest is a crime punishable by death, and have done nothing to stand up against Trump, who has openly declared his hostility to the 2nd amendment multiple times now. Bringing a rifle to a protest you expect to get hot, brandishing it about, and then shooting someone in self defense is perfectly fine, but having an every day carry firearm, getting held down by the president's personal paramilitary org, and being shot execution style is apparently fine. I'm sick and tired of the stupid claims about how important the 2nd is while the very advocates of it only bring it up to talk about how much they want to shoot democrats.
    - aliasxneo 2mo ago
      There's idiots on all sides. Plenty of sane people who are too busy working and raising families instead of loudly participating in politics that still hold a balanced view on the subject. I can hold the situation you cited as an example that should be shown in training in how not to handle a situation like that while at the same time vehemently pushing back against the bureaucrats trying to disarm me. It's why I've always identified as an independent my whole life.
  - BeetleB 2mo ago
    > and, at least for now, still post on social media without getting a knock on my door. That's called "luck". A friend of mine did likewise, and got a knock, then handcuffs, then a trial. He was acquitted because everything he said was allowed under the first amendment. In fact, several academics had published the same/similar stuff he did and not had any problems (or ever worried about them). But he was of the wrong race/religion... There was never a time in the 20th-21st century where you can practice your 1st amendment rights and be absolutely sure you wouldn't get a knock on your door.
    - aliasxneo 2mo ago
      > That's called "luck". I think it's actually called statistics. In 2026, it would seem I'm statistically less likely to get arrested for a social media post in the US than the UK. I mean it's not like the reason is hidden. Arrests typically require crossing into narrow unprotected categories under the First Amendment: true threats (Virginia v. Black standard), incitement to imminent lawless action (Brandenburg v. Ohio), or specific crimes like credible harassment, cyberstalking, or extortion. It's quite a bit different than the UK's hate speech laws and the comparative result makes complete sense.
      - BeetleB 2mo ago
        Luck is statistical :-)
        aliasxneo 2mo ago
        Then we agree that it's not unreasonable for me to feel confident I am unlikely to get arrested in the US over a social media post than in the UK, which is the whole point I was making all along.
        BeetleB 2mo ago
        For you, yes. But not for some other folks in the US. If you want to invoke statistics, I'm sure 99% of UK citizens are confident they won't get arrested over a social media post either. They probably worry about it a lot less than you would if you moved there.
- simplyluke 2mo ago
  How many people are arrested for social media posts and other speech in each country?
  - kubb 2mo ago
    To be fair the other country routinely deploys military against citizens, and deports non-citizens for speech.
  - villish 2mo ago
    A guy was arrested for a joke he posted on social media about Charlie Kirk. He spent some time in jail but ended up winning a lawsuit. So the answer isn't exactly 0 in the US
  - foldr 2mo ago
    It's actually quite hard to say, as there are no official figures on arrests specifically for social media posts in either country. And lot of the specific cases that people point to in the UK (e.g. Lucy Connolly) have parallels in the US: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/may/18/facebook-comments-arrest-prosecution https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/may/18/facebook-com... https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cg7pyjxjxrvo https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cg7pyjxjxrvo https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/social-media/federal-agents-monitored-facebook-arrest-protesters-inciting-riots-court-records-n1231531 https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/social-media/federal-agents-mon... (The figures that the American right give for "arrests for social media posts" in the UK are actually figures from certain police forces for arrests under various pieces of online communication legislation, many of which have nothing to do with social media.)
- tryauuum 2mo ago
  It's hard to compare US and EU internet freedom because a person usually spends most of their life in one place and is clueless about the life in other. I've never lived in US, were there any cases of ISPs blocking websites in USA? Even DNS-level blocking counts
  - deleted 2mo ago
    [deleted]
  - tryauuum 2mo ago
    come on guys, stop upvoting me and answer the question please
  - tasn 2mo ago
    I've lived both in the US and the UK. The US has the 5th amendment protecting you from self-incrimination, while in the UK you can go to prison for not divulging your encryption password (even if you forgot it!). The US doesn't have ISP/DNS level blocking for all I'm aware of, but there's the ultimate blocking that sometimes does happen (FBI raiding your servers, even if outside of the US). The US has the 1st amendment protecting speech, while in the UK people routinely get arrested for social media posts. Maybe there are areas where the UK is better about privacy/freedom than the US, but no examples immediately come to mind.
ajsnigrutin 2mo ago
And then you got the patriot act.
- ibejoeb 2mo ago
  That was terrible. But then the NSA just started surveilling everything illegally anyway, laws be damned.
  - ajsnigrutin 2mo ago
    I was just pointing out that the 4th amendment is not really helping the americans with tyranny and all the related stuff :)

by tasn 2mo ago

globular-toast 2mo ago

Sadly doesn't seem to make much difference, though. If anything the UK is less authoritarian than the US now.

deleted 2mo ago
[deleted]
aliasxneo 2mo ago
At least I have still have a 2nd amendment - and, at least for now, still post on social media without getting a knock on my door.
- mrguyorama 2mo ago
  Tens of millions of Americans, usually supporters of the 2nd, have openly declared that having a firearm on you while at a protest is a crime punishable by death, and have done nothing to stand up against Trump, who has openly declared his hostility to the 2nd amendment multiple times now. Bringing a rifle to a protest you expect to get hot, brandishing it about, and then shooting someone in self defense is perfectly fine, but having an every day carry firearm, getting held down by the president's personal paramilitary org, and being shot execution style is apparently fine. I'm sick and tired of the stupid claims about how important the 2nd is while the very advocates of it only bring it up to talk about how much they want to shoot democrats.
  - aliasxneo 2mo ago
    There's idiots on all sides. Plenty of sane people who are too busy working and raising families instead of loudly participating in politics that still hold a balanced view on the subject. I can hold the situation you cited as an example that should be shown in training in how not to handle a situation like that while at the same time vehemently pushing back against the bureaucrats trying to disarm me. It's why I've always identified as an independent my whole life.
- BeetleB 2mo ago
  > and, at least for now, still post on social media without getting a knock on my door. That's called "luck". A friend of mine did likewise, and got a knock, then handcuffs, then a trial. He was acquitted because everything he said was allowed under the first amendment. In fact, several academics had published the same/similar stuff he did and not had any problems (or ever worried about them). But he was of the wrong race/religion... There was never a time in the 20th-21st century where you can practice your 1st amendment rights and be absolutely sure you wouldn't get a knock on your door.
  - aliasxneo 2mo ago
    > That's called "luck". I think it's actually called statistics. In 2026, it would seem I'm statistically less likely to get arrested for a social media post in the US than the UK. I mean it's not like the reason is hidden. Arrests typically require crossing into narrow unprotected categories under the First Amendment: true threats (Virginia v. Black standard), incitement to imminent lawless action (Brandenburg v. Ohio), or specific crimes like credible harassment, cyberstalking, or extortion. It's quite a bit different than the UK's hate speech laws and the comparative result makes complete sense.
    - BeetleB 2mo ago
      Luck is statistical :-)
      - aliasxneo 2mo ago
        Then we agree that it's not unreasonable for me to feel confident I am unlikely to get arrested in the US over a social media post than in the UK, which is the whole point I was making all along.
        BeetleB 2mo ago
        For you, yes. But not for some other folks in the US. If you want to invoke statistics, I'm sure 99% of UK citizens are confident they won't get arrested over a social media post either. They probably worry about it a lot less than you would if you moved there.
simplyluke 2mo ago
How many people are arrested for social media posts and other speech in each country?
- kubb 2mo ago
  To be fair the other country routinely deploys military against citizens, and deports non-citizens for speech.
- villish 2mo ago
  A guy was arrested for a joke he posted on social media about Charlie Kirk. He spent some time in jail but ended up winning a lawsuit. So the answer isn't exactly 0 in the US
- foldr 2mo ago
  It's actually quite hard to say, as there are no official figures on arrests specifically for social media posts in either country. And lot of the specific cases that people point to in the UK (e.g. Lucy Connolly) have parallels in the US: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/may/18/facebook-comments-arrest-prosecution https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/may/18/facebook-com... https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cg7pyjxjxrvo https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cg7pyjxjxrvo https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/social-media/federal-agents-monitored-facebook-arrest-protesters-inciting-riots-court-records-n1231531 https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/social-media/federal-agents-mon... (The figures that the American right give for "arrests for social media posts" in the UK are actually figures from certain police forces for arrests under various pieces of online communication legislation, many of which have nothing to do with social media.)
tryauuum 2mo ago
It's hard to compare US and EU internet freedom because a person usually spends most of their life in one place and is clueless about the life in other. I've never lived in US, were there any cases of ISPs blocking websites in USA? Even DNS-level blocking counts
- deleted 2mo ago
  [deleted]
- tryauuum 2mo ago
  come on guys, stop upvoting me and answer the question please
- tasn 2mo ago
  I've lived both in the US and the UK. The US has the 5th amendment protecting you from self-incrimination, while in the UK you can go to prison for not divulging your encryption password (even if you forgot it!). The US doesn't have ISP/DNS level blocking for all I'm aware of, but there's the ultimate blocking that sometimes does happen (FBI raiding your servers, even if outside of the US). The US has the 1st amendment protecting speech, while in the UK people routinely get arrested for social media posts. Maybe there are areas where the UK is better about privacy/freedom than the US, but no examples immediately come to mind.

ajsnigrutin 2mo ago

And then you got the patriot act.

ibejoeb 2mo ago
That was terrible. But then the NSA just started surveilling everything illegally anyway, laws be damned.
- ajsnigrutin 2mo ago
  I was just pointing out that the 4th amendment is not really helping the americans with tyranny and all the related stuff :)